223 REAMER ADVICE

[whatsupdoc]

That reamers dimensions scare me. Tight base diameter could lead to hard extraction and sizing issues. Short neck length could lead to issues if you aren't on top of trimming. I'm sure it may work well for some people.

Nothing to be concerned about, shoots fantastic no issues at all.
I think you are thinking of a different reamer.

 

[Welldone 7.5]

I bought a JGS 223 WYLDE.
Thanks for all the insight.

 

[PracticalTactical]

I have a couple of barrel blanks coming my way and now I need to get a reamer. On blank is 7 twist and the other is 8. I read a review of a rifle built on Ultimate Reloader that seems to about what I’m going to do. The reamer was aDave Manson 223 Fullbore T.15. I am not going to go crazy and try any of the super long heavies but I do want to shoot 75-80 grain bullets. This gun has AICS magazines.
I have called Mansons like 10 times but they never answer. I have emailed them too. No reply. I don’t mind buying a used reamer in good shape but I really need to figure out which reamer is best.
THANKS FOR LOOKING

You might consider lengthening your AI mags so the mag length does not limit your OAL.

Nothing worse than neutering the 223 with an unnecessarily short OAL that robs you of max velocity and the benefit of the alignment characteristics offered by the free bore.

This can be done with either the AccurateMags or the steel MDT mags.

Personally I run my OAL at 2.650 with 88s and 90s, so this mag mod for me is a must.

BTW I run 88s and 90s in the range of 2800 FPS to 2900 FPS depending on how I sized the case and current temperature.

Here's how the pressures crunch if your interested.

For whatever reason, my actual velocity is faster than this program calculates it to be.

 

[Evlshnngns]

The wylde is a great choice for 77 and 75, matches nice to an 8 twist. My CBI "match" chamber has .090. By my measurements .155 would be good with nosler 80gr cc., .2+ would work with the 88s. I'm going to get a throat tool, I have plenty of 80 and 88s and it's a 7 twist single shot.

 

[InnaWoods86]

Just get a .223 Wylde. Doing some load work up I shot this 5 shot group with 8208 and 75 ELDs through thick mirage. The Wylde is a good do it all chamber.

View attachment 1322993

Who did your barrel work

 

[Rob01]

Who did your barrel work

Josh at Patriot Valley Arms. He does great work and if you need a barrel they have Osprey barrels in stock. Very accurate barrels.

 

[InnaWoods86]

Josh at Patriot Valley Arms. He does great work and if you need a barrel they have Osprey barrels in stock. Very accurate barrels.

I'm wanting to load 75elds at 2.500 and or 80.5 Bergers at 2.450. will standard Wylde work for this. Thanks

 

[Rob01]

I'm wanting to load 75elds at 2.500 and or 80.5 Bergers at 2.450. will standard Wylde work for this. Thanks

Not sure on the Bergers but I’m at .020” off lands at 2.470” with the 75 elds.

 

[urbanrifleman]

Oh I know and agree... I was just saying that PTG 223 match reamer seems like it could cause issues.

This is 5 88gr Elds from a 223 wylde with H4895
View attachment 1323026

Maybe with new brass but once you form a donut it's going to start acting crazy.

 

[urbanrifleman]

I'm wanting to load 75elds at 2.500 and or 80.5 Bergers at 2.450. will standard Wylde work for this. Thanks

Yes those two bullets don't require any kind of special reamer. The 223 wylde chamber is 60 free bore and works perfectly for those.

 

[LVLAaron]

Wylde.

JGS and Manson have them on the shelf.

 

[jlorenzo]

Maybe with new brass but once you form a donut it's going to start acting crazy.

What is the donut?

 

[ta6ppc]

What is the donut?

Its a brass deformation caused by brass flow into the shoulder junction. Bushing dies pronounce the donut some ream it out an IDOD will take care of it.. most people ignore it and seat the bullet above where it forms but this takes proper freebore because the oal is gonna be really long

 

[jlorenzo]

Its a brass deformation caused by brass flow into the shoulder junction. Bushing dies pronounce the donut some ream it out an IDOD will take care of it.. most people ignore it and seat the bullet above where it forms but this takes proper freebore because the oal is gonna be really long

Brass flow from sizing or firing? How does it relate to the boat tail/bearing surface junction being seated in the neck or out?

 

[memilanuk]

Brass flow from sizing or firing? How does it relate to the boat tail/bearing surface junction being seated in the neck or out?

As I understand it... a little bit of both.

