2000 yard practice groups
- Thread starter ttfreestyle
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I will be very pleased if I can pull off 15 inches at 2k. And I’m not shooting a dasher
Do flyers count, lol. I got 3 into 6" at 2050Y once but 1 went 15" lower.
That was with 350 gr Hooker tactical solids out of a 375CT at 3160 fps.`
The guy shooting his 50 with 750 Amax couldn't hit the same plate for some reason??? His load was going 2650 fps.
ttfreestyle
Silver $$ Contributor
Ledd Slinger
Silver $$ Contributor
Depending on the weather conditions, any group of 5 shots that all land on the paper might win a relay. If you watch the videos of these guys shooting a mile or more (1760+), one little suprise gust of wind or bad call in a known wind value and the shot can fly off a 48" wide target by many feet. Any inconsistencies in loads and shooting form are greatly amplified as well, especially if you are not accustomed to shooting prone from a bipod. Harder to rattle off the shots like you can from a bench to get them all in the same wind value because you have to recover the POA on target after each shot.
I'm sure any experienced F-class guys will hold an advantage on aggregate in this competition as they are used to taking slower methodical shots from the prone position while making accurate varying wind calls with each round downrange.
It will probably very humbling for most of us, but very fun and educational at the same time
I'm sure any experienced F-class guys will hold an advantage on aggregate in this competition as they are used to taking slower methodical shots from the prone position while making accurate varying wind calls with each round downrange.
It will probably very humbling for most of us, but very fun and educational at the same time
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Ledd Slinger
Silver $$ Contributor
Here's a good video from Brian Litz I use for finding scope adjustment correction factors on different rifles and optics. Highly recommend performing this short range tall target work before taking a rifle out for the long bombs at ELR. Will help you get on target much faster and more accurately.
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With all this talk, I had to shoot my 6XC at 1850 & 2075. It shoots a 110 Sierra at 3105 fps, 8 twist barrel. The bullet was still stable at 1850, but by the time it got to 2075 the bullet had to have been tumbling. I'll estimate my group size at 60 feet or so. I'm having a 2nd XC built right now with a 7.5tw barrel, but wishing it was a 7tw now for a better test.
I think my up dope was around 74moa with a DA of 6900, I had the scope travel. After 2 shots, it became apparent chasing a miss was futile, lol
I think my up dope was around 74moa with a DA of 6900, I had the scope travel. After 2 shots, it became apparent chasing a miss was futile, lol
dcali
Bullet Maker
You might try a different bullet. Sounds like it could be a case of dynamic instability. Maybe a 107 or 105 would fare better.
I could I suppose, but I'm not going to take a 6mm too serious at 2K.
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dcali
Bullet Maker
Still fun to try
Ledd Slinger
Silver $$ Contributor
I tried a 204 Ruger at 1K with 39gr Sierra BKs at 4050 fps. Looked like it would work on a calculator. Didnt work on paper. Bullets started tumbling somewhere between 800 and 1K. Shoot good at 700 and 800.
Depart123
At last outing with my 338AX, I was shooting at a 24" gong hung on a hillside at 2,384 yards. The wind was 3-4 mph right to left. I hit the gong twice, put 3 shots of the edge of the plate. Then the wind picked up a tick, and 3 shots .7 mils left and 2 shots 1 MIL left.
Alex Wheeler
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Well @ttfreestyle may be hard to beat if his edge keeps shooting like it has...
6MMsteve
Gold $$ Contributor
How are you guys going to get on paper, how will you spot, does the target area have a large clean area in front of the target to see bullet impacts, kind of a stupid question but I was just wondering, some people that have never shot that far may have a hard time, but it's a learning experience which I think will catch on pretty good hope it takes off and becomes a winner. I can't wait to just read the results, I hope someone does a lot a videos or catches it all in a video
ttfreestyle
Silver $$ Contributor
Oooo I dunno about that, 18 rounds on this gun and one lucky group. I may be a “Harry”.
But I am liking the new gun a lot!
I thought I read somewhere that they were going to use a camera. A good spotting scope and spotter should be able to see the wash and impacts, especially if they are directly behind the shooter. Matt
Torge
Gold $$ Contributor
There will be enough people there to help spot.
At Deep Creek we work together on that as the sun comes up over the hill behind the targets and if damp it is just about impossible to see impacts at that time. At times guys will shoot hunting/tactical rifles and we will spot for each other.
Last fall Leo spotted for me when I was testing my 28 Nosler (195gr 3100 fps+) at 1000 yards and it is under 10 lbs with bi-pod. I had no chance without him, the bullet hits before the recoil is over. I have used a phone adapter with my spotting scope and it works well. Both the trail and impact show up well at 1000 yards.
David
At Deep Creek we work together on that as the sun comes up over the hill behind the targets and if damp it is just about impossible to see impacts at that time. At times guys will shoot hunting/tactical rifles and we will spot for each other.
Last fall Leo spotted for me when I was testing my 28 Nosler (195gr 3100 fps+) at 1000 yards and it is under 10 lbs with bi-pod. I had no chance without him, the bullet hits before the recoil is over. I have used a phone adapter with my spotting scope and it works well. Both the trail and impact show up well at 1000 yards.
David
ttfreestyle
Silver $$ Contributor
I will have a bullseye camera with me to use as well. It saves us a lot of driving at our range.
