I am looking for some of you guys that have some real world experience using "Lil Gun" for powder for reloading in 17 Hornet. I just picked some up tonight and plan on loading up some test loads this weekend to try out. Thanks in advance for any/all responses.
17 Hornet reloading with Lil Gun
- Thread starter IA_shooter
- Start date
swd said:
17 Hornady Hornet. I have a CZ Varmint in 17 Hornet. I've seen that 9.5 to 10 gr of Lil Gun seems to be the area that has worked best but was just looking to see if any of you guys have any personal info/experience with it.
My 527 only liked one powder. VV 110 @ 10.3 gr behind a 20 gr VMAX and Fed 205 M. 21.6" barrel @ 3650 fps. Shot 2.5" @ 300 yards. 3 shots.
searcher
Gold $$ Contributor
I have a CZ that I had rebarreled with a 24" Lilja tube in .17 Hornady Hornet. It liked Lil Gun o.K. at 9.8 grains and a moly-coated 20-gr. V-Max using CCI 400 primers. The lower settings were just fair, with the manual-suggested starting load (around 9.2?) created very bad fouling. Sorry, as I had much better loads with other powders, I didn't get a chance to run over the chrono.
One of the reasons I did not try to fine tune it was also because of the high chamber pressures it produces versus the other powders (such as H4188 and IMR 4227). I turn my necks and want my brass to last a long time. here are a few loads that are "one ragged holers" in case you have or run across these powders. You might want to work up to these if you do:
Berger 25 bullet, 10.8 H4198 CCI400, Hornady brass, 3,136 f.p.s.
20 V-Max, 11.5 H4198, CCI400, Hornady brass, 3,389 f.p.s
20 V-Max, 9.3 IMR 4227, CCI400, Hornady brass, 3,175 f.p.s.
You should get decent results with the Little Gun - but I'd not stop there unless you really like what you have - if for no other reason than the chamber pressure.
One of the reasons I did not try to fine tune it was also because of the high chamber pressures it produces versus the other powders (such as H4188 and IMR 4227). I turn my necks and want my brass to last a long time. here are a few loads that are "one ragged holers" in case you have or run across these powders. You might want to work up to these if you do:
Berger 25 bullet, 10.8 H4198 CCI400, Hornady brass, 3,136 f.p.s.
20 V-Max, 11.5 H4198, CCI400, Hornady brass, 3,389 f.p.s
20 V-Max, 9.3 IMR 4227, CCI400, Hornady brass, 3,175 f.p.s.
You should get decent results with the Little Gun - but I'd not stop there unless you really like what you have - if for no other reason than the chamber pressure.
IA_shooter said:
I use it in my 17 (Hornady) Hornet Savage Model 25 with 20grain Berger and Horady VMAX. I find it pretty good but you need to be careful with the loads: it's quite "static'y" and it's quite sensitive to load. So, I keep increments small and weigh each charge with it. I have noticed charge variation due to the staic charge effects with powder sticking and dumping.
So, load levels... I've found that with my rifle lower than the minimum works best ~8.9grains but that higher is ok. 8.9grains in my rifle gives about 3336fps, 25fps SD for five rounds.
I've also found that the round is quite sensitive to OAL and that mine likes VMAX about 1.750" BUT THAT'S CLEARLY FIREARM DEPENDENT.
Also look at:
http://www.saubier.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=1
Attachments
Family problem has kept me from shooting and forums for 6 months. I tried Lil Gun in my new CZ527. 3, 5 shot groups @ 100 yds. 10.0 grains - .6" with one flier; 10.2 grains - .5"; 10.4 grains - .8". 10.2 is the accurate load. Did not measure velocity for reason below.
A friend who is a VERY active varmint shooter and VERY knowledgeable had lil gun carbon foul his 17 Hornet CZ527 to a smooth bore and he was unable to remove it. This was after 500 rounds on an Oregon shoot. Wrote off the barrel. I used his experience and stopped using Lil Gun. Working with other powders now. Same friend is now using N120 and found no fouling after 700 rounds on last hunt.
If anyone has similar experience or contradictory experience let me know.
A friend who is a VERY active varmint shooter and VERY knowledgeable had lil gun carbon foul his 17 Hornet CZ527 to a smooth bore and he was unable to remove it. This was after 500 rounds on an Oregon shoot. Wrote off the barrel. I used his experience and stopped using Lil Gun. Working with other powders now. Same friend is now using N120 and found no fouling after 700 rounds on last hunt.
If anyone has similar experience or contradictory experience let me know.
TheOtherZilla
Pull my finger
CZ 17 Hornet here. A1680 works best for me. I tried Lil Gun. I have the CZ Varmint.
Lil Gun works good in Hornet cases. I personally had better luck with 2400. Not sure what type of primers you're using, just remember you may have to use a small 'rifle' primer when pushing speeds. If using small pistol primers you will likely start piercing them due to the thinner cup. SP wont handle the pressures. If already using SR primers then there's nothing to worry about.
I'm glad this post got revived as I had traded off my CZ 527 Varmint in 17 Hornet last year towards a bass boat purchase and I missed it so much I am picking up another new one this weekend. I still have 200 rounds of hand loads using 20gr V-Max with 9.8gr of LilGun from when I had my last CZ and will see how they shoot out of the new gun but if they don't shoot well enough I'll just pull the bullets and start fresh trying to figure out a load. I want to use a different powder than LilGun this time around and I'm looking for recommendations on which powder to use. I see a couple recommendations above in previous responses but hope to see a few more responses before I make a decision on which powder I'll be trying/using this time around. Thanks.
snert
Silver $$ Contributor
Lots of people rave about the lilgun velocities. I was given a very scientific but non-published paper that studied lilgun and its pressure characteristics in a small caliber application. (at this point a bunch of people are saying "if you have it post it otherwise it is crap") but I am not posting it as it wasn't given to me as something to publish, rather it was given as a thinking man's study and it was left for me to interpret and apply.
When I was done, and compared it to my results at the bench, the range, the press and the field, I stopped using Lilgun and went to 1680.
Just too many spikes, too erratic, too many primer pocket issues. There simply is no free lunch.
I decided if I wanted hornet velocity, I shot a hornet. If I wanted FB velocity, I shot FB. I went back to subscribing to the late Don Lewis' mantra...accuracy before velocity.
When I was done, and compared it to my results at the bench, the range, the press and the field, I stopped using Lilgun and went to 1680.
Just too many spikes, too erratic, too many primer pocket issues. There simply is no free lunch.
I decided if I wanted hornet velocity, I shot a hornet. If I wanted FB velocity, I shot FB. I went back to subscribing to the late Don Lewis' mantra...accuracy before velocity.
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