22 Dasher (vs. .22-250) with 40gr NBT for coyotes

[Toby Bradshaw]

I'm putting together a dedicated coyote rifle. Most of my coyotes are called in and shot at 200 yards or less, for which my Rem 700V .222 with 40gr Nosler BTs @ 3600fps has been well suited. However, I get a reasonable number of shots in alfalfa pivots (and other open habitats) where shots of 400-500 yards are offered, usually with no time to use a rangefinder, and the .222 is not enough gun for me in these situations. So, for my dedicated coyote rifle, flat trajectory (maximum point blank range) trumps wind sensitivity, barrel life, recoil, ultimate accuracy, etc.

I've decided on a .224 rather than a .20 caliber, because of better bullet selection for coyote-sized critters in the .224. I generally don't save the pelt, so fur friendliness is not an issue for me, and I don't mind taking a shot at an unfavorable angle as long as I know that the bullet will have enough penetration to get the job done. The 40gr NBT has worked flawlessly for me so far.

I'll go with either a .22-250 with Lapua brass, or a 22 Dasher with the new Norma 6 Dasher brass. I don't want to waste barrel life (and time and components) forming Dasher cases from Lapua BR cases, nor in forming .22-250AI from .22-250. [The really big .22s (.22-243, etc.) don't offer enough extra performance with light bullets to make the cut for me.] The rifle will have an AICS single-stack 5-round magazine, and should feed either the .22-250 or 22 Dasher (with the Primal Rights spacer/follower/spring).

The 22BR load data on this site shows 4100fps with a 40gr NBT, so what can I expect from the Dasher (with a 24" barrel)?

For those of you shooting the 22 Dasher with light bullets, what sort of speed and accuracy are you seeing, and with what powders/loads?

For those of you shooting the .22-250 Lapua brass with 40gr bullets, what sort of speed and accuracy are you seeing, and with what powders/loads? Does the Lapua brass let you run higher pressure than whatever brand of brass you were using before?

 

[boltfluter]

I have several .22 BR rifles shooting a 40 V-max with very good results to about 300 yds give or take. Beyond that they are very hard to get consistent hits or groups. That is when I reach for the 8 twist .22 BR and the 75 A- max
bullet. An absolute killing machine out to at least 550 yds. The absolute best combination I have found for long range coyote sniping. Also works great up close. No coyote will walk away from this combination at any distance that you can place the shot in the boiler room. Happy hunting.

Regards, Paul

www.boltfluting.com

 

[swd]

How about a 22 Creedmoor on the new Lapua brass when it comes out??

 

[snert]

Boltfluter makes a great point. Pushing those longer shots with the 40 grainer may not be the answer. Velocity is not everything. I understand your need for flat. I admit, i have not run the numbers, but intuition and some experience says they may not have the gas "out there" on a dog. I have shot enough coyotes at 450-550 with a 22-250 and 50 grain bullets to know i want more bullet, not less. (Our coyotes here are a tad heftier than some of the western or southern ones)

 

[RussellJ]

Boltfluter makes a great point. Pushing those longer shots with the 40 grainer may not be the answer. Velocity is not everything. I understand your need for flat. I admit, i have not run the numbers, but intuition and some experience says they may not have the gas "out there" on a dog. I have shot enough coyotes at 450-550 with a 22-250 and 50 grain bullets to know i want more bullet, not less. (Our coyotes here are a tad heftier than some of the western or southern ones)

Talk to Adam Bentley, he has a 22 DASHER that shoots the high BC 53gn V-Max bullets at 4000fps in a 8 twist barrel. Same barrel could also shoot the 75gn A-Max bullets as an option.

 

[John Russell]

Boltfluter makes a great point. Pushing those longer shots with the 40 grainer may not be the answer. Velocity is not everything. I understand your need for flat. I admit, i have not run the numbers, but intuition and some experience says they may not have the gas "out there" on a dog. I have shot enough coyotes at 450-550 with a 22-250 and 50 grain bullets to know i want more bullet, not less. (Our coyotes here are a tad heftier than some of the western or southern ones)

What Snert said... At 250-300 yds, the 40gr bullets might do well, but out at 450-600 yds, they will have lost most of what they have. At those ranges, the 50s and 55s will shoot flatter, and hit much harder than the 40s.

 

[Phil]

How about a 22 Creedmoor on the new Lapua brass when it comes out??

Or a .22-243 AI with the 80 Amax.........

Just throwing` it out there....

 

[Alex Wheeler]

6mm dasher, Nosler 55 ballistic tips, .267 bc at 4k fps. Only reason to shoot a .22 is to save pelts, imo.

