This Rifle won't Shoot! Diagnosing the issue(s).

[Hal]

Check your front action screw to make sure it isn’t hitting the barrel threads.
The action is very thin where the front action screw, screws in .It can only screw in one or two threads before it hits the barrel. Some gunsmiths mill relief cut to allow the action screw to catch 3 or 4 threads.
If the screw is hitting the barrel you can see rub marks on the end of the screws first or on top of the threads, when looking down in the hole.

Usually those XP 100s are shooting machines.

Check your bedding by putting your finger at the end of the stock. where the bottom of the barrel and forend meet. Lightly tighten and loosen the screw, one at a time. Have the rifle standing vertical.
If the bedding is good you shouldn’t feel the barrel move.
If you feel much movement your bending the action when the screws are tight.
Hal

 

[CharlieNC]

These are with 25 grain bullets.
Velocities vary with powders, but the 8208

		SD		FPS
8208 XBR	17.0	51.1		3430
	17.8	41.2		3606
	18.2	62.2		3682
	18.6	10.9		3846
	19.4	29.7		3946

IMR 4198

15.0	21.6		3464
15.5	22.1		3574
16.0	25.3		3661
16.5	12.5		3778

With 20 Vmax

	Grn	SD		FPS
H335	18.0			3605
	18.5	39.2		3826
	18.7			3541
	19.0*	16.6		3826
	19.5	27.4		3956
	20.0	9.7		4065
	20.6*	14.7		4222

Those SD are unbelievable high! And the velocity change between charge weights is erratic. How many shots per charge?

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

Take a few cases down to 0.011-0.0115 neck walls, see if that moves groups and SD in a more consistent direction. I don't think it's powder related unless a pressure problem. You may need to use a chamber brush and clean throat and neck.

 

[Toolbreaker]

The rear of the bolt handle seems pretty close to the stock in the picture. Does it touch anywhere here, or do you see any rub marks inside the stock's bolt cutout?

 

[ELR LVR]

How many rounds on the barrel? You may try a good cleaning, the barrel could be fouled out.

I'd bet the barrel is fouled or shot out.
(Althought that twist seems slow to me, Rem 700 17 Remington came stock with 1:9 twist for a reason
I cannot think of any .17 variant that used slower than a 10 Twist
Even the standard twist for an HMR is 1:9)
(maybe try some 20 grain bullets instead, if that dont work go lighter still
Or fix it and put a 1:9 twist Krieger on it and you'll improve the gun instantly)
I would also check to see how much of the throat is shot out.
Only one way to tell if it's heavily coppered, is learn how to get the copper out
a fast 17 anything needs to be cleaned every 20-25 rounds
if the previous owner was a newbie to 17's and did not know of their cleaning regimen theres a clue
if it had not been cleaned often enough, you likely have layer after layer of
Copper, Carbon, Copper, Carbon
and it may take 2 hours to get it clean enough to shoot again.
Regardless of what anybody else says
Get some Sweets 7.62, learn how to properly use it..... and for goodness sakes stick with it
(I've played with enough 17's and 17 wildcats that I don't even mess with 17's anymore unless its an
HMR

 

[Hal]

While looking for copper, check for a carbon ring.

 

[WSnyder]

Doug, does that screw in the receiver bottom have a pillar at the other end that's bedded well into the stock?

From the picture he posted of the stock and bedding it does not. Looks very suspect to me

 

[ELR LVR]

From the picture he posted of the stock and bedding it does not. Looks very suspect to me
View attachment 1679479

Oh freakin A
is that of the OP's rifle stock?
If so
1) try relieving the bedding in front and on the sides and bottom of the recoil lug
That can be a problem issue / Dremel is your friend unless you have a Mill
Only the rear of the lug should touch
Way back in the beginning, nobody relieved around the recoil lug, because they didn't know better.
Including big name proffesionals that touted the best of the best bedding jobs.
That aspect got figured out later
2) Make sure the bedding in the chamber area does not put upward force on the barrel when clamped in
(For example, lets say it was rebarreled once, and they never redid the bedding where it touches the barrel)
(Relieve the bedding in the chamber area to fully free float the barrel)
Then see how it shoots
if the action was bedded right it should not move much upward or downward when you torque the action screws down.

 

[NZ_Fclass]

^^^
Check that the recoil lug isnt bottoming out - I have caught that one in the past - eluded me for a while.

 

[Fast14riot]

Hows the bolt and firing pin? This looks like extremely inconsistent ignition. A properly chambered barrel of decent quality should shoot 1 moa with nearly anything you feed it. Make sure the barrel is screwed on all the way. Bolt lugs aren't galled like crazy, groups like that indicate a major problem in the basics of the build.

