6 PPC Norma Brass Issue

[Tim Singleton]

When you pull the barrel off drop a sized case in the chamber push it in and snap a pic. Looking to verify how much case is sticking out
Do this before you send it back.

 

[Tim Singleton]

As far up as that line is probably is just a groove in the chamber. But check the case head to be sure

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

As far up as that line is probably is just a groove in the chamber. But check the case head to be sure

Listen to Tim. Lol!
Good advice and he's right. Might be able to tell a bit from a good pic.

 

[J.J. Coe]

Panda action.

Pretty sure the chamber is cut too deep after checking my spent brass to spent brass from a couple other guns chambered by the same company.

Thanks for all the replies and help.

How much of a difference did you see in the brass? Have a measurement?

 

[DaWhit]

The case drops all the way in the chamber.
Two guys had guns chambered by the same place at the range today. Their shoulders on spent brass are within .001 of each other when checked with a comparator, my shoulder is 30 thousands longer.
You could drop their cases in a Wilson neck sizer and the case is flush with the top of the sizer, mine won’t go all the way in the sizer.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

How much of a difference did you see in the brass? Have a measurement?

May not be headspace to just too much unsupported. Hopefully op will let us know what he/smith finds for sure.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

The case drops all the way in the chamber.
Two guys had guns chambered by the same place at the range today. Their shoulders on spent brass are within .001 of each other when checked with a comparator, my shoulder is 30 thousands longer.
You could drop their cases in a Wilson neck sizer and the case is flush with the top of the sizer, mine won’t go all the way in the sizer.

Bulged a bit, probably

 

[J.J. Coe]

my shoulder is 30 thousands longer.

Looks like you found the problem. I'd check the bolt nose clearance as well. Just a side note, if I remember correctly Norma brass was .007-.010 shorter out of the box than a typical ppc head space dimension.

 

[DaWhit]

Looks like you found the problem. I'd check the bolt nose clearance as well. Just a side note, if I remember correctly Norma brass was .007-.010 shorter out of the box than a typical ppc head space dimension.

Bolt nose and cone are in specs from what I was told and the measurements I got.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Bolt nose and cone are in specs from what I was told and the measurements I got.

Hmmm

 

[anschuter2013]

This is true...

Norma brass is .007-.010 shorter out of the box than a typical ppc head space dimension.

 

[Fire Dog]

This is a new Bartlein 4 groove 13.5” twist .268 neck, 6 PPC barrel just picked up the other day.

Loading 25gr N133 in Norma 6 PPC brass, just bought a couple weeks ago from Drifters Gear, with a Sierra 60gr flat base bullet to blow out the brass and break in the barrel. Loosing half the brass due to what looks like a small fracture .306” up from the base of the case.

Wondering if anyone has had a similar issue? Cause? New PPC shooter so any help much appreciated.

View attachment 1587749

Take a paper clip and straighten it out a couple of bends, grind a small point on it, turn a 90* angle on it only long enough to still allow the angled end to enter the case. Reach down to the base and while holding the tip against the inside of the case pull it up and over the mark you are seeing on the outside, if there is incipient case head separation you will feel the point catch on the inside of the case at that thinned out spot...
That will confirm whether or not the case is junk/scrap.
Just saw that Peterson 1 has already made the same comment...
Ah well, good advice and an easy thing to do with no special tools necessary aside from paper clip, pliers, a file or grinder.

 

[Fire Dog]

I'd get it fixed before shooting more. Too much unsupported case might be the, or one of, the most critical aspects of a gun build, from a safety standpoint. I've seen them that looked way worse but your load is super mild, thankfully. No need to mention names but is the smith reputable? A lot of times people just put way too much chamfer at the end of the chamber but that's just as bad as too short. It can be a mistake or it can be ignorance. This is one thing that separates a very good machinist from a qualified gunsmith. Just knowing the whys and what fors matters. This is NOT an area where clearance is just clearance. In this case it matters a whole lot. Too much unsupported brass means you've got nothing more than say .025-.030 of brass between you and 65,000psi. There are failsafes in most guns but they are not 100%. Just meant to minimize damage, not stop everything.

Definatly get it checked out {second opinion perhaps}...
I once saw an exploding rifle and aside from shattering the stock and action the bolt came through the shooters cheek bone and if another 1/2" closer to the center of his face most likely have killed him... {:~/

 

[AlNyhus]

The case drops all the way in the chamber.
Two guys had guns chambered by the same place at the range today. Their shoulders on spent brass are within .001 of each other when checked with a comparator, my shoulder is 30 thousands longer.
You could drop their cases in a Wilson neck sizer and the case is flush with the top of the sizer, mine won’t go all the way in the sizer.

By your picture, it sure appears that the head space is way too long. The crack at the back developed when that light of a load (light even for standard 6PPC f-forming) couldn't blow the case forward enough in the too-long chamber and the case stretched at the rear...causing the crack you're feeling. My hunch is a BR head space guage was used.

FWIW, the Norma 6PPC brass has been really good in my own 6PPC.

Keep us posted on how it plays out.

Good shootin' -Al

 

[dat]

Bolt nose and cone are in specs from what I was told and the measurements I got.

Tony Boyer's book tells/shows how to check bolt cone to barrel clearance, pg 189, using a lead squirt or solder or some dead material, stick it across the bolt cone using a spot of grease to hold it there and close the bolt. Measure the formed flat spot on the material used. No flat spot? Use thicker material. Good luck

 

[DaWhit]

Took the barrel to a friend that does his own work, chamber is 40 thousands too deep, so it was stretching the brass a lot.

Should have had him check it before I screwed it on, but like I said, numerous guys from our club buy from them and never had an issue.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Took the barrel to a friend that does his own work, chamber is 40 thousands too deep, so it was stretching the brass a lot.

Should have had him check it before I screwed it on, but like I said, numerous guys from our club buy from them and never had an issue.

Mistakes happen. The smith should make it right and all is good again. I'm sure he feels as bad as anyone and doesn't want to lose a customer(s) over it. I've made mistakes and I will again. HS should be triple checked but Things happen. To me, it's more about how a mistake is handled than that it happened. No one's perfect.

 

[AlNyhus]

Took the barrel to a friend that does his own work, chamber is 40 thousands too deep, so it was stretching the brass a lot.

Should have had him check it before I screwed it on, but like I said, numerous guys from our club buy from them and never had an issue.

Fortunately, the fix is pretty straight forward and other than some brass, you're ok.

 

[Tim Singleton]

Dont think that would cause the line way down toward the base.