When the cartridge is fired, the firing pin is going to shove the case forward until it stops (assuming a rimless bottleneck cartridge case like a .223 Rem for the sake of discussion) on the shoulder, then sets off the primer. The powder ignites, builds pressure, and seals the case neck against the chamber walls. There's an ever so slight amount of space now between the bolt face and the cartridge head, and the case body stretches back to it. Not sure if I'm explaining that perfectly, but hopefully you get the gist.

Likewise, when you size the cartridge case, you are squeezing the case into a hole that is smaller than itself (currently). Some of that gets pressed in, but it's more like squeezing a tube of toothpaste: Even when you push the shoulder 'back', some of that material getting displaced is going to basically extrude out the top of the die, via the case neck. As the case has different wall thickness, going from the web, up the body to the shoulder, then through the shoulder to the neck... as that thicker metal in the shoulder gets displaced, it moves into the junction of the neck and shoulder, creating a slightly tighter spot.

Bushing dies typically don't size quite all the way to the shoulder, so that tight spot maybe lasts a littler longer before it becomes an issue. Either way, it's less than ideal to use your bullet as an expander mandrel to push that donut out of the way (swaging 70/30 cartridge brass using a copper-jacketed lead slug = no bueno). Some sort of expander - ball or mandrel - helps to move that brass to the outside of the case neck, assuming there is adequate clearance in the chamber. Or, if as mentioned above, the bullet is seated so that the body/boat-tail junction stays above (some advocate keeping it 30+ thou above) the case neck/shoulder junction... the bullet will never touch the donut, and it becomes a moot point.

 

[jlorenzo]

As I understand it... a little bit of both.

When the cartridge is fired, the firing pin is going to shove the case forward until it stops (assuming a rimless bottleneck cartridge case like a .223 Rem for the sake of discussion) on the shoulder, then sets off the primer. The powder ignites, builds pressure, and seals the case neck against the chamber walls. There's an ever so slight amount of space now between the bolt face and the cartridge head, and the case body stretches back to it. Not sure if I'm explaining that perfectly, but hopefully you get the gist.

Likewise, when you size the cartridge case, you are squeezing the case into a hole that is smaller than itself (currently). Some of that gets pressed in, but it's more like squeezing a tube of toothpaste: Even when you push the shoulder 'back', some of that material getting displaced is going to basically extrude out the top of the die, via the case neck. As the case has different wall thickness, going from the web, up the body to the shoulder, then through the shoulder to the neck... as that thicker metal in the shoulder gets displaced, it moves into the junction of the neck and shoulder, creating a slightly tighter spot.

Bushing dies typically don't size quite all the way to the shoulder, so that tight spot maybe lasts a littler longer before it becomes an issue. Either way, it's less than ideal to use your bullet as an expander mandrel to push that donut out of the way (swaging 70/30 cartridge brass using a copper-jacketed lead slug = no bueno). Some sort of expander - ball or mandrel - helps to move that brass to the outside of the case neck, assuming there is adequate clearance in the chamber. Or, if as mentioned above, the bullet is seated so that the body/boat-tail junction stays above (some advocate keeping it 30+ thou above) the case neck/shoulder junction... the bullet will never touch the donut, and it becomes a moot point.

So it can be both on the outside of the case and the inside? What symptoms occur when it becomes pronounced? About how many firings before it happens? I am currently using a standard non bushing FL die.

 

[memilanuk]

I think it mostly forms on the inside, but depending on how you process your brass i.e. with an expander ball/mandrel it can get moved to the outside.

Easiest way to tell if you have a donut is to take a fired, unsized case and drop a bullet down the neck. If it stops before dropping all the way into the body... you have a donut. As far as how many firings... no idea. I seat my bullets well clear of the donut region, so I don't worry about it.

 

[jlorenzo]

I think it mostly forms on the inside, but depending on how you process your brass i.e. with an expander ball/mandrel it can get moved to the outside.

Easiest way to tell if you have a donut is to take a fired, unsized case and drop a bullet down the neck. If it stops before dropping all the way into the body... you have a donut. As far as how many firings... no idea. I seat my bullets well clear of the donut region, so I don't worry about it.

Would a regular full length die have this issue? Always another can of worms...

 

[memilanuk]

Probably. I've never really seen a clear (to my mind) explanation of why people think bushing dies make it 'worse'.

 

[USMCDOC]

When i was shooting the .223 pretty much exclusively, i used the Wylde chamber and throat the lead so that the Berger 90 VLD's were seated in the case where the boat and the bearing surface meet would be about 10 thou above the neck shoulder joint. That way, i would never have to worry about any donuts. I tried that ISSF reamer once.. didn't care for it. I personally would not ever use that reamer again.. I'll stick with the Wylde.