 

[TheCZKid]

Doug, does that screw in the receiver bottom have a pillar at the other end that's bedded well into the stock?

It does, I can see the pillar when I remove the screw.

 

[TheCZKid]

Check your front action screw to make sure it isn’t hitting the barrel threads.
The action is very thin where the front action screw, screws in .It can only screw in one or two threads before it hits the barrel. Some gunsmiths mill relief cut to allow the action screw to catch 3 or 4 threads.
If the screw is hitting the barrel you can see rub marks on the end of the screws first or on top of the threads, when looking down in the hole.

Usually those XP 100s are shooting machines.

Check your bedding by putting your finger at the end of the stock. where the bottom of the barrel and forend meet. Lightly tighten and loosen the screw, one at a time. Have the rifle standing vertical.
If the bedding is good you shouldn’t feel the barrel move.
If you feel much movement your bending the action when the screws are tight.
Hal

This is all good stuff. I'm going to make a list, and hit these all one after the other. First thing is to take off the scope, rings and base, then start in on the list. Very informative.

 

[TheCZKid]

Those SD are unbelievable high! And the velocity change between charge weights is erratic. How many shots per charge?

3 shot groups, yes, some of the variances in velocity are very high indeed!

 

[TheCZKid]

The rear of the bolt handle seems pretty close to the stock in the picture. Does it touch anywhere here, or do you see any rub marks inside the stock's bolt cutout?

It does touch, there's a mark on the side of the stock. I decided to do a test: First I took the action out of the stock, and with the bolt closed, I wrote a thin sharpie line on the top of the bolt when it's closed. See pic.



Then, I put the action back in the stock with the action screw installed, and closed the bolt. I wanted to see if the bolt lever hits the stock enough to change the angle of the bolt. It appears to move it a few thousandths. Not sure what impact that would cause, curious what you think.

 

[TheCZKid]

Check your front action screw to make sure it isn’t hitting the barrel threads.
The action is very thin where the front action screw, screws in .It can only screw in one or two threads before it hits the barrel. Some gunsmiths mill relief cut to allow the action screw to catch 3 or 4 threads.
If the screw is hitting the barrel you can see rub marks on the end of the screws first or on top of the threads, when looking down in the hole.

Usually those XP 100s are shooting machines.

Check your bedding by putting your finger at the end of the stock. where the bottom of the barrel and forend meet. Lightly tighten and loosen the screw, one at a time. Have the rifle standing vertical.
If the bedding is good you shouldn’t feel the barrel move.
If you feel much movement your bending the action when the screws are tight.
Hal

Couple replies: First, I checked the front action screw: It protrudes out of the bottom of the stock bedding surface by .180". The screw hole has been milled out inside, so there are no threads showing inside, and the hole is .211" deep, so there are extra threads in the action to engage, and there is clearance above the screw head.



Second, with tightening and loosening the forward action screw, it barely moves, I can feel it slightly cinch in, but barely any movement felt.

I do believe the bedding is an exact imprint of the front of the action, the recoil lug, and the back of the barrel, there is no gap in front of the recoil lug in the epoxy.

 

[ELR LVR]

Couple replies: First, I checked the front action screw: It protrudes out of the bottom of the stock bedding surface by .180". The screw hole has been milled out inside, so there are no threads showing inside, and the hole is .211" deep, so there are extra threads in the action to engage, and there is clearance above the screw head.

View attachment 1679498

Second, with tightening and loosening the forward action screw, it barely moves, I can feel it slightly cinch in, but barely any movement felt.

I do believe the bedding is an exact imprint of the front of the action, the recoil lug, and the back of the barrel, there is no gap in front of the recoil lug in the epoxy.

View attachment 1679499

This is an example in wood but you get the idea
and if you have a wood stock you dont care about to train your hand on, even better
Relieve all around the recoil lug except the back
The back is the only things that needs to stop the action from going backward,
the front does nothing for it
the sides do nothing for it
Relieve the Bottom, sides, front ---it doesnt need much, just clearance
----------------------------------
The problem can stem from any atmospheric dust, a hair, lint, water, moisture etc, getting in between that
Perfect Line fit
and with 4 surfaces nothing should be touching/ interfering with, it can contribute.
I'm more leaning to your twist rate isn't tight enough for 25's though.
----------------------------------
I have a Lone Wolf stock that they would not sell a stock unless you let them perform their propriatary fiberglass totes awesome bedding - which meant sending in your barreled action
Wait time
Well guess what, they bedded it just like your picture
I got on the phone with them immediately and gave the owner a good ass chewin
about how he would not let me bed my own rifle but he didn't relieve around the recoil lug properly
now I had to do it.
Funny, they went out of business
I stuck with McMillan after that and funny, McMillan is still in business and going Strong

