First Build: Savage 7mm-08, Shilen Select Match 9 twist, first shots

[Pyscodog]

My 7-08 is my go-to hunting rifle. Just an old Remington I threw together with parts I had gathered. It loves the Hornady 139grain Interlock and IMR 4350. Shoots bugholes from my rifle. Hammers deer and pigs.

 

[6MMsteve]

N160 or N555 or R23 heavy bullets and N550 for lighter bullets

 

[TheCZKid]

I have seldom seen such a difference in grouping within .2 grains. As for the copper fouling You may have to clean a couple times with a good abrasive to smooth things up.

I know, the bottom three targets are pretty bizarre regarding the variance. Probably some operator error involved.

I just did a seating depth test today on the bottom center 40.6, and none of the groups were good. I'll try between the top right two, with another test at 40.1 and hope for pay-dirt.

I have found that using a copper killer first and let it soak, then use Iosso and a Parker-Hale jag I can get the copper fouling out fairly fast.

 

[TheCZKid]

N160 or N555 or R23 heavy bullets and N550 for lighter bullets

Don't have any of those, but appreciate the info.

 

[std7mag]

@TheCZKid,

I reread through the thread. I couldn't find any reference to the freebore measurements.

The reason I ask is that I'm using a PT&G reamer for my 7mm-08AI with 0.06" freebore.
140gr NBT are at 2.895" COAL for 0.02" off the lands while the 140gr Berger VLD are 2.898" for 0.005" off the lands.
While they may seem like long measurements, it puts the shoulder/boat tail of the bullet right at the neck/shoulder junction of the case.

I have played with the 160gr class in several bullets, but found that the bullet is seated deep into the casing. According to QL, I was running into the 110%+ on case fill.
Without a crimp, with some time the bullet was pushing out of the case.

As someone previously mentioned, don't overlook the 120gr class of bullets.
The 120gr NBT is no slouch! My daughter has taken several deer with it in her 7X57 Mauser.

 

[rickt300]

I know, the bottom three targets are pretty bizarre regarding the variance. Probably some operator error involved.

I just did a seating depth test today on the bottom center 40.6, and none of the groups were good. I'll try between the top right two, with another test at 40.1 and hope for pay-dirt.

I have found that using a copper killer first and let it soak, then use Iosso and a Parker-Hale jag I can get the copper fouling out fairly fast.

If it keeps copper fouling a good abrasive can smooth the barrel and reduce fouling that way. Your accuracy though so far not as consistant as you would like is plenty good for just about any reasonable hunting.

 

[wedgy]

Seating depth on Barnes bullets is key, they like a LOT of jump.
Per Barnes ;
"When loading a Barnes TSX, Tipped TSX or LRX bullet, your rifle may prefer a bullet jump of anywhere between .050” up to .250” or more."

And I 2nd the 120 at higher velocity.

 

[TheCZKid]

I created my seating depth test loads with 2.800 in the middle length, and I went in bigger increments to see if I could see more notable changes, longer and shorter. The ones over 2.800" are getting very close to the max length for the internal magazine, at 2.840" is real close to interfering, see photo.
I think I'll try a few going in a little further this next go-round.

 

[rickt300]

I created my seating depth test loads with 2.800 in the middle length, and I went in bigger increments to see if I could see more notable changes, longer and shorter. The ones over 2.800" are getting very close to the max length for the internal magazine, at 2.840" is real close to interfering, see photo.
I think I'll try a few going in a little further this next go-round.
View attachment 1594335

My experience with Barnes Mono's has been that -.050 off the lands is the starting point. The problem being that the longer bullets start intruding on powder room pretty fast. one of the reasons lighter bullets are often recommended.

 

[rickt300]

However My favorite bullet for the 7-08 is the 140 grain Partition and generally H414. I4350 is the second most used of my powders. As for speeds I feel max loads with either of those powders provide plenty.

 

[TheCZKid]

Rick in Oregon suggested seating depth testing, and Rickt300 was right, seating the Barnes 140 TTSX with more jump made it shoot better. I shot a group at the normal 2.800" and it was OK, but seating at 2.770 and 2.743 (which was as short as I felt was okay with compressing the load a bit).

