Fox / Coyote Cartridge Advice?

[Hal]

Looking up on google they say the gray fox is about 2/3 the size of reds.
There are sub species all over.
I've never saw a grey fox except a few pictures of some called in TX.
The looked small by them self. Maybe what I saw we're a kit fox.
None of fox or coyotes are very big once you skin them.

Hal

 

[lawman29]

Thank you all for your time. I kind of suspected but it It looks like a 223 bolt gun will be the best option since I could flexibly load depending on my scenario. I already do this with my 308 using subsonic 190gr hunting, cast bullet squirrel loads, 178gr LR, and HV 130gr copper loads.

Now I need to locate one that'll fit my needs and I could enjoy. The only thing about small cartridge rifles is that I don't really like when manufacturers use a long action (or short) and put a big spacer behind the magazine. A Howa Mini action then? I noticed the Ruger American, Savage Axis, Model 7, and Tikka all use this spacer block. Any other models I should look at?

The old Sako small actions are very nice (L461, 75...).

GunBroker.com - Error

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

A bucket list hunt for me would be Kodiak Island for silver/cross fox(Red mutations) or southern South America for Red fox. I would take my 17 rem and the Berger 25 match varmint. Issue with Grey's are distance they typically are shot at, often well within 50 yards, shotgun sport.

 

[Gary in MD]

I’ve killed quite a few foxes over the years with the 22-250 and the Swift. They are very soft and I’ve not seen one yet that I didn’t blow a big hole in it. Even a few with the 222 made big holes. I called a big one in a bunch of years ago in early January while out rabbit hunting, saw him from 500 - 600 yards and he came in across the snow looking for the free meal. A load of 12 gauge #6 shot at about 35 yards did him in with no damage. He was a big beautiful male with a prime pelt and I got him mounted.

 

[Davidheart]

....... A load of 12 gauge #6 shot at about 35 yards did him in with no damage. He was a big beautiful male with a prime pelt and I got him mounted.

One thing I'm a little confused by is how does a shotgun not destroy a pelt even worse than a rifle? I'd imagine a hundred holes riddled throughout the animal. Mind you I never use my shotgun for anything outside of turkey and I don't bird hunt.

 

[Gary in MD]

Try and imagine a dozen or so tiny pellets scattered over the head/neck/chest area of a fox at a relatively modest velocity as compared to a 55 grain soft point at approximately 3000 fps. It’s a handful of scattered tiny holes compared to a big gaping wound. The taxidermy man won’t complain. Pics or it didn’t happen? Had to dig him out of the dusty side of the basement LOL

 

[Davidheart]

Try and imagine a dozen or so tiny pellets scattered over the head/neck/chest area of a fox at a relatively modest velocity as compared to a 55 grain soft point at approximately 3000 fps. It’s a handful of scattered tiny holes compared to a big gaping wound. The taxidermy man won’t complain. Pics or it didn’t happen? Had to dig him out of the dusty side of the basement LOL

Wow that looks awesome! Good to know. Did you avoid hitting the head?

 

[Gary in MD]

Wow that looks awesome! Good to know. Did you avoid hitting the head?

It’s been quite a while ago to be honest. But pretty sure that at least a few pellets would have hit the head. These days I must admit to enjoying a little more carnage at the target, so the 22-250, Swift, big six is what I use now.
Good luck
Gary

 

[TTE]

IMO you need a solid bullet or a tough bonded bullet for non blow ups on soft skinned critters

 

[Majday]

One thing I'm a little confused by is how does a shotgun not destroy a pelt even worse than a rifle? I'd imagine a hundred holes riddled throughout the animal. Mind you I never use my shotgun for anything outside of turkey and I don't bird hunt.

I had a taxidermist friend who had said 22 cal holes typically need sewn up but smaller pose no problem- obviously talking about the entrance hole.

 

[Majday]

I've taken a bobcat at 75 yards with 25 vmax from 17 rem. As if it wasn't hit no mess. Yotes are the same one at 15 yards no mess. Same with coons. Have not shot fox as they aren't around here but Bobcat is fairly thin and 17 rem works well

 

[DiRTY DOG]

One thing I'm a little confused by is how does a shotgun not destroy a pelt even worse than a rifle? I'd imagine a hundred holes riddled throughout the animal. Mind you I never use my shotgun for anything outside of turkey and I don't bird hunt.

Here's a western Grey Fox, 12g 3" #2 lead magnum @ about 25 yards, XX full turkey choke. The Hammer of Thor on foxes out to 50+ yards! The small holes just kinda self seal when they dry or tan. Many of the pellets get stuck under the skin on the far side.

