Saving a Mauser wth setback lugs

[SixFive]

I came into possession of a STYER 98 Large Ring Mauser action for free. The previous owner chambered it in 300WSM and it had lug set back. Normally once this happens they are trash but I had me an idea. I blasted the receiver and trued the lugs in the lathe (They were already screwed). Then I set the action up in a vise and heated the lugs cherry red and applied Kasinite case hardening powder then turned it cherry red again and quenched in water. I had no distortion in the receiver and the lugs are as hard as woodpecker lips now.

The way I figure these Mausers were only case hardened to begin with, I just re-case hardened the lugs. I am going to chamber it in 6.5x55 Mauser and see if it stays in headspace. I have a feeling it will. As these were all made of mild steel (think 1018) the receiver being heated should have no effect accept where the case hardening agent was applied. I was also very careful to ONLY turn the lugs red with a pencil torch.

I will report back one a build and shoot it.

 

[Oldman1950]

when you test fire it use a LONG string with a HOT load. Better to loose the rifle than your hand, eye or face

A. J. Palik

 

[shortgrass]

If the rails were altered to feed the WSM, she'll not hold 6.5x55 cartridges in the magazine.

 

[SixFive]

If the rails were altered to feed the WSM, she'll not hold 6.5x55 cartridges in the magazine.

Humm true, I will work it out, some way

 

[tobnpr]

If the rails were altered to feed the WSM, she'll not hold 6.5x55 cartridges in the magazine.

And the boltface will need to be welded up, machined, and heat treated...

A lot of work with dubious heat treatment at the end of the day. I wouldn't do it, but hey it's not my forehead that's gonna be behind the bolt when the trigger is pulled.

 

[Randfal]

Nice save! Definitely want to hear how
it does in the end. Don’t let the nah-sayers stop you. The internet has the word scared to fart without engineering approval and a hot work permit!

 

[SixFive]

And the boltface will need to be welded up, machined, and heat treated...

A lot of work with dubious heat treatment at the end of the day. I wouldn't do it, but hey it's not my forehead that's gonna be behind the bolt when the trigger is pulled.

OK, so this is not a "HEAT TREATMENT" it is a CASE HARDENING process, very different things. You cannot heat treat low carbon Mauser actions. Good news is I have another bolt, in fact a good many.

As a note, if you know what you are doing you can weld up a bolt face and never even get the lugs hot, I have done it many times, it is slow but works. Spot, let cool, spot, let cool etc....

 

[SixFive]

Nice save! Definitely want to hear how
it does in the end. Don’t let the nah-sayers stop you. The internet has the word scared to fart without engineering approval and a hot work permit!

You are correct about NBay-Sayers, my shop is full of things people said would never work that did. I have my own machine shop and fabrication facility (hobby stuff) and have about 30 years under my belt of doing dubious stuff like this. I am not the least bit worried about it , but will take a couple remote fires for safety and check headspace. I built my own .50 cal rifle from scratch 15 years ago and it still shoots to this day with no issues. I am doing this particular project as a proof of concept, there are thousands of Mauser actions that have set back lugs sitting on shelves, maybe this is a save that has not been tried. Probably not but we shall see....

If this does not work I have an ever "BETTER" idea you all will hate I will cut the lugs down and hard chrome weld them back up and machine to spec, those will NEVER set back, something else horrible might happen though . I even thought that maybe I could BORE the entire front of the action out, threads, lugs, and all. Then weld in a sleeve with lugs and threads already done. Hopefully the case hardening works though and I do not have to go down this road, but either way it is fun to play around.

 

[boltfluter]

You are correct about NBay-Sayers, my shop is full of things people said would never work that did. I have my own machine shop and fabrication facility (hobby stuff) and have about 30 years under my belt of doing dubious stuff like this. I am not the least bit worried about it , but will take a couple remote fires for safety and check headspace. I built my own .50 cal rifle from scratch 15 years ago and it still shoots to this day with no issues. I am doing this particular project as a proof of concept, there are thousands of Mauser actions that have set back lugs sitting on shelves, maybe this is a save that has not been tried. Probably not but we shall see....

If this does not work I have an ever "BETTER" idea you all will hate I will cut the lugs down and hard chrome weld them back up and machine to spec, those will NEVER set back, something else horrible might happen though . I even thought that maybe I could BORE the entire front of the action out, threads, lugs, and all. Then weld in a sleeve with lugs and threads already done. Hopefully the case hardening works though and I do not have to go down this road, but either way it is fun to play around.