 

[TheCZKid]

I'd bet the barrel is fouled or shot out.
(Althought that twist seems slow to me, Rem 700 17 Remington came stock with 1:9 twist for a reason
I cannot think of any .17 variant that used slower than a 10 Twist
Even the standard twist for an HMR is 1:9)
(maybe try some 20 grain bullets instead, if that dont work go lighter still
Or fix it and put a 1:9 twist Krieger on it and you'll improve the gun instantly)
I would also check to see how much of the throat is shot out.
Only one way to tell if it's heavily coppered, is learn how to get the copper out
a fast 17 anything needs to be cleaned every 20-25 rounds
if the previous owner was a newbie to 17's and did not know of their cleaning regimen theres a clue
if it had not been cleaned often enough, you likely have layer after layer of
Copper, Carbon, Copper, Carbon
and it may take 2 hours to get it clean enough to shoot again.
Regardless of what anybody else says
Get some Sweets 7.62, learn how to properly use it..... and for goodness sakes stick with it
(I've played with enough 17's and 17 wildcats that I don't even mess with 17's anymore unless its an
HMR

I just checked more precisely, with a bore brush and rod, the twist rate appears to be 1: 10.55" right about there. Not sure why it's so slow, but it is what it is. So, looks like I'm going to only test 20 grain bullets from now on. Unfortunately, I've only got 20 Vmax. I just got some Berger 25 grain Varmint bullets, as I was all excited to shoot them!!!

I do have some Sweet's 7.62 solvent on hand, have not used it before, but got it. I'll follow the directions, and see if there's some copper fouling which is mucking up the works.

I've cleaned barrels for 2 hours before, not fun, but can be done!

 

[TheCZKid]

This is an example in wood but you get the idea
and if you have a wood stock you dont care about to train your hand on, even better
Relieve all around the recoil lug except the back
The back is the only things that needs to stop the action from going backward,
the front does nothing for it
the sides do nothing for it
Relieve the Bottom, sides, front ---it doesnt need much, just clearance
----------------------------------
The problem can stem from any atmospheric dust, a hair, lint, water, moisture etc, getting in between that
Perfect Line fit
and with 4 surfaces nothing should be touching/ interfering with, it can contribute.
I'm more leaning to your twist rate isn't tight enough for 25's though.
----------------------------------
I have a Lone Wolf stock that they would not sell a stock unless you let them perform their propriatary fiberglass totes awesome bedding - which meant sending in your barreled action
Wait time
Well guess what, they bedded it just like your picture
I got on the phone with them immediately and gave the owner a good ass chewin
Funny, they went out of business
I stuck with McMillan after that and funny, McMillan is still in business and going Strong

I do think this one has a fully contacted recoil lug, everything from the front of the action to a ways down the barrel.

 

[ELR LVR]

I do think this one has a fully contacted recoil lug, everything from the front of the action to a ways down the barrel.

View attachment 1679503

do one thing at a time
First relieve around the recoil lug
The bedded chamber area may not be hurting anything
but if you relieve it too, do it after you test relieving around the recoil lug
Rebedding the chamber area if you want afterward is easy enough
Do so with the action torqued in properly if you rebed it
---------------
Do some research or ask advice here about relieving the weight of the barrel hanging off the end if you rebed the chamber area
When I bed I put the rifle vertical so the barrel weight doesnt hang down / Neutral
if there is say .0005" between them due to the barrel sagging and squishing the bedding while it cured,
that can vibrate
---------------
Some others have different methods such as even suspending the front by the barrel for negative (upward) deflection in that area, which would create a constant upward pressure in the chamber area
Whose to know how your barrel was bedded?

 

[TheCZKid]

Hows the bolt and firing pin? This looks like extremely inconsistent ignition. A properly chambered barrel of decent quality should shoot 1 moa with nearly anything you feed it. Make sure the barrel is screwed on all the way. Bolt lugs aren't galled like crazy, groups like that indicate a major problem in the basics of the build.

I looked at the firing pin and spring, but just looked and they looked fine visually. Perhaps a new spring, and maybe firing pin would make a difference. Your suggestions welcome. I see that GRE-TAN has a fluted firing pin / spring combo for about $37 plus shipping, that a good or bad idea?

The bolt lugs feel smooth, photos are here:





Bolt face