I think my hunting load is going to be final at 40.1 grains Varget with WLR primers, and seating COAL at 2.770"

 

[Rick in Oregon]

Rick in Oregon suggested seating depth testing, and Rickt300 was right, seating the Barnes 140 TTSX with more jump made it shoot better. I shot a group at the normal 2.800" and it was OK, but seating at 2.770 and 2.743 (which was as short as I felt was okay with compressing the load a bit).

I think my hunting load is going to be final at 40.1 grains Varget with WLR primers, and seating COAL at 2.770"

View attachment 1595059

For a rifle intended for deer, I'd say you've "found the load!" That's more than enough good accuracy for any mulie. Those Barnes TTSX's sure do like a bit of jump, and that's been my experience too.

Time to load up a box and pack up for camp, nuthin' left to do maybe 'cept to clean that rifle and go huntin'!

 

[Chuckhunter]

I know they work on Eastern Montana mulies. This one was taken at 500yds. which Ifeel is the limit for this cartridge and powder bullet combination, 140 Gr Nosler Ballistic tip in front of 43.0 Gr's of IMR-4064. Remington Brass and Rem 9 1/2 primers. Around here in the PA. hardwoods, I substitute the Nosler with a Sierra 140Gr. SPBT.

 

[Webster]

Results of the above mentioned Varget ladder test, with Barnes 140 gr TTSX bullets loaded to 2.80" COAL, WLR primers. Most shot in 1x fired cases (unless noted). First two loads I just wanted to cover the lower end charges, 38.0 and 39.0. I started the ladder more from the 40.0 up to 42.2 grain range.

Looks like I hit pay-dirt starting at 40.0, and the node goes to 40.8 grains. Very happy to see the barrel can shoot! On the 40.4 load the first two were in the middle hole, third dropped down, I was a bit excited, so I may have contributed to the last one being lower. But .44", .49" and .56" is excellent for my second outing with this rifle.

Now, I'll do another ladder in smaller increments, from probably 39.5 to 40.8, see where the middle of the node is. I'm just jazzed, it seems to like the bullet and powder combo.

View attachment 1591404
The first two groups were high, and I over-corrected down 2 moa and .5 right, next went back up .5 moa, the rest I kept the same. Interesting at 41.2 the groups POI went quite a bit higher, and stayed high.

I'm wanting to upgrade from the stock trigger now, want to make sure I get one that is correct for this model. Far as I know it's a Savage model 10, made 2002. I'm thinking of a Timney or Rifle Basix, not sure, never did this before. If you guys have some input on the correct trigger, I'd appreciate it.

How good are your bench manners. Can you shoot small round groups with another rifle. I seldom use flags and can shoot under 1/2". The bench set up is critical.

 

[TheCZKid]

How good are your bench manners. Can you shoot small round groups with another rifle. I seldom use flags and can shoot under 1/2". The bench set up is critical.

Most of what I've been shooting off my "bench" (plastic Lifetime fold up table) has been 20 Vartarg, 222, 20 Practical, 17 Hornet, etc. With those I can shoot tiny groups well.

Shooting the 7mm-08 for me is pretty different, because I have to remember to keep my shoulder stiff (not a relaxed upper body) when shooting, unless I like my nose or eyebrow to be smacked. So, it's been a bit of a learning curve to say the least. When testing loads for my 30-06 or 7mm Rem Mag I forgot a couple times to not relax, and my nose was smacked by the rear cap a few times. It is a challenge, as I'm not used to it. If I shot more large caliber I'd have to spend some effort to solve this. I normally sit on a folding 3 legged chair with back, and off a Sinclair front rest, Protektor rear rest, as photo below, with the 7mm-08.


sit

 

[misser]

I have 3 different 708's ,had a fourth, each of them likes something different .someone with the same gun that you have might work

 

[jwv2001]

Well, here goes with my input on your post so far. While I appreciate all of the load work you've done, the attention to detail, I really think the improvement in your groups is indicative of you getting comfortable with your rifle. I think that if you go back to those first loads, you will find that you shoot those better now than you did then. A lot of folks, especially with a new rifle, tend to discount user error as a problem. Think they need to break in the barrel, work up the "right" load, seat the bullet in the right spot.
All of a sudden, they get to the "sweet" spot and think they've found the right combination when it was really the shooter that got comfortable with the rifle.
When I looked at the first targets, I thought, why is this guy dissatisfied. I thought this rifle shoots pretty good for a deer rifle. The only thing left to do was sight it in for the range it was going to be used.
A deer rifle doesn't need to shoot groups. It needs to place one bullet out of a cold barrel at the point of aim. That's it, game over.