 

[Yote Hunter]

Anything past 300 yards I found that the 40 grainers kind of fell off considerably. Accuracy, energy, and speed. I would shoot the 75 amax for the 300 yard plus shots for sure. I have shot coyotes with a 22-250 and 75 grain amax at 580 and 629 yards with night vision and both crumpled up on the spot. I have had good hits with 55 gr bullets at 300 plus yards and lost them. The ones recovered the next day were good hits and they acted like they weren't hit. Now I was shooting the Sierra 55 gr Gameking and it seemed to have erratic performance.

 

[AckleymanII]

I saw 40s fail at 275 yards, MV of 3850 fps, and if you hit them behind the diaphragm, they throw a fit spinning, lay down, then may get up and walk off or run off.

45g Sierra spt is a great compromise for a guy that wants to shoot a light bullet, but still light.

The vast majority of coyotes we shot were 125 yds and under, and 65% of those were 85 yards and under.

22/250 Ai with a 12 Twist is my favorite coyote round, 25" bbl. 55's at 4050-4100 and 60g at 3700 just massacres coyotes. A 60g Berger at 3700 blows up coyotes, no kidding. I shot a coyote around 200 yards that was standing behind a bush looking over the top at me. All I had was a head shot. The gun was zero'd at 200, I put the crosshair on his nose. The entire top of the coyotes head blew straight up like a bottle rocket! His jaw only was attached to his neck. My partner said that he saw the eye balls fly in separate directions.

I fireformed my brass killing varmints a lot, and 14g-15g of Bullseye and Cream of wheat will get the job done in spades.

Dasher brass is just too expensive to loose.

I recently had a used 24" BR barrel chambered to 22/243 AI, shot bug holes with the 60g Sierra at 4000 and I expect a 60g V max would saw up a coyote pretty good. The 60 and 64g Bergers are fantastic coyote bullets, you just have to get enough azz behind them to get some flat shooting trajectory.

I shot a bob cat in half while hunting in Mexico. The cat was sitting on a pond dam watching fish, about a 100 yard shot. He was sitting with his back to me, the bullet caught the spine and tore the cat in half. There was a very small piece of hide holding the top and bottom half together, 60g Berger-3700 fps.

toby, if you have a mind set on 40's, then the 223 AI with a 25" barrel will shoot them at 4150 with N133, shooting tiny bug holes. Single stack mags work great for a 223 AI and will use about 10g less powder than the Dasher.

Make the hair fly!!!

Good luck!

 

[Toby Bradshaw]

Thanks for all of the advice and suggestions. I spent a little time with Hornady's ballistic calculator, and the results are shared in the table below (better formatting in the attached Excel spreadsheet).

I did all the comparisons with Nosler Ballistic Tips, because these bullets have worked well for me, and we don't have to worry about differences between bullet companies in how BCs are estimated. MV=muzzle velocity (fps). I used a maximum mid-range trajectory of 1.5", and the zero range (yards) for that mid-range trajectory is in the "Zero" column. Point blank range (PBR in yards) is the range at which the bullet has dropped 6" from the line of sight -- roughly the maximum range that lets you hold on a western coyote's body. "KE@PBR" is the kinetic energy (ft-lbs) remaining at the PBR. Obviously, for longer shots where you might hold over, KE will be dropping (rapidly). The consensus seems to be that 350-400 ft-lbs of energy is in the ballpark for a clean kill with a well-placed shot on a coyote. "Drift" is the 300-yard wind deflection in inches (10mph, full value). Some sample cartridges and the recoil energy (ft-lbs, 10lb rifle) are shown on the right. My current coyote calling rifle, a .222 shooting 40gr NBTs, is highlighted in red.

Draw your own conclusions. I'm going with a 22BR shooting 40gr NBTs at 4100fps, with a Kelbly Atlas Tactical action, CDI/AICS detachable mag with Primal Rights spacer/follower, and Krieger 1-14 twist barrel. It will provide a noticeable upgrade from my Rem 700V .222, hopefully with a recoil level that will still let me see the bullet impact as I can with my .222, and will be good company for my PredatorV 6BR and Panda 30BR. And if I decide to go with a big(ger) boomer, I will have the correct boltface for a switch-barrel Dasher, .22-250AI, .22-243AI, 6x47L, 6-284, etc.

[NB: If I ever rebarrel my .222, it will be to .204 Ruger.]


