Savage firing pin spring pressure

[DShortt]

I have a Savage Model 12 in .223. Recently switched from Winchester SRP to CCI 450 primers because it's what I could find at the time. Last couple of range sessions I've had some FTFs. I read that the CCI primers are harder to set off and suspect I've got a weak spring. I've checked pin protrusion and it's .052". My primer cups have been evened and are .119" both of which are in spec or so my research tells me. It's difficult to measure the gap between the cooking piece pin and bolt body but it's not bottomed out.
I suspect the spring has become weak and might also explain some accuracy issues. Just to be through I'd like to check the spring tension but my Google Foo is failing me and I can't find a figure anywhere.
Hoping someone here might know what the spring pressure should be? Probably going to order a pin and spring anyway, but I like to know I'm doing something for a good reason and not just swapping parts and hoping for an improvement.

Edit to add -current spring shows 25lbs on a bathroom scale.

Thanks for looking.

 

[DLT]

I went through the same process as you are. I ended up buying a firing pin spring. Once in a blue moon I’ll have a failure to fire. My bump is set correctly. Cci 450s have been having misfire issues of late I have come to learn

 

[DShortt]

I went through the same process as you are. I ended up buying a firing pin spring. Once in a blue moon I’ll have a failure to fire. My bump is set correctly. Cci 450s have been having misfire issues of late I have come to learn

Great.

Are you still using the 450s or have you switched to something else?

 

[DLT]

Great.

Are you still using the 450s or have you switched to something else?

I am still using 450s. It’s all that would turn up when the pandemic hit so I bought and bought and bought. They are still all that shows up on the local shelves BUT I have not had any misfires since I got through that 1 sleeve it had 7 or 8 duds in it

 

[DShortt]

OK. I've had 1 sleeve with 7 that didn't fire so far but I've still got half the sleeve left. Did you perhaps ever get a number for the expected spring pressure? As noted above mine is 25lbs on a bathroom scale.

 

[DLT]

No sir I did not

OK. I've had 1 sleeve with 7 that didn't fire so far but I've still got half the sleeve left. Did you perhaps ever get a number for the expected spring pressure? As noted above mine is 25lbs on a bathroom scale.

 

[1911nut]

Wolff only lists springs for the 110 - probably the same as 12?

 

[DShortt]

I don't know. My understanding is that the any model with a three digit prefix beginning with a 1 is a long action (110, 112, 116) where as a 2 digit prefix is a short action (10, 12).
Not sure if that is 100% accurate and I'd think the spring would simply be longer but since there is possibly more mass to the pin and inertia.......

That sort of thing is above my pay grade so I hate to take a guess. Having said that their reference for a standard spring is 28 lbs. Mine is 25. Is that enough to matter? Again, I hate to guess. Funny thing there is they specify a short action so maybe my understanding of the model number system is wrong.

 

[DLT]

I don't know. My understanding is that the any model with a three digit prefix beginning with a 1 is a long action (110, 112, 116) where as a 2 digit prefix is a short action (10, 12).
Not sure if that is 100% accurate and I'd think the spring would simply be longer but since there is possibly more mass to the pin and inertia.......

That sort of thing is above my pay grade so I hate to take a guess. Having said that their reference for a standard spring is 28 lbs. Mine is 25. Is that enough to matter? Again, I hate to guess.

I got mine from midway. I’ll send a link if I can

This is what I bought for my model 12 223

Wolff Extra Power Firing Pin Spring Savage 10 Series Short Action 32

These extra-power striker springs make the striker move faster and hit harder to reduce misfires and lock time. To the shooter, the faster the firing...

www.midwayusa.com

 

[DShortt]

I got mine from midway. I’ll send a link if I can

Much appreciated!

