01 FFL?

[LVLAaron]

Been considering if/when to get my FFL to do work on customer owned equipment. I've been looking at RocketFFL to just get my head wrapped around everything I need to know...

Any tips from the mentors here?

 

[DaveTooley]

Call your local ATF office and ask some questions. As long as you meet the local codes for operating a business from I'm assuming your house, they can't say no. From what I remember it's a pretty straight forward form.
With that being said you can get pretty deep into a "hobby" without having an FFL. Pushing over that first domino sets a lot of things in motion. Incorporation, sales tax, local business licensing requirements etc.

 

[Ggmac]

call ATFE for first hand information. As stated above . Do not trust any second hand info , they will walk you through and possibly send some books .
Also consider Liability insurance, security and state or city license cost . Liability insurance is a must now for you and your family even if you incorporate.

 

[Walt Krafft]

If you are going to assemble parts into a finished firearm like an AR15, you will need a 07 license. That will require someway to engrave the firearm.

 

[tobnpr]

Course is stupid shit.
Make sure ZONING is correct, whether home shop or commercially zoned.
No reason to get an 01 as mentioned- just get the 07, ITAR is no longer an issue for most gunsmiths.

 

[Tucker65]

I spoke with a ATF agent about marking a firearm after chambering a barrel. The agent told me that as a 07 ffl you're considered a manufacturer and that I would need to envrave my ffl information on the receiver. They said the original serial number could be used but I would need to add my ffl name, city, and state on the receiver. I questioned them about this and asked if they wanted this on the barrel but they said the actual receiver. It didn't make any sense to me as to why they would want duplicate engravings on the receiver but I didn't want to argue with them about it either.

Anyone else here anything about this. Supposedly it's something coming down the road in the near future.

 

[Shrek]

The ATF under the new 4th Reich is going to squeeze FFL’s out any way possible. Good people are going to get hurt badly over uncrossed t’s and undotted i’s. They’re just getting going but once the program gets up to speed it’ll be a wrecking ball. Be very careful what you do.

 

[tobnpr]

I spoke with a ATF agent about marking a firearm after chambering a barrel. The agent told me that as a 07 ffl you're considered a manufacturer and that I would need to envrave my ffl information on the receiver. They said the original serial number could be used but I would need to add my ffl name, city, and state on the receiver. I questioned them about this and asked if they wanted this on the barrel but they said the actual receiver. It didn't make any sense to me as to why they would want duplicate engravings on the receiver but I didn't want to argue with them about it either.

Anyone else here anything about this. Supposedly it's something coming down the road in the near future.

Not correct. That information can be (and usually is) engraved on the barrel- though it can be placed on the receiver. Your Field Agent was misinformed, no gray area here.

Obviously, this is different if you manufactured the receiver.

"By engraving, casting....on the frame, receiver, or barrel thereof certain information..."
Read 27 CFR, 478.91

In my experience, smiths have little to be concerned about with BATFE inspections. They're more concerned about sales- not service guys. I've always found my local field office to be very helpful and friendly in addressing any questions I've had. No fear mongering for me.

 

[Dusty Stevens]

I spoke with a ATF agent about marking a firearm after chambering a barrel. The agent told me that as a 07 ffl you're considered a manufacturer and that I would need to envrave my ffl information on the receiver. They said the original serial number could be used but I would need to add my ffl name, city, and state on the receiver. I questioned them about this and asked if they wanted this on the barrel but they said the actual receiver. It didn't make any sense to me as to why they would want duplicate engravings on the receiver but I didn't want to argue with them about it either.

Anyone else here anything about this. Supposedly it's something coming down the road in the near future.

If youre not the manufacturer of the receiver you shouldnt mark it as such

 

[Tucker65]

If youre not the manufacturer of the receiver you shouldnt mark it as such

I brought that up with the agent but they said the receiver was manufactured as a receiver. When you chamber a barrel and assemble it they said now you are the manufacturer of a firearm and it needs to be marked with your ffl information. Hopefully my agent is misinformed but that is what I was told.