Cal Bullet G1 BC MV Zero PBR KE Drift Recoil
0.204 32gr NBT 0.206 4200 245 350 426 10.1 20BR 2.18
0.204 32gr NBT 0.206 4000 235 335 399 10.7 204 Ruger 1.83
0.204 32gr NBT 0.206 3800 225 320 370 11.4
0.204 32gr NBT 0.206 3600 215 305 343 12.3

0.204 40gr NBT 0.239 4200 250 360 603 8.5 20 Dasher 3.01
0.204 40gr NBT 0.239 4000 240 340 569 9.0 20BR 2.63
0.204 40gr NBT 0.239 3800 230 330 525 9.6 204 Ruger 2.21
0.204 40gr NBT 0.239 3600 220 315 483 10.2

0.224 40gr NBT 0.221 4200 245 350 569 9.3 22 Dasher 3.01
0.224 40gr NBT 0.221 4000 235 340 525 9.9 22BR 2.63
0.224 40gr NBT 0.221 3800 225 325 491 10.5
0.224 40gr NBT 0.221 3600 215 310 456 11.2 222 Rem 1.83

0.224 50gr NBT 0.238 4200 250 360 751 8.5
0.224 50gr NBT 0.238 4000 240 345 702 9.0 22-250AI 4.11
0.224 50gr NBT 0.238 3800 230 330 652 9.6 22-250 3.54
0.224 50gr NBT 0.238 3600 220 315 602 10.3

0.244 55gr NBT 0.276 4200 255 365 930 7.2
0.244 55gr NBT 0.276 4000 245 350 858 7.6 6 Dasher 3.93
0.244 55gr NBT 0.276 3800 235 340 803 8.1 6BR 3.51
0.244 55gr NBT 0.276 3600 225 325 734 8.6

 

[stacy]

22 DASHER FOR ME

 

[1953greg]

220 swift w/ 60g partitions or 65g gameking.........lights out!!!!!!!

 

[boltfluter]

Toby,

These are my personal experiences based on shooting a .22 BR for at least 15 yrs on coyotes. This is only to help you in your decision and not make the mistakes I have made along the way. The first is I would not put anything but an 8 twist on a .22BR if I were to build another. This gives the option of bullets from 40 to 80 grain. 40's will shoot bungholes at 3900 from my 8 twist BR. Beyond 350 yds the 40's just will not group in my experience and will not have the energy to cleanly drop a coyote. The 75 A-max I have made clean kills out to 550 yds. But you need to dial for this and not hold over. Even dialing, this is a very tough shot to make on a 4" x 6" vital zone. Next is, the hardest case to get to feed on the planet is a .22BR with stubby 40 grain bullets. An absolute bitch. The 40 deg shoulder will make it even harder. You must realize that the Primal Rights kit is designed for a 6 Dasher running 105 gr bullets. My point is the 105 is partially in the chamber when the case clears the magazine. You don't have this with a 40 gr. I have an AI .308 mag sitting on my bench that I modified just like the PR kit. Won't work with the 40 gr and just barely with a 75 A-max hanging way out. This is just to help you out with your decision and not be disappointed in the end. The best mag I have found to make a repeater, and I just found this recently, is an AI poly. 223, 10 round, .223 mag with modified feed lips to let the case sit higher for bolt pick up. This has two things going for it. One is the feed lips are longer so case is held onto longer before release. Second is the fact that it is a single stack mag. Straight shot to the chamber. There you go. You have all the hard earned info I have garnered over the last 15 yrs. of getting a .22BR to feed reliably at any speed of cycling the bolt. Good luck and hope this helps with your decision. Just wanted to give you some idea of what you may come across. Almost forgot, you need to run a Sako extractor or M16 extractor to eject cases correctly from the action.

If I can help in any way feel free to call.

Paul

208-871-7429

www.boltfluting.com

 

[Barlow]

6mm dasher, Nosler 55 ballistic tips, .267 bc at 4k fps. Only reason to shoot a .22 is to save pelts, imo.

Would you care to share your load data? I use a 6 Dasher and 87gr Vmax at 3240 and it works well. Just curious about the lighter weights. Barlow

 

[4xforfun]

I have a 12 twist 6 dasher. I run the 65 Vmax at 3600 with H335. I ran up to well over 3800 with ZERO PSI signs, but it shot itty bitty groups at 3600 and a prarie dog at 400 to 500 doesn't care much about a 7 -8 % velocity increase....but I am sure I will increase BBL life!!!! I also run the 58 Vmax at over 4000. It also shoots the 75's very , very well!!

If I was to build a dedicated yote rig, this would be it!!!

Just my .02,
Tod

 

[boltfluter]

Thanks for all of the advice and suggestions. I spent a little time with Hornady's ballistic calculator, and the results are shared in the table below (better formatting in the attached Excel spreadsheet).

I did all the comparisons with Nosler Ballistic Tips, because these bullets have worked well for me, and we don't have to worry about differences between bullet companies in how BCs are estimated. MV=muzzle velocity (fps). I used a maximum mid-range trajectory of 1.5", and the zero range (yards) for that mid-range trajectory is in the "Zero" column. Point blank range (PBR in yards) is the range at which the bullet has dropped 6" from the line of sight -- roughly the maximum range that lets you hold on a western coyote's body. "KE@PBR" is the kinetic energy (ft-lbs) remaining at the PBR. Obviously, for longer shots where you might hold over, KE will be dropping (rapidly). The consensus seems to be that 350-400 ft-lbs of energy is in the ballpark for a clean kill with a well-placed shot on a coyote. "Drift" is the 300-yard wind deflection in inches (10mph, full value). Some sample cartridges and the recoil energy (ft-lbs, 10lb rifle) are shown on the right. My current coyote calling rifle, a .222 shooting 40gr NBTs, is highlighted in red.