Ledd Slinger
Silver $$ Contributor
I bought the Caldwell LR Camera system because Midway had a big sale on them. Good reviews on the unit, but I haven't even taken it out of the case yet.
Figure if I cant get it to work for 2K, I can use for those little chip shots at 1K
Figure if I cant get it to work for 2K, I can use for those little chip shots at 1K
1900-2050 yard 5 shot groups –40”+ the majority of the time with an occasional 30”-40” during good wind conditions and less than 30” in stable conditions. I shoot not too far from where the MT match will be held.
Before conducting LR and ELR drop validation, a ten shot group was fired with a tactical 338 LM shooting 300 gr bullets to determine precision potential. For long range work, 300 to 400 yards is a reasonable range to estimate rifle/ammo mechanical precision. A ten shot 100 yard group can mask the signs of dispersion problems such as high velocity variation. The 10 shots were divided into two 5 shot strings aimed for the center of an 8” gong additionally to note potential POI shift from cold bore. No POI shift was noted along with single digit velocity SD. The rifle displayed one half MOA precision potential. All ten shots would have been taken cold bore at 400 yards to estimate hunter class precision however, this rifle will not be used for hunting or entered into this class.
The area where I practice is often windy, not in terms of high wind velocity but in determining uncertainty as related to a condition. The winds can quickly change 4-8 MPH in velocity and 2-4 hours in direction. This makes shooting groups difficult. Not catching the changes can easily send the shot one minute or more out a side. Make a quick holdover correction and the next shot often lands one minute or more out the same side. Within a fraction of a few seconds the group is already 2 MOA. In one day, wind conditions changed in a short enough period to alter a previous group with 20” of spread to over 80” on another group. With the same rifle, same shooting fundamentals, same shooter and roughly the same environmental conditions other than wind, group sizes and hit probability varies drastically. The half MOA rifle often shoots 2+ MOA groups the majority of the time at a mile plus. As of yet for the area, I haven’t found an easy remedy with predicting Mother Nature’s sneezing throughout the day. With three seconds time of flight, this randomness alters the ability to estimate group size and hit probability to that of mere guesswork against IPSC sized and smaller targets. For flight time comparison, the best group to date with a 338 LM (although only three shots) measured 1.9” landing 7” inches from center at over 1200 yards, a universe in difference away in comparison to 2k.
Hitting an IPSC target or smaller at 2K is not difficult while spotting the shots and making corrections until the target is hit. Difficulty comes with making consistent first round shots to include consistency with the follow on shots. The sighting in period in MT will be a benefit before making the first shot for record. A three second time of flight is an ideal time to recover from recoil dead-space, which is the minimum time necessary to reset rifle sights back on target after being jumped off target due to the recoil and self-spot impacts, without the need of assistance from others. Although there will be more than enough assistance available to spot impacts, some may prefer to take individual ownership of results to include the sighting in period before converting to the first shot for record.
Before conducting LR and ELR drop validation, a ten shot group was fired with a tactical 338 LM shooting 300 gr bullets to determine precision potential. For long range work, 300 to 400 yards is a reasonable range to estimate rifle/ammo mechanical precision. A ten shot 100 yard group can mask the signs of dispersion problems such as high velocity variation. The 10 shots were divided into two 5 shot strings aimed for the center of an 8” gong additionally to note potential POI shift from cold bore. No POI shift was noted along with single digit velocity SD. The rifle displayed one half MOA precision potential. All ten shots would have been taken cold bore at 400 yards to estimate hunter class precision however, this rifle will not be used for hunting or entered into this class.
The area where I practice is often windy, not in terms of high wind velocity but in determining uncertainty as related to a condition. The winds can quickly change 4-8 MPH in velocity and 2-4 hours in direction. This makes shooting groups difficult. Not catching the changes can easily send the shot one minute or more out a side. Make a quick holdover correction and the next shot often lands one minute or more out the same side. Within a fraction of a few seconds the group is already 2 MOA. In one day, wind conditions changed in a short enough period to alter a previous group with 20” of spread to over 80” on another group. With the same rifle, same shooting fundamentals, same shooter and roughly the same environmental conditions other than wind, group sizes and hit probability varies drastically. The half MOA rifle often shoots 2+ MOA groups the majority of the time at a mile plus. As of yet for the area, I haven’t found an easy remedy with predicting Mother Nature’s sneezing throughout the day. With three seconds time of flight, this randomness alters the ability to estimate group size and hit probability to that of mere guesswork against IPSC sized and smaller targets. For flight time comparison, the best group to date with a 338 LM (although only three shots) measured 1.9” landing 7” inches from center at over 1200 yards, a universe in difference away in comparison to 2k.
Hitting an IPSC target or smaller at 2K is not difficult while spotting the shots and making corrections until the target is hit. Difficulty comes with making consistent first round shots to include consistency with the follow on shots. The sighting in period in MT will be a benefit before making the first shot for record. A three second time of flight is an ideal time to recover from recoil dead-space, which is the minimum time necessary to reset rifle sights back on target after being jumped off target due to the recoil and self-spot impacts, without the need of assistance from others. Although there will be more than enough assistance available to spot impacts, some may prefer to take individual ownership of results to include the sighting in period before converting to the first shot for record.
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