20 VarTarg Brass

[Reloading Bum]

Rick….. Lapua brass out of the blue box and run thru my Redding 20VT standard die did not fit my Cooper rifle. Too tight

As Gene said my bet unless Cooper changed there rifles were chambered with .232 necks.
Lots of reports of clickers with Lapua brass if you dont have chambers bigger at the .200 line.

Thank you Gene appreciate you sharing your knowledge. Since I bought a few hundred of the Lapua brass I'd like to make them work.

 

[chuckshooter]

Thank you for replying, appreciate it. Which dies are you using? I have the REDDING 80636 .

(from my notes, not my memory, it's been 6 years since I formed any vartarg)
For my cooper, I used hornady dies, for my rem 40x and the others, I used redding 77636, full length bushing dies with a 227 bushing. one of my vartarg uses 223 brass formed down to 221 fireball first and then to vartarg. I can't tell any difference in performance, just more work.
I think, like most folks on this forum, my knowledge, skill and process changed as I learned more and I learned a lot more with all the information and postings on this forum from other members. absolutely the best forum

 

[Reloading Bum]

(from my notes, not my memory, it's been 6 years since I formed any vartarg)
For my cooper, I used hornady dies, for my rem 40x and the others, I used redding 77636, full length bushing dies with a 227 bushing. one of my vartarg uses 223 brass formed down to 221 fireball first and then to vartarg. I can't tell any difference in performance, just more work.
I think, like most folks on this forum, my knowledge, skill and process changed as I learned more and I learned a lot more with all the information and postings on this forum from other members. absolutely the best forum

Thank you!

 

[NorCalMikie]

I think, like most folks on this forum, my knowledge, skill and process changed as I learned more and I learned a lot more with all the information and postings on this forum from other members. absolutely the best forum

And just when I was thinking I knew everything, somebody comes up with something I didn't know. Most of the time, experience IS the best teacher, if it doesn't kill you.

 

[Reloading Bum]

And just when I was thinking I knew everything, somebody comes up with something I didn't know. Most of the time, experience IS the best teacher, if it doesn't kill you.

Ya, no doubt, I've burned up a Sat. / Sun or two and just spun my wheels wondering what I had gotten myself into a few times, but it's definitely worth it for me. If it were easier I likely wouldn't enjoy it as much. Some may get that, some maybe not?

 

[NorCalMikie]

Something about old dogs and new tricks keeps coming to mind.
I'am always open to learning something new OR, just another way of doing it.

 

[Reloading Bum]

I received some brand new, Lapua .221 Fireball brass. The necks need to be turned.

I reached out to Cooper Firearms and discussed the Lapua Brass, they also confirmed that I need to turn the necks. I bought a bit of brass, so I'll be picking up a neck-turner.

I asked Sierra if they could send me the reloading data sheet for the 20 VarTarg, so figured I'd share for anyone that's interested.

Reloading Bum

 

[GAnderson]

I received some brand new, Lapua .221 Fireball brass. The necks need to be turned.

I reached out to Cooper Firearms and discussed the Lapua Brass, they also confirmed that I need to turn the necks. I bought a bit of brass, so I'll be picking up a neck-turner.

I asked Sierra if they could send me the reloading data sheet for the 20 VarTarg, so figured I'd share for anyone that's interested.

Reloading Bum

Thanks for the reloading info...one powder that I didn't see on their list was A2200...if you come across some, you need to try it. It really does the 20VT justice...but there are several real good powders on the list that will serve you just as well.
Did Cooper say anything about the chamber at the .200 datum line with Lapua brass?
Neck turning isn't a big deal...once you have your amount of brass necked turned, you shouldn't have to worry about it for a long time...the 20VT is not rough on brass, so it should last awhile.

Gene

 

[L.Sherm]

I'd be curious to know what Cooper says also about the .200 line on there reamer, most reamers i know that have a .232 neck are set up for Rem 221 fireball brass

 

[NorCalMikie]

The reason I went with the .234 neck reamer was because the Remington .221 Fireball brass necks were all over the place. New, pretty even but needed turning if you were going to use it. Once fired ALL OVER THE PLACE!!
Not into neck turning at that time but finally decided I needed to get the tools and JUST DO IT!!
Turned out NOT to be as bad as I had made it out to be. The .234 neck reamer sure took out all the guess work as far as neck sizes. Put that reamer up for sale and sold it in NOTHING FLAT!!

I'd be curious to know what Cooper says also about the .200 line on there reamer, most reamers i know that have a .232 neck are set up for Rem 221 fireball brass

Could be that a "neck only reamer" could open up an existing tight neck to make things easier?? Sure would cut down on the neck turning thing.

