Redding body die— very short headspace

[Hohn]

Are these body dies designed to require the competition shell holder kit?

Im seeing nearly 0.007” more shoulder bump with the die in hard contact with the Redding shell holder than I get with my Forster sizer at similar contact to the same shell holder. The net bump with the Forster is perfect. With the Redding body die it is excessive. (Fired in chamber right at go gauge plus 0.002”).

 

[DirtySteve]

Then don't make contact with the shell holder...! Just because a car goes 120 mph does not mean you have to drive it that fast..

 

[Bc'z]

Slip a .005 feeler gauge between shell holder and die, then tell us what happens.

 

[mike mccormick]

The body dies are designed to give more shoulder bump

 

[Hohn]

The body dies are designed to give more shoulder bump

Thanks Mike. The workaround is obvious but I’m intrigued that Redding would find a need/benefit to bumping shoulder so far beyond saami min.

 

[Walt Krafft]

Thanks Mike. The workaround is obvious but I’m intrigued that Redding would find a need/benefit to bumping shoulder so far beyond saami min.

The die must push the shoulder back enough to have saami mininum after spring back. Work hardened brass will spring back a lot.

 

[D-4297]

By way of explanation ; a "Body Die" is designed to reduce the diameter of the case , back to "so-called" SAAMI spec , and by doing this , that brass has to go somewhere . The only logical place for it to go is towards the case-mouth . Thus increasing the over-all length of the case , and also adding to the length of the "Bump-back" of the shoulder . After the Body-Die , re-size with the die you normally use , but you may find out you need to trim and de-burr again . Body Dies are made for Diameter reduction . Not length or chamber sizing .

 

[mikecr]

ANY given die is going to be perfect, or less than perfect, for YOUR chamber.
So then you adjust. That's what adjustments are for, and there are various ways to choose from.

 

[JFrank]

Thanks Mike. The workaround is obvious but I’m intrigued that Redding would find a need/benefit to bumping shoulder so far beyond saami min.

A lot of people would like to have your problem, as Brett said back the die off a few thousand.

 

[Hohn]

A lot of people would like to have your problem, as Brett said back the die off a few thousand.

Are you saying that people are running super-short chambers or--as Walt explained-- that they have very hard brass that doesn't get enough bump with regular dies?

 

[Hohn]

ANY given die is going to be perfect, or less than perfect, for YOUR chamber.
So then you adjust. That's what adjustments are for, and there are various ways to choose from.

As this is a savage that has the headspace set at barrel installation, (presently at 1.5-2 thou over go gauge), I guess it just happened to be luck that the Forster gives just perfect bump for this near-minimum chamber.

I bought the redding to use with a LCD and experiment a bit on sizing techniques. I'm not saying the big bump is a bad thing, it's just a surprising contrast with the Forster. I guess someone running the Forster in a truly minimum chamber would be screwed if their brass was pretty hard. At that point, having the Redding would be most useful indeed.

 

[Lefty Trigger]

I had a Winchester 243 rifle years ago that was seriously short chambered. No die I ever tried would push the shoulder back enough. A member on here shortened the die for me, I gave the die to the guy that bought that rifle and told him to keep it with the gun.

 

[Bc'z]

As this is a savage that has the headspace set at barrel installation, (presently at 1.5-2 thou over go gauge), I guess it just happened to be luck that the Forster gives just perfect bump for this near-minimum chamber.

I bought the redding to use with a LCD and experiment a bit on sizing techniques. I'm not saying the big bump is a bad thing, it's just a surprising contrast with the Forster. I guess someone running the Forster in a truly minimum chamber would be screwed if their brass was pretty hard. At that point, having the Redding would be most useful indeed.

The Forster sounds like it's sizing about the same as my 6.5-284 FL die.
Even with annealed brass it wasn't bumping shoulder back, instead it was holding shoulder at fired case datum measurements when die was installed touching shell holder.
My buddy Mark Skaggs faced off a shell holder removing .011" now the Redding die bumps shoulder back
.0015-.002" when it's set up touching modified shell holder.

No dies were harmed or molested in this lesson I learned.

After next firing I'll be investigating a
Wilson FL bushing die to see how it does.

 

[yotehater]

The worst instructions I ever followed were to contact the shell holder. I ruined a lot of brass learning to reload the correct way.

 

[kvd]

After next firing I'll be investigating a
Wilson FL bushing die to see how it does.

You'll be happy with the Wilson Die - especially if you need to have it adjusted to properly size the case to fit your chamber. Wilson will do this for the cost of shipping if you send them 3 fired cases. Other manufacturers may do the same thing but I'm only familiar with the Wilson service.

 

[AlNyhus]

As this is a savage that has the headspace set at barrel installation, (presently at 1.5-2 thou over go gauge), I guess it just happened to be luck that the Forster gives just perfect bump for this near-minimum chamber.

Yes...luck is correct.

How Redding does their Body Dies is really the best situation for anyone using them.

Good shootin'. -Al

 

[JMayo]

The setting the "manual procedure" calls for is very generalized. Your gauges and calipers tell you how the dies need to be set.
I have pma tools on my dies and I adjust when calipers say is needed. Sometimes the lube amount on the cases change things by as much as half a thou....

 

[Bc'z]

The worst instructions I ever followed were to contact the shell holder. I ruined a lot of brass learning to reload the correct way.

In what way was the brass ruined?
Curious is all.
Its been my experience even with die touching shell holder once brass is inside of die there's a gap between shell holder and die.

You'll be happy with the Wilson Die - especially if you need to have it adjusted to properly size the case to fit your chamber. Wilson will do this for the cost of shipping if you send them 3 fired cases. Other manufacturers may do the same thing but I'm only familiar with the Wilson service.

I had a over sizing issue with my Wilson 06' die. I sent 3 fired, and 1 new piece. I recieved a new die in return. Great service and tools.
I purchased the 6.5-284 die as I'm more of a bushing kind of guy versus expander mandrel. We'll see how it functions in about a week.

 

[yotehater]

In what way was the brass ruined?
Curious is all.
Its been my experience even with die touching shell holder once brass is inside of die there's a gap between shell holder and die.

Excessive headspace, stretched brass, insipient case separation, constant trimming...

 

[Keith Glasscock]

I have found that Competition Shellholders are needed for all of my Redding FL
dies.