 

[Dusty Stevens]

I brought that up with the agent but they said the receiver was manufactured as a receiver. When you chamber a barrel and assemble it they said now you are the manufacturer of a firearm and it needs to be marked with your ffl information. Hopefully my agent is misinformed but that is what I was told.

It was already in the books at the mfr. just nod your head. That agent will move on someday and youll get another one

 

[tobnpr]

I brought that up with the agent but they said the receiver was manufactured as a receiver. When you chamber a barrel and assemble it they said now you are the manufacturer of a firearm and it needs to be marked with your ffl information. Hopefully my agent is misinformed but that is what I was told.

A little clarification as to where there may have been a "misunderstanding" from either or both parties.

If I buy a new receiver (as a licensee)- the seller does not report it as having been "distributed into commerce", and it is not reported on their annual AMFER ( a required manufacturing report for 07's) as a newly manufactured firearm. After the receiver is barreled and sold- "distributed into commerce"- it is reported in the annual count of manufactured firearms on my AMFER.

So, insofar as AMFER reporting, I did "manufacture" that completed firearm- but I did not actually manufacture the receiver.

If the OP intends, or even anticipates that at some point he might want to purchase receivers (whether bolt guns, or AR lowers, etc), build them out and sell them- an 07 is required. This cannot be done with an 01.

Disclaimer- I am not an attorney. Above represents my understanding of the governing CFR statutes.

 

[spitfire_er]

With the the new rules coming down, the way I read it starting in August, 07's such as myself will need to mark the receivers as well, along with numerous other parts with a SN. Barrel marking alone won't be sufficient anymore.

01's and 07's will also be required to mark your info on any "privately made firearm" that comes into your shop w/o a SN. This sounds like a liability nightmare. Making me basically responsible for someone else's shotty work, or if it ends up in the wrong hands.

ATF has a "presentation" on 6-14 and 6-16 trying to help clarify some info for FFL's.

To me sounds like its going to be more hassle and more confusion all around, especially for manufacturers using already marked receivers.

I also wonder if they are going to make us mark "collector" firearms that never had a serial # on them. Will destroy the value of each one of those.

 

[tobnpr]

ATF has a "presentation" on 6-14 and 6-16 trying to help clarify some info for FFL's.

Edited...
Yeah, I've gotten the emails. Guess I'll have to set aside the time for one of them.
WTF can they talk about for 2 hours?

 

[Judd]

Well, are they screwing things up…like everything else this admin has touched?

 

[Tucker65]

This is a page from their new rule. From what I interpret if you're chambering barrels you'll need to have an 07 ffl which will designate you as a manufacturer. Under their new rule this will require you to mark the receiver, not the barrel, with your ffl info. It doesn't make sense to me but that's how I'm reading the new rule that is supposed to be going in to affect. Hopefully this is not the case. It would suck to have to engrave another manufacturers name on a receiver just because you chambered and screwed the barrel on it. And if it was already Nutrided or some other finish on it you'd have to deal with that also.

 

[tobnpr]

^^^
I believe you're reading that incorrectly. I was confused on this as well during the oral presentation.

It starts by stating "each firearm manufactured or imported"- so that applies only to newly manufactured firearms. I can't think of any firearm that has been serialized on the barrel in the past, so I have no idea how that's a "change".

The second paragraph mentions the usual caliber markings etc can still be placed on the barrel. Re-barreling a receiver isn't "manufacturing".

 

[DaveTooley]

I agree. I do a lot of barrels with no receiver in the shop. Many businesses do. Think AR uppers and barrels. Many firearm manufactures contract out their barrel work.

 

[Dead Eye]

When do these changes take effect?

 

[Walt Krafft]

As I understand it, the problem of non-serial numbered home built guns occures when they are put into commerce instead of being destroyed. I personally will not put my name on something I didn't make.