 

[Evan]

Hi All,

Proud owner of a new Cooper Firearms M21 Varminter Phoenix 20 VT and I'm looking at the brass options, the Lapua .221 Fireball seems to make sense. Aside from running the brass through a FL Die is there anything more required?

According to this article 20VT it's a matter of running the Lapua .221 Fireball brass through a FL sizing die, but my gut tells me there's something more.

I also read this (From 2006)and it seems like there's some additional work required?

I ordered some of the Lapua brass but would like to hear from others that have gone this route.

Thanks,

Reloading Bum

It's that simple. If you have the rifle, strip the bolt of firing pin assembly and ejector. Neck the brass down and bump the shoulder until the bolt just closes on the brass with a light resistance. It'll give you a perfect fit with minimal stretching on the first firing.

You might like my log on my 20 Vartarg, although I focused on the 55gn Berger: https://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/my-20-vartarg-custom.3969176/
and some loads I worked up:

My 20 Vartarg custom

Jerry and I were out shooting last weekend and I snapped a picture of my 20 Vartarg with the 55gn Bergers next to his 300 Norma Mag with the big Bergers. Thought everyone here might get a kick out of the difference! Once weather gets a bit better and I can verify, I'll have some more load info...

forum.accurateshooter.com

 

[L.Sherm]

The reason I went with the .234 neck reamer was because the Remington .221 Fireball brass necks were all over the place. New, pretty even but needed turning if you were going to use it. Once fired ALL OVER THE PLACE!!
Not into neck turning at that time but finally decided I needed to get the tools and JUST DO IT!!
Turned out NOT to be as bad as I had made it out to be. The .234 neck reamer sure took out all the guess work as far as neck sizes. Put that reamer up for sale and sold it in NOTHING FLAT!!

Could be that a "neck only reamer" could open up an existing tight neck to make things easier?? Sure would cut down on the neck turning thing.

Its not just the neck, its the .200 line size on Lapua vrs Rem fireball brass.

 

[Reloading Bum]

I use Nosler 221 Fireball brass for both of my 20VT’s. So far they have held up very wel

I use Nosler 221 Fireball brass for both of my 20VT’s. So far they have held up very well.

An interesting discovery that I've made. In my Cooper Firearms M21 Phoenix I have to use a Full Bushing Die 36636 and the 225 bushing in order to get the Lapua brass to work. Using a REDDING Full Length die 80636 does not work. Do you have to use the Full Bushing Die with the Nosler Brass or will the REDDING 80636 die work? Otherwise I think I'm going to have to try Todd Kindler's Woodchuckden site and see what he has available.

Thanks,
ReloadingBum

​

 

[22vartarg]

An interesting discovery that I've made. In my Cooper Firearms M21 Phoenix I have to use a Full Bushing Die 36636 and the 225 bushing in order to get the Lapua brass to work. Using a REDDING Full Length bushing die 80636 does not work. Do you have to use the Full Bushing Die with the Nosler Brass or will the REDDING 80636 die work? Otherwise I think I'm going to have to Todd Kindler's Woodchuckden site and see what he has available.

Thanks,
ReloadingBum

​

I use a standard FL Redding non-bushing die with the Nosler 221 fireball brass. Add a little Imperial Sizing Wax and a single pass through the die. Works like a charm.

 

[Reloading Bum]

I use a standard FL Redding non-bushing die with the Nosler 221 fireball brass. Add a little Imperial Sizing Wax and a single pass through the die. Works like a charm.

Thank you.

 

[L.Sherm]

A .225 bushing on Lapua brass seems awful small.

 

[Reloading Bum]

A .225 bushing on Lapua brass seems awful small.

It does work.

 

[Reloading Bum]

I tried the Nosler .221 Fireball Brass using the REDDING 80636, no luck. I had to resort to the REDDING FL Bushing Die 36636 in order to make it work. Unfortunately, the 36636 die is on loan and I will need to ship it back to the owner. The only brass that I was able to use the REDDING 80636 FL (non Bushing) die is the Remington Manufactured .221 Fireball brass. I called the Woodchucken Den to see if they had a 36636 and was told that they're still on back order.

 

[L.Sherm]

It does work.

Its not over working the necks? All the Lapua brass ive messed with ended up at .231- .232 loaded round for the 20 VT.

 

[457ciSBC]

Its not over working the necks? All the Lapua brass ive messed with ended up at .231- .232 loaded round for the 20 VT.

IHMO, relying on a .225 neck bushing to provide enough radial clearance so the round chambers is not ideal, not to mention the amount of bullet tension. It seems it me that it bullet core might would become distorted with the jacket.