I'm taking that problem one in twelve twist muzzle braked wonder out to the Big Range In Pa next week...I'm going to give it another real good cleaning..It fouls some..But throws fliers worse..It has show only some promise, usually like 4 touching & two fliers..& other heartbreak kind of groups...I've never used it hunt with due to my lack of confidance in it..This is the barrel bullet combo that got me interested in using Tungston DiSufide Powder impact plated onto the bullets...The 60gr Hornady V-Max..Anyway, If this last test fails would you guys just scrap the idea of using the 22-250 with that heavier bullet? Or take the next step & have the barrel/twist I prefer made by a good barrel maker & start over again??..I'm very pleased with the 243 win barrel on that action..I have a 20 cal that fills the bill nicely for shots under 400 yds Plus my 6MBR is stil my go to varmint gun...I've hunted with a 22-250 all my life I really hate to let go of this project..But maybe I've outgrown that cartridge..I need to decide how to proceed with this..mike in ct
22-250 problem barrel
- Thread starter mikeinct
- Start date
Mike I had a problem somewhat similar to yours.Two shots touching and 3rd shot out maybe 3/8 to 1/2 of an inch. Always the 3rd shot would open the group up. Then the 4th shot would be back in the first group I knew I was on target when the shot broke. This drove me nuts for at least 6 months. I finally replaced the barrel. Guess what, the new barrel did the same thing. It came to pass that the scope on this rifle was bad, but not very bad, just enough to drive me slightly crazy and ruin my confidence.
Sent the scope back had it repaired and put it back on the gun,now when i do my part there are no unexplained fliers.
I know this is probably not whats going on with you, but you never know.
Sent the scope back had it repaired and put it back on the gun,now when i do my part there are no unexplained fliers.
I know this is probably not whats going on with you, but you never know.
+1 on the scope being not quite stable internally - try one of your other scopes on it.
Secondly, before giving up on this project, why not try lubalox coating instead of moly? Since I seem to be talking Nosler this morning, you can get lubalox in the form of Nosler CT Ballistic Silvertip 55gr,remove the moly coating out of your barrel first). I am primarily doubting the bullet rather than the coating, but you can eliminate fouling without going to moly. Down in the 204R I keep hearing reports of the VMaxes not doing well and I have not yet heard a report in favour of them, and a report on measurement was that the bearing surface area was too variable bullet to bullet. Maybe this variability afflicts some 224 VMaxes as well.
Secondly, before giving up on this project, why not try lubalox coating instead of moly? Since I seem to be talking Nosler this morning, you can get lubalox in the form of Nosler CT Ballistic Silvertip 55gr,remove the moly coating out of your barrel first). I am primarily doubting the bullet rather than the coating, but you can eliminate fouling without going to moly. Down in the 204R I keep hearing reports of the VMaxes not doing well and I have not yet heard a report in favour of them, and a report on measurement was that the bearing surface area was too variable bullet to bullet. Maybe this variability afflicts some 224 VMaxes as well.
AckleymanII
Gold $$ Contributor
Mike, if you are not using a wind flag, the flyers are normal. Very suttle change in wind can cause a bullet to fly out 1/2"-5/8". In the Spring and early Summer, radical wind changes from left to right can cause AT LEAST 5/8" flyers in the most expensive Benchrest Rig!
ARE YOU USING WIND FLAGS?
ARE YOU USING WIND FLAGS?
mikeinct,
Something is definitely wrong and the wind flag recommendation is a place to start. I have a .22-250 A.I. 1-14" Hart that will put five 50 grn. Nosler Ballistic Tips into a tight 3/8" cluster @200 meters when the wind behaves. I just had a 1-12" Pac-Nor Super Match 1-12" chambered in the same cal. to shoot heavier bullets and read your thread with interest. Assuming you use wind flags and are shooting when conditions are right, then you need to start trying to correct the problem one step at a time. The most obvious are bedding, crown, scope, mounts, etc. If the problem still persists after checking all the obvious items, I personally would not waste the time with a 'snake oil' remedy. Get a new barrel properly chambered by a reputable smith and go to town. I am fortunate to live close to Clarence Hammonds and have several rifles put together by him and they have all shot very well from the beginning and given me the confidence needed to fine tune loads. Confidence is a big factor in the accuracy game and if there is always a question mark in your head, you won't be able to make those long shots that we live for.
Chino69
Something is definitely wrong and the wind flag recommendation is a place to start. I have a .22-250 A.I. 1-14" Hart that will put five 50 grn. Nosler Ballistic Tips into a tight 3/8" cluster @200 meters when the wind behaves. I just had a 1-12" Pac-Nor Super Match 1-12" chambered in the same cal. to shoot heavier bullets and read your thread with interest. Assuming you use wind flags and are shooting when conditions are right, then you need to start trying to correct the problem one step at a time. The most obvious are bedding, crown, scope, mounts, etc. If the problem still persists after checking all the obvious items, I personally would not waste the time with a 'snake oil' remedy. Get a new barrel properly chambered by a reputable smith and go to town. I am fortunate to live close to Clarence Hammonds and have several rifles put together by him and they have all shot very well from the beginning and given me the confidence needed to fine tune loads. Confidence is a big factor in the accuracy game and if there is always a question mark in your head, you won't be able to make those long shots that we live for.