Draw your own conclusions. I'm going with a 22BR shooting 40gr NBTs at 4100fps, with a Kelbly Atlas Tactical action, CDI/AICS detachable mag with Primal Rights spacer/follower, and Krieger 1-14 twist barrel. It will provide a noticeable upgrade from my Rem 700V .222, hopefully with a recoil level that will still let me see the bullet impact as I can with my .222, and will be good company for my PredatorV 6BR and Panda 30BR. And if I decide to go with a big(ger) boomer, I will have the correct boltface for a switch-barrel Dasher, .22-250AI, .22-243AI, 6x47L, 6-284, etc.

[NB: If I ever rebarrel my .222, it will be to .204 Ruger.]


Cal Bullet G1 BC MV Zero PBR KE Drift Recoil
0.204 32gr NBT 0.206 4200 245 350 426 10.1 20BR 2.18
0.204 32gr NBT 0.206 4000 235 335 399 10.7 204 Ruger 1.83
0.204 32gr NBT 0.206 3800 225 320 370 11.4
0.204 32gr NBT 0.206 3600 215 305 343 12.3

0.204 40gr NBT 0.239 4200 250 360 603 8.5 20 Dasher 3.01
0.204 40gr NBT 0.239 4000 240 340 569 9.0 20BR 2.63
0.204 40gr NBT 0.239 3800 230 330 525 9.6 204 Ruger 2.21
0.204 40gr NBT 0.239 3600 220 315 483 10.2

0.224 40gr NBT 0.221 4200 245 350 569 9.3 22 Dasher 3.01
0.224 40gr NBT 0.221 4000 235 340 525 9.9 22BR 2.63
0.224 40gr NBT 0.221 3800 225 325 491 10.5
0.224 40gr NBT 0.221 3600 215 310 456 11.2 222 Rem 1.83

0.224 50gr NBT 0.238 4200 250 360 751 8.5
0.224 50gr NBT 0.238 4000 240 345 702 9.0 22-250AI 4.11
0.224 50gr NBT 0.238 3800 230 330 652 9.6 22-250 3.54
0.224 50gr NBT 0.238 3600 220 315 602 10.3

0.244 55gr NBT 0.276 4200 255 365 930 7.2
0.244 55gr NBT 0.276 4000 245 350 858 7.6 6 Dasher 3.93
0.244 55gr NBT 0.276 3800 235 340 803 8.1 6BR 3.51
0.244 55gr NBT 0.276 3600 225 325 734 8.6

Toby,

Just had a thought today, thinking about this thread. And the lights finally came on. Here you go. The new Bighorn TL-3 action has true controlled round feeding and is available now. What this means for you is that this action will use AI 5 or 10 round mags. So, it will literally carry the shell from magazine to chamber with no issues. Should not matter whether if you are shooting a 40 gr or 80 gr or anything in between. This action is all the rage this year, as many PRS shooters will be shooting 6 Dashers for the first time, for these long range tactical events. I own a TL-2 action and it is awesome. If I were you I would take a hard look at this action as it should all but eliminate any feeding issues that you would have. Plus it is designed for operating in harsh conditions such as you may encounter in winter coyote hunting. I have a buddy that is a dealer for Bighorn actions and he has a very good video of his rifle running a 10 round mg with 6 Dasher ammo . This is the new TL-3 action and he blows through the 10 round mag as fast as he can physically cycle the bolt. Very impressive. I have never seen any action cycle Dasher rounds like this. I can find a link to the video if you are interested in watching it. Just say the word.

Paul

www.boltfluting.com

 

[Toby Bradshaw]

Thanks, Paul. I have a Kelbly Atlas Tactical on the way from Ryan Pierce, and I sent some dummy rounds to Chase Curtis to see if they will feed out of his 3-round flush AICS-compatible magazine, and he told me that they do. I'm not expecting any issues with ejection of the short case since I ordered a TG (mechanical) ejector. We'll see.

A single-shot action would take care of 90% of my calling, but occasionally it's handy to have a few extra rounds on tap.

 

[boltfluter]

Toby,

I just received one of the 3 round mags myself. A very nice product. Looking forward to seeing your rifle and hoping everything goes smoothly for you. Always enjoy your coyote hunting stories and field pics. Keep them coming and Happy Holidays to you and yours. If I can help in any way just give a shout. Happy hunting and good luck.

Regards, Paul

 

[Sniper338]

I run a 22-250AI... when this barrel goes im doing a 22BR. No fire forming, no nada...