 

[TheCZKid]

Well, here goes with my input on your post so far. While I appreciate all of the load work you've done, the attention to detail, I really think the improvement in your groups is indicative of you getting comfortable with your rifle. I think that if you go back to those first loads, you will find that you shoot those better now than you did then. A lot of folks, especially with a new rifle, tend to discount user error as a problem. Think they need to break in the barrel, work up the "right" load, seat the bullet in the right spot.
All of a sudden, they get to the "sweet" spot and think they've found the right combination when it was really the shooter that got comfortable with the rifle.
When I looked at the first targets, I thought, why is this guy dissatisfied. I thought this rifle shoots pretty good for a deer rifle. The only thing left to do was sight it in for the range it was going to be used.
A deer rifle doesn't need to shoot groups. It needs to place one bullet out of a cold barrel at the point of aim. That's it, game over.

I would tend to agree with most of what you said. Part of the fun of a new rifle to me is getting familiar with how it feels to shoulder, and get a cheek weld, get my eye lined up with the scope, the feel for when the trigger will break, etc. My learning curve on this one included getting accustomed to shooting a rifle with a significant recoil, compared to the rifles I've been shooting recently, like the 20 Vartarg or Practical, very accurate, and pretty much no kick.

I really like the challenge of getting the most accurate load from a new rifle also, and that's where the my reloading skills are applied to a new test, and I get a lot of enjoyment from that process. I didn't want to just get a 1" group and call it good, maybe that would be practical, but not nearly as enjoyable as getting a 1/2" group!

This is the first rifle I actually assembled all the components for: Stock and barrel from one guy, unimproved action from another guy, then worked on getting the bolt smooth and upgraded in this action. I got the scope bases and rings and that scope for this build too, got it assembled, and then finally was able to shoot it. I realized I really have grown accustomed to nicer triggers on my other guns, I installed that Timney trigger myself (another first) and that was the last upgrade so far. That's why I started this post, as it's significant to me.

Since it has a Shilen barrel, I wanted to get the most accurate load, with the most effective hunting bullet, that I could. I am satisfied with the 140 grain load I now have. If I was better at shooting this caliber, I could probably improve on it. I feel confident for the upcoming elk rifle season, that was my first goal. Next I'll do load development for a 120 grain load for deer, but that's for next year.

 

[Idaho-Lefty]

@ CZKid,.
If ever wanting, a Heavier Big Game Bullet, try the Hornady 150 Gr., ELD-X's with, a hefty charge of, StaBall 65 or RL-17, in your 7mm-08 for, an Elk / Moose, Bullet. My son shot, a really nice, heavy Bodied 5 x 6 Bull at, a quartering angle, thru,. Shoulder Blade ( Clipped ) thru Lungs, into rear Ham, breaking / severing, the Femur Bone with, 67 grains of Mushroomed, Bullet Left at,.. 247 Yards. ( If, you Rifle likes them, the 162 gr. X's, are great, too ! )
The 7-08 is a great, ACCURATE, "All around", Big Game, "Cartridge choice" For,.. "Hunters" !

 

[Idaho-Lefty]

Personally, I'd Move that Scope Forward a Bit, BEFORE you get, a "Weatherby Eye" from mis-holding It, in the Field.
My son Got "One" when he shot his Bull Elk, Up Hill, across,. a Canyon !
Stock slipped a Bit Downward on his shoulder, allowing him to Be,.. "loose" On his, Hold.
It Drew,. "Blood" on Both ends ( the Elk,.. AND,.. Him ! )