Chino69
I swapped off the problem 22-250 barrel & replaced it with the A & B 243 win. varmint taper...The front scope base screws were loose..I can't stand it...All the careful checking & I found the problem swapping barrels...Anyway The 243 barrel shoots ...really shoots very well I got to test drive the 87 gr V-max out to 600yds..The half size steel woodchucks fell over real nice...& I got the scope settings saved in my notebook...I spent two days at the Mcdonald sportsman range in SW pa. then had two days of great groundhog hunting..The wind was fearsome but I still managed to set a personal best achievment..653 plus yds.. The farmers son was looking thru his binocs..I got to see it in my scope ..I use a muzzle brake & recoil reducer on that 243 win..The shooting was fantastic...The Tac 20 got on the varmints to just over 500 yds..The biggest fell to the 40 gr v-max at 463 yds...More later, mike in ct
Attachments
Lots to remember ...Flags Yes, but not enough most likely or the skill to read them....Internal scope troubles have been ruled out that, scope shoots real nice with the A & B barrel...= Adams & Bennett..I'll get some flak for saying this but that brand of barrel has been good to me..I've used two & both can make bullets touch at 100 yds...For the money that barrel is a great value..I have troubles with scope mounts This is the second failure in three years..both on 22-250 heavy barrel rifles..I sold my Winchester model 70 thinking the barrel was shot out..Took off my scope at the gun store to swap on another & found the rear screw had sheared off in the mount...That was the second time I had that happen to leupold mounts...I'm not impressed with any brand of mounting system I've used to date...I've had problems with many[all brand name stuff too..I'm looking at using only one piece bases from now on..I think I read somewhere they are stronger..Those 4 pee wee screws just seem so wimpy...I like the steel Warne bases that are weaver style ..but I'm going to look into any solid steel one piece base to start..mike in ct
mikeinct,
I don't want to sound like an arrogant know it all but I've never had a problem with scopes, rings or mounts. All my bases are two piece bases. My routine for scoping any rifle is as follows. Take a piece of emery cloth and lay it tightly over your receiver. Lap your bases in slightly to fit the contour of your receiver; don't overdue this or else you will change the radius of the base. Check the base contact several times so that there is even contact all the way around. Degrease your base screws and receiver holes with automotive brake cleaner and allow to dry. If it makes you feel better use blue Loctite on the screws and tighten them securely. Install the bottom of your rings to your bases. I prefer Weaver style bases and rings but this applies to all. Lap the bottom half of your rings in with a good concentric lapping bar and lapping compound. When they are completely lapped in, match mark the ears of the lower ring halfs with the ears of the top ring halfs. Lightly tighten the tops of the rings to the bottoms and lap the top halves in; they don't need to be as thorough as the bottom but at least 50%. Now take everything apart and clean all lapping compound off the bottom and tops of the rings with brake cleaner. Clean the screw holes in the rings and the screws and the lapping bar. Now that the rings are lapped and degreased, lay a piece of 1/2" or wider masking tape,sticky side down) into the bottom half of front and rear rings. Put the lapping bar back in the rings and using a small X-Acto blade trim all of the excess masking tape from around the edges of the rings. You now have a perfect anti slip cushion that will prevent any scope ring marks. Place the top rings on and tighten them down on the lapping bar securely. This will help to pre-form your rings to the perfect shape of the lapping bar prior to mounting your scope. Remove the tops of the rings, install scope, set eye relief and level crosshairs. Now place a small dab of Ultra Blue gasket maker in the middle of each matchmarked top ring. Slowly tighten the top rings securely. That's how I mount my scopes and have never had a problem.
Chino69
I don't want to sound like an arrogant know it all but I've never had a problem with scopes, rings or mounts. All my bases are two piece bases. My routine for scoping any rifle is as follows. Take a piece of emery cloth and lay it tightly over your receiver. Lap your bases in slightly to fit the contour of your receiver; don't overdue this or else you will change the radius of the base. Check the base contact several times so that there is even contact all the way around. Degrease your base screws and receiver holes with automotive brake cleaner and allow to dry. If it makes you feel better use blue Loctite on the screws and tighten them securely. Install the bottom of your rings to your bases. I prefer Weaver style bases and rings but this applies to all. Lap the bottom half of your rings in with a good concentric lapping bar and lapping compound. When they are completely lapped in, match mark the ears of the lower ring halfs with the ears of the top ring halfs. Lightly tighten the tops of the rings to the bottoms and lap the top halves in; they don't need to be as thorough as the bottom but at least 50%. Now take everything apart and clean all lapping compound off the bottom and tops of the rings with brake cleaner. Clean the screw holes in the rings and the screws and the lapping bar. Now that the rings are lapped and degreased, lay a piece of 1/2" or wider masking tape,sticky side down) into the bottom half of front and rear rings. Put the lapping bar back in the rings and using a small X-Acto blade trim all of the excess masking tape from around the edges of the rings. You now have a perfect anti slip cushion that will prevent any scope ring marks. Place the top rings on and tighten them down on the lapping bar securely. This will help to pre-form your rings to the perfect shape of the lapping bar prior to mounting your scope. Remove the tops of the rings, install scope, set eye relief and level crosshairs. Now place a small dab of Ultra Blue gasket maker in the middle of each matchmarked top ring. Slowly tighten the top rings securely. That's how I mount my scopes and have never had a problem.
Chino69
mikeinct said:
mikeinct,
You are welcome; glad to pass on some useful info. When you lap the bases in to fit the receiver, as mentioned, don't overdo it. I've used Prussian Blue, in the past, to determine how much contact the bases have with the receiver as it doesn't have to be 100%. Prussian Blue is used to determine fit or contact between two pieces of steel. I'm a big proponent of doing things right the first time and then never having to worry about them. I work in the nuclear industry and everything we do is done to the nth degree and it carries over to everything I do in my shooting ventures as well as home maintenance.
Chino69
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