 

[DiRTY DOG]

Looking up on google they say the gray fox is about 2/3 the size of reds.
There are sub species all over.
I've never saw a grey fox except a few pictures of some called in TX.
The looked small by them self. Maybe what I saw we're a kit fox.
None of fox or coyotes are very big once you skin them.

Hal

Western Greys are pretty small and very thin skinned around the underside: neck, armpits and belly.

I've killed a truckload of Greys with 17 hmr, 17rem, 204, 223, 6DTI, and 12g. The 12g with 3" #2 lead shot and XX full choke is BY FAR the best gun for our foxes. 17hmr is also extremely effective with both 17gr Vmax and 15.5gr NTX bullets.

17rem, 204, and 223 were all 50/50 for wrecking fur. Sometimes no exit, but the next one blows out the belly or rips off a leg. They are largely dependent on perfect shot placement to stay off any leg/shoulder bones on entry & exit, but also stay very far away from the belly or edges. Most coyote effective rounds are generally too much for Greys if you're saving fur.

I can't use lead shot anymore, steel shot just doesn't penetrate as well or break bones as well, and tungsten is too expensive. So I pretty much retired the 12g.

My go-to Grey Fox gun is 17hmr, furthest laser confirmed kill is 155 yards but most are 25-75 yards max.

 

[Doug Casner]

I had a cousin that bought fur. He would rather sew up holes than have them shotgunned . Doug

 

[603Country]

What powder are you using to get a straight .223 40 grn vmax to 3800ish? And how much?

I’m probably a bit below 3800 truthfully. I use a lot of H335

 

[Deadeyedickie]

So I've got bit by a bug to hunt predators on our land and we're covered up in fox moreso than coyote. I had been using my 6mm Creedmoor but I want to be able to save the pelts as well so I'd like to add to my collection.

On the fields for the new rifle I'm thinking about, shots will range from 50-200 yards at the treeline. However, if any coyote pop up I would like to be able to take one too.

If I'm hunting the bigger fields that range out to 400-500 yards I'd choose to take my 6CM but I'm not sure which bullet I should use that won't blow a huge hole in a fox.

I've seen advice to use everything from 17WSM to .243/6CM.

I appreciate thoughts and advice on cartridge/ bullet combinations. I set the poll to allow y'all to choose two choices. Thank you!

I prefer my 22-250, hits em like a sledge hammer with a 52gr Eldm.

 

[Ohio Varmint Shooter]

Given only one caliber choice...but two different critters and a 50-200 range....I voted the 223. But I would give a huge tip o' the hat to the 17 Hornet for shorter range fox. Especially if you're concerned about pelt damage. But I don't think I'd want to use the 17Hornet for a 200 yard coyote. Those light 17 bullets loose a lot of speed fast.

My 223 happens to really like the 40g v-max bullets....good for groundhogs less than 200 yards. But I could see how people concerned about pelts may want something other than a v-max because of the potential exit damage.

 

[Jeff Porter]

I love the .243 58 Vmax on coyotes. Pushing up over 3650 -3700 fps I get bang flop and no exit wound

I can also tell you what not to use … I was going out hunting coyotes a few years back and grabbed my 30-06 with 110 Vmax instead of the .243 with 58vmax or .223 with 55vmax when a red Fox popped out at about 330 yards. Beautiful red … with 9” of dental floss stitches on the off side. Took out the whole rib cage.

 

[Webster]

So I've got bit by a bug to hunt predators on our land and we're covered up in fox moreso than coyote. I had been using my 6mm Creedmoor but I want to be able to save the pelts as well so I'd like to add to my collection.

On the fields for the new rifle I'm thinking about, shots will range from 50-200 yards at the treeline. However, if any coyote pop up I would like to be able to take one too.

If I'm hunting the bigger fields that range out to 400-500 yards I'd choose to take my 6CM but I'm not sure which bullet I should use that won't blow a huge hole in a fox.

I've seen advice to use everything from 17WSM to .243/6CM.

I appreciate thoughts and advice on cartridge/ bullet combinations. I set the poll to allow y'all to choose two choices. Thank you!

Would the 6mm Creedmore work with heavy bullets intended for deer size game?

 

[Doug Casner]

Id like to know how you get in shotgun range of fox or coyote. 2 or 3 hundred yards was where most of my shots were. Unless he was on the river bank. Had them come to a turkey call I guess you need to call. Doug