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Remington extraction cam fix

msalm

So in the past I’ve solved the new Rem 700 extraction cam shortage in a few ways to include a new handle TIG welded in the proper place, use the existing handle doing the same, and even TIG welding some material at the root of the handle and closing the excessive gap between bolt and action cam.

This week I was messing around with a previously built 7mm-08 and really didn’t want to mess with refinishing the bolt so tried something else. I drilled a 1/8” hole perpendicular (or close anyway) to the cam surface on the bolt 1/4” deep or so and installed a dowel pin cut to the proper length and polished. I suspect the same could be done on the action itself. The cam distance went from close to zero to close to .100” and took all of 10 minutes to accomplish. Bolt operates smoothly and has no hang-ups anywhere in the manipulation of the bolt. Now this doesn’t address a thing about ‘timing’ other than before this mod the sear wouldn’t reset if just lifting the bolt handle and pushing back down as the cocking piece wouldn’t retract at all...now it does.

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Just a little FYI sharing.

Oh, and please excuse the drill rub mark on the bolt body as there just wasn’t enough clearance to get a little center drill in there and I didn’t take the time to center punch a good starting point.
 
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I fixed the same problem on a Remage project. . . with 3 seconds of arc-time with my MIG welder. Sat the base of the bolt down in a water bath to protect against heating, plenty of masking tape, welded exactly that spot, and filed/polished down afterward.
 
I've done a similar thing and it worked fine. Something has to be done on virtually every Remington 700 bolt if it was made in the last twenty or thirty years. Often the rotation is right, the location of the handle is right, but the location of the extraction cam is wrong. The thing that gets me is that it's not just kind of wrong, it's not even close. The official line is; the 700 is supposed to cock on closing. We didn't want to make it right. WH
 
Dave you beat me to it, I was going to mention your great work. You done it on my 700 that you built for me back in the mid 90's. Awesome work.

Tom Roupe
 
Dusty Stevens said:
They think its right because every one of them have the same gap
Click to expand...

I’m thinking there’s got to be some reason they abandoned primary extraction. I have 700’s made both ways.

If had to guess, and it’s only a guess, when these bolts became interchangeable or replaceable items in large arsenals, a bolt or dirty one, that hit the cam surface too soon was more of a problem on the critical (smoothness of or) closure than impaired primary extraction was, - not a major issue if new brass is always being used, which I believe is military norm.
 
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If that was the case, every other manufacturer would have abandoned primary extraction as well. Instead, companies designed and built actions which worked. Mausers and Enfields closed fine and extracted like a hot damn.
No, Remington simply screwed up due to poor methodology and poor QC. WH
 
But making that many, all the same way though, that’s why I believe it’s intentional. That, and that they surely have been told of and read of the issues hundreds of times.

The others you mention do cam, but users and manufacturers don’t necessarily arrive the same conclusions across time.

I also wonder whether the clip extractor or relatively thin bolt face that contains it played a role.
 
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"I also wonder whether the clip extractor or relatively thin face that contains it played a role."

That makes no sense at all. The case still has to come out of the chamber regardless.

It's just poor oversight by production engineers covering their ass in a less than supportive atmosphere.
 
It does have to come out, Dave, but if you merely lift the bolt and break the extractor after doing that a few times, because of built in leverage on swelled cases, you tend to blame the gun. If you open the bolt easily, but then go get a mallet and beat it backwards, and cause the same breakage, you quite convincingly broke your gun yourself.
 
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My guess, production guns shooting factory ammo extract just fine. 90% of shooters have no idea about extraction and just pull the bolt back.
 
The thing is, early 700's did have primary extraction; just like every successful bolt action rifle. NO manufacturer builds a rifle, which doesn't work, on purpose. By the way, I have NEVER seen a 700 on which the bolt wouldn't close because the extraction cam contacted too soon. That just isn't a "thing". I've been 'smithing on these things for over forty years, a few years of which was spent doing warranty repairs. A rifle with no primary extraction is flawed; and not on purpose. WH
 
Well, if they missed the mark counterclockwise by the same amount they keep doing accidentally all those years, the bolt won’t be closing.

The question for gunsmiths I’d have is how many times has Remington called it an error and fixed primary extraction.

Every single 700 is test fired. I’ve seen the steps. That round gets extracted by a person. If you do the same thing millions of times for decades, it stops being a mistake.

We know that Winchester called its “massive claw extractor” the strongest made. We know that Remington clip was scrutinized by writers. We know that the gun without extraction is not going to break, by lifting the bolt on a stuck case. We also know that it does break if you beat it out on the bolt handle, instead of using a rod, which I imagine constitutes abuse, and is not Remington’s responsibility.

You guys smithing aren’t necessarily going to fix a lot of broken extractors because we can handle that, and because explaining it means we did something dumb.

And lastly, we know that you cannot get to the point of using a rod to harmlessly remove a stuck case, if you have already broken the extractor or face of the bolt lifting the handle with primary extraction, so that the lugs will align with the raceways.
 
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If you pull the extractor out of a Remington it's either bad factory ammo (high pressure) or bad ammo ( high pressure and/or improperly sized brass) you loaded. The extractor just doesn't have a fainting spell one day and pulls out. It's always self inflicted.
I've been doing this almost 40 years and I replace very few Remington extractors.
Does Remington have a problem with extraction timing? of course they do. I was expecting a change when we got to the RR series but they didn't/couldn't invest the resources to fix the problem.
I suspect there is a change coming with new ownership.
 
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