 

[RedfootRanch]

I have a Savage Model 12 in .223. Recently switched from Winchester SRP to CCI 450 primers because it's what I could find at the time. Last couple of range sessions I've had some FTFs. I read that the CCI primers are harder to set off and suspect I've got a weak spring. I've checked pin protrusion and it's .052". My primer cups have been evened and are .119" both of which are in spec or so my research tells me. It's difficult to measure the gap between the cooking piece pin and bolt body but it's not bottomed out.
I suspect the spring has become weak and might also explain some accuracy issues. Just to be through I'd like to check the spring tension but my Google Foo is failing me and I can't find a figure anywhere.
Hoping someone here might know what the spring pressure should be? Probably going to order a pin and spring anyway, but I like to know I'm doing something for a good reason and not just swapping parts and hoping for an improvement.

Edit to add -current spring shows 25lbs on a bathroom scale.

Thanks for looking.View attachment 1426667

I have seen more times than not that a FTF is caused by the primer not seated to the bottom of the primer pocket. The firing pin energy is absorbed/used pushing the primer deeper. Are these still live rounds or has the primer been struck again so this is indicating a spent primer? Live or spent, what is the depth below the case head to them primer as pictured here?

 

[Dusty Stevens]

New spring time. 24 may not be where a savage is supposed to be. I suspect its more plus you may have some rubbing slowing it down. Are you seating the primers by feel?

 

[DShortt]

New spring time. 24 may not be where a savage is supposed to be. I suspect its more plus you may have some rubbing slowing it down. Are you seating the primers by feel?

Yes. I always hand prime for this very reason. Primer pockets are all uniformed as well as that's part of my normal brass prep process. From what I can tell after looking all afternoon is that 25lbs is the factory spec.

I'm inclined to think I don't like CCI 450 primers for this rifle. Might be fine in other applications. I might be able to get them to work with a 32 lb spring but is that the ideal solution?

 

[DLT]

Yes. I always hand prime for this very reason. Primer pockets are all uniformed as well as that's part of my normal brass prep process. From what I can tell after looking all afternoon is that 25lbs is the factory spec.

I'm inclined to think I don't like CCI 450 primers for this rifle. Might be fine in other applications. I might be able to get them to work with a 32 lb spring but is that the ideal solution?

Try a spring swap it’s probably past due and for the price it can’t hurt except for the aggravation of installing it.

 

[Old Navy]

I don't think you would have a problem trading them for another brand. Those hits look good to me.

 

[DShortt]

I don't think you would have a problem trading them for another brand. Those hits look good to me.

I'm definitely going to try that.

 

[spudgun]

Before you buy a spring, check what you got. Take the bolt handle off the bolt and pull out the spring. Savage made some changes to the spring.

My latest Savage 110 has a 3 piece spring assembly. It was NOT a 1 piece spring.

Your model 12 may have a 1 piece.

I was getting light strikes and when I went to inspect the spring it came out in 3 pieces. I thought I broke the spring but was wrong.

If you have a 3 piece spring let me know. I found on a Savage forum a spacer info that will replace the center washer between the 2 main springs. i have my friend machine me one out off the blue prints that I got off the forum.

If you decock the firing pin you will see what I am talking about.

 

[DShortt]

Before you buy a spring, check what you got. Take the bolt handle off the bolt and pull out the spring. Savage made some changes to the spring.

My latest Savage 110 has a 3 piece spring assembly. It was NOT a 1 piece spring.

Your model 12 may have a 1 piece.

I was getting light strikes and when I went to inspect the spring it came out in 3 pieces. I thought I broke the spring but was wrong.

If you have a 3 piece spring let me know. I found on a Savage forum a spacer info that will replace the center washer between the 2 main springs. i have my friend machine me one out off the blue prints that I got off the forum.

If you decock the firing pin you will see what I am talking about.

I removed the spring and pin and it has the one piece spring. I checked the tension on a bathroom scale and it shows 25 lbs which is in spec so far as I can tell but I ordered a new pin and spring assembly anyway. Going to replace the bolt head while I have it apart.

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

I wonder if there are any ammo manufacturers using the CCI 450 primer. If so would they provide any QA data concerning ftf caused by primer failure?

 

[spudgun]

I removed the spring and pin and it has the one piece spring. I checked the tension on a bathroom scale and it shows 25 lbs which is in spec so far as I can tell but I ordered a new pin and spring assembly anyway. Going to replace the bolt head while I have it apart.

Good, then you don't need to modify like I did.