Since you like challenges, why not just cut the bolt head off completely, and then machine and install one made from the modern metals that are available now. Would be a fun project and probably quite a bit safer. Just a thought.
Paul

 

[SixFive]

Since you like challenges, why not just cut the bolt head off completely, and then machine and install one made from the modern metals that are available now. Would be a fun project and probably quite a bit safer. Just a thought.
Paul

It is not the bolt head that is the issue, it is the bolt lugs inside the receiver.

 

[boltfluter]

It is not the bolt head that is the issue, it is the bolt lugs inside the receiver.

Oops. My bad. An entirely different problem.

 

[Rick Beginski]

I came into possession of a STYER 98 Large Ring Mauser action for free. The previous owner chambered it in 300WSM and it had lug set back. Normally once this happens they are trash but I had me an idea. I blasted the receiver and trued the lugs in the lathe (They were already screwed). Then I set the action up in a vise and heated the lugs cherry red and applied Kasinite case hardening powder then turned it cherry red again and quenched in water. I had no distortion in the receiver and the lugs are as hard as woodpecker lips now.

The way I figure these Mausers were only case hardened to begin with, I just re-case hardened the lugs. I am going to chamber it in 6.5x55 Mauser and see if it stays in headspace. I have a feeling it will. As these were all made of mild steel (think 1018) the receiver being heated should have no effect accept where the case hardening agent was applied. I was also very careful to ONLY turn the lugs red with a pencil torch.

I will report back one a build and shoot it.

Something to check, make sure the 2 front bolt lugs are in contact with the receiver. I have seen old Mausers with set back lugs riding against the face of the 3rd/ safety lug.

 

[jackieschmidt]

Even the case hardening is not what you would expect it to be. When I did my 98 Mauser project, I had no trouble drilling the action for scope mounts, truing the threads and action face and C ring.
I did mine in 280 Remington.
As was noted, these old actions are not “Heat treated”, as in hardening and then drawing the temper to achieve a specific level of strength. The compression strength of the steel simply is not like modern Chrome Moly or Stainless. But it is totally adequate when staying within the pressures that these actions were designed to hold.

 

[ISS]

I have two Mauser actions for sale here. One is a color case hardened military (guild?) with scroll engraving and milled for claw mounts and an under lever floor plate release, the other is a blued LN post-war commercial with broken safety lever. Make me an offer on either or both if you are interested...

ISS

 

[Jonnyofalltrades]

I look forward to reading your obituar...er, uh, I look forward to hearing how this turns out.

I have long thought about doing something like this on a Mauser with set back in the reciever abutments. My thought process involved colour case hardening, though.
I've used Kasenit lots, but have always been leery of it, just a little.

 

[Walt Krafft]

I would do all of your machining then send it out for nitriding. Nice case harden on the whole action and bolt.

 

[SixFive]

I would do all of your machining then send it out for nitriding. Nice case harden on the whole action and bolt.

I could just Nitride the action here in my shop, I am going to put it together and test what I have done so far. 6.5x55 is a fairly low pressure cartridge and I will start low and work up the loads. Should be around 38,000PSI at the low end then maxing out around 48,000PSI.

 

[SixFive]

Even the case hardening is not what you would expect it to be. When I did my 98 Mauser project, I had no trouble drilling the action for scope mounts, truing the threads and action face and C ring.
I did mine in 280 Remington.
As was noted, these old actions are not “Heat treated”, as in hardening and then drawing the temper to achieve a specific level of strength. The compression strength of the steel simply is not like modern Chrome Moly or Stainless. But it is totally adequate when staying within the pressures that these actions were designed to hold.

Yeah people that have not worked on a lot of them really have no idea how soft these actions are compared to modern steels used today, but they work and are safe if you do not get carried away. Heck you got to think this action held full power 300wsm factory loads without blowing apart for the guy who owned it for a year before the bolt got hard to lift, that is a testament to these old mild steel actions!

 

[SixFive]

I would do all of your machining then send it out for nitriding. Nice case harden on the whole action and bolt.

Doing some research seems like nitriding really only works on steels with chromium, molybdenum, vanadium, or aluminum alloy, since those elements form stable nitrides when saturated with nitrogen. Probably why we never hear of them doing Mauser actions in this technique.

 

[linebaugh]

What am I missing on the heaspace not being correct? Never worked on and seldom seen the older mauser actions... mostly because of lack of interest.

I guess what I am asking is... if you are fitting a new barrel why would you not headspace to what you have now or set the shoulder back on the barrel you plan to use for proper headspace. I'm sure I have to be missing something but hoping to learn something here.