20 year old powder?

[LA50SHOOTER]

I am using up the remains of an 8# jug of Varget that is about 20 years. It has been stored in my basement and not opened for maybe 15 of those 20 years. I am using it in both 308 Win 185 VLD and 223 both 69 & 80 SMK. I have chrono'd them and can't see any issues.

Varget (under Hodgdon name) wasn't around 20 years ago. -

 

[Macropod]

If the powder looks or smells defective I wouldn't use it.

If unusable, it does a reasonable job as nitrogenous lawn fertilizer.

 

[bobm]

This reply is from experience. Bad or degraded propellant will have a chlorine like smell from nitric acids present. There will be a rusty red vapor or dust when pouring some out. Twenty years ago the metal cans were mostly phased out for plastic. There were still metal cans on dealer shelves. The can, if yours, may have penetrating rust through. Plastic containers subjected to nitric fumes will become brittle. If the sniff test burns your nose, it is bad. If you smell ether without the irritation it is probably good.

 

[bobm]

Varget (under Hodgdon name) wasn't around 20 years ago. -

In 1994 a gun writer gave me 2lbs. of powder in a brown paper bag. I was told to use H4895 load data when testing it in my guns that used that powder and report back to him my findings. One year later a case of labeled one pound bottles showed up at the shop. Hodgdon Varget in 1996.

 

[snert]

I am still shooting some 3031 that was bought for 19 cents a pound....

I am a cheap stinker!

 

[jds holler]

Heck, I've got lots of ancient powder, and the ancient books with ancient load charts in them. Several of my one pound cans have price tags of less than two bucks on them. I've got old surplus 4895 that has been stored in old steel Wesson Oil cans that are probably collectable in their own right. The powder still looks, smells, and works fine.

After going through weird times when powder was scarce and priced sky high, I don't see myself getting rid of any of it except through the barrel of one of my ancient old rifles or pistols. jd

 

[jds holler]

Here's a few oldies but goodies. jd

 

[KevinThomas]

This reply is from experience. Bad or degraded propellant will have a chlorine like smell from nitric acids present. There will be a rusty red vapor or dust when pouring some out. Twenty years ago the metal cans were mostly phased out for plastic. There were still metal cans on dealer shelves. The can, if yours, may have penetrating rust through. Plastic containers subjected to nitric fumes will become brittle. If the sniff test burns your nose, it is bad. If you smell ether without the irritation it is probably good.

Perfect description. And once you’ve seen/smelled it, there’s no mistaking it from that point forward. Very unpleasant, and very easily discerned from the normal, even pleasant ether smell we associate with good powder.

 

[GotRDid]

Here's a few oldies but goodies. jd
View attachment 1074047

I have about 2/3 rds of a 5 lb steel container of #2400 like your Red Dot. It still smells “delicious” and has been the best performer for Cast G/C Boolits in my .44 Mag revolvers, and Contender.
Not sure of the vintage, but was in my Mentor’s climate controlled shop since he bought it. He gave it to me in 2000.
GotRDid.

 

[MGYSGT]

All I know, is that you can buy mil surplus made in the 60's and 70's that is still good and that is ammo made in other countries.

 

[okie]

Varget (under Hodgdon name) wasn't around 20 years ago. -

I think you lost track of time...??

 

[expiper]

I went thru the mess in the 80's-90's with GI-322 going bad and eating thru the lids of the cans,,,grrrrr,,,the smell is unforgettable !!!!,,,,,every brand (Hodgdon-Hercules/Alliant-vitarouri-etc),,uses a little different perservative with a unique odor,,,if it doesnt smell sweet/good and has 'red dust' in it IT IS BAD !!!....I have powder that I use frequently that I bought in the 60's (made in early 50's) that works perfectly and has no sign or deteriotion,,,,keep it in a comfy place and it will last hundreds of years....Roger

 

[JRS]

The history of Hodgdon shows Varget coming to the market in 1996.

 

[bloc]

From SAAMI: https://saami.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/Info-Doc-Smokeless-Powder.pdf

"HOW TO CHECK SMOKELESS POWDER FOR DETERIORATION

"Although modern smokeless powders contain stabilizers and are basically free from deterioration under proper storage conditions, safe practices require a recognition of the signs of deterioration and its possible effects.

"Deteriorating smokeless powders produce an acidic odor and may produce a reddish brown fume. (Don’t confuse this with common solvent odors such as alcohol, ether and acetone.) Dispose of dete- riorating smokeless powders immediately.

"Check to make certain that smokeless powder is not exposed to extreme heat as this may cause deterioration. Such exposure pro- duces an acidity which accelerates further reaction and has been known, because of heat generated by the reaction, to cause sponta- neous combustion.

"Never salvage powder from old cartridges and do not attempt to blend salvaged powder with new powder or attempt to blend two types of powder to make a “custom” blend. Don’t accumulate old powder stocks."

[ . . . ]

There's more at the link and it's worth reading (especially storage conditions).

 

[Webster]

mainly IMR it all smells funny, how Will it look if it is bad?

If it smells bad consider it deteriated. Red dust is also an indicator.

 

[justinp61]

When I bought my 260 about five years ago i also bought all my buddies 260 reloading stuff, dies brass and about half a pound of H4350. He bought it when the 260 first came out however many years ago that was. I haven't used any yet as the new bottles I bought the powder has a green cast to it. The old bottle is a graphite grey color and doesn't have any strange smells, it was stored in his temperature controlled basement I loaded up 20 rounds last night for new barrel break in on the 260 and started to use the old powder but used the new stuff instead.

 

[wkdickinson]

The history of Hodgdon shows Varget coming to the market in 1996.

Thanks

 

[beemanjohn]

My father passed away 15 years ago. Just this week my 90 year old mother ask me to come over and clean out all of his reloading stuff. I found a can (plastic bottle) of 414 That smelled like a bottle of acid! I put a huge label on it and am going to let my grandsons smell it before I use it for plant food, just so they will know what bad powder smells like.

 

[Twicepop]

I've seen 40 year old IMR-4895 that has shot fine. - It was stored in a consistent 64-68 degree temp.

About 18-20 years back I purchased an 8 pound can of IMR 4895 at Camp Perry. It was Vietnam era mil-surp powder, I'm still using it in a .223 bolt gun. At 24.5 grains at a time, it takes a long time to use it up.

 

[hillbillydruggist]

If it was bad, would it be dangerous?