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Weird issue found with Whidden neck bushings

I bought a set of the Whidden 6mm bushings for my 6BR awhile back and have noticed weird sizing problems with them. My .266 bushing is way too tight but the .267 bushing is too loose and bullets fall in the case, however the .268 bushing seems just right. I measured the inside diameter of them and found these sizes.
.264 measures .261
.265 measures .262
.266 measures .262
.267 measures .267
.268 measures .265

My Redding .266 measures .264
I'm using these with both Lapua and Norma brass.
 
I had the exact same issue with the exact same diameter Whidden bushings.

Dusty is right. Pin gauges or 21st mandrels.

I don't trust any bushings to size how they're marked anymore.

After my experience with those 6mm bushings I measured every bushing I have for all calibers, and I'd guess only 50% size true to 'spec'.

Edit: Measure the sized brass, or pin gauges to actually measure the bushings. I misread.

Edit2: Just to be clear, my Redding bushings are the same way. I think it's all of them. They're like $20 per after all. How much precision machining do you expect for $20?
 
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Agree, I have found many things are not what they are supposed to be.... shell holders, mandrels, bushings, dies, etc. etc.

I have advised having a general set of gage pins many times, and also thinking about investing in something like a Deltronic set to measure neck size after sizing. Regular pins are often a 0.001” step, but some sets like the Deltronic pins cover a span of 0.0012” in steps of 0.0001”
 
I measured the inside diameter of them and found these sizes.
Agree with the comments by the others. If the bushings aren't coated, they are very easy to enlarge the opening in. Measure often as the material removes pretty quickly. I have hones I use on honing my FL sizing die necks, but have found the sandpaper wrapped around a wood dowel works just fine on the bushings. And you can improve/polish the surface finish of the inside of the busing as well.
 
Should they "actually" be the size marked on them or is .002 under the norm for tension?
Oh, I have also sent Whidden an e-mail asking about this issue.
 
Pin Gages can be bought in even sizes increments ie .1000 They can also be bought in half thousandths increments ie .1005 To further complicate each size can be bought in a plus or minus tolerance. The allowance on the tolerance is usually .0002 if you are purchasing Class ZZ pins. Look at MSC Direct or many other sources. Deltronic pins are availiable in .0001 increments with a +.000040 -.000000 tolerance. Plug gages are appx two dollars each versus Deltronics at approximately ten dollars each, buying either in quantity will help lower the cost. If you are going to start using pins to measure things you will want to have a very good micrometer to check the pins size. The micrometer should have resolution of .000050 and accuracy of the same. To get consistent measurements pins will need to be clean and kept at a consistent temperature and handled very carefully.

Hope this helps some of y'all.

G'Day
 
Some bushings can tend to have a slight taper where the center is supposed to be close to the diameter stamped. The top with the stamped numbers should be slightly narrower and the other side slightly looser. This is why turning the bushing over can give you a slight decrease in diameter.
Coated bushings can measure a couple thou more than plain stainless.

Measuring the bushings with a caliper can also give misleading results because of the square edges hitting different spots on the inner diameter of the bushing. Pin gauges will be more accurate and you can use them to confirm if your bushings have a slight taper by measuring both side of a bushing.
A tapered bushing will allow a pin gauge (that is very close to exact), to enter but not fall all the way through.

My 21st century mandrels are all under by exactly -.005. Pin gauges are usually ordered as plus or minus.
You can accurately measure the diameter of your pin gauge with your calipers.
 
A timely subject since I will be receiving my Whidden dies with bushing set tomorrow.

Does this make you wonder how accurate their dies are for sizing?

I'm new at reloading, but my first set of dies is whidden non-bushing type for my 6.5CM. I can't really say whether it is more accurate than others because I have nothing to compare it to, but I can say that the set is exceptionally well crafted, and my bullet seating is dead-on. I ordered the second set for my .223 because I have been so impressed with the first set. I'm sure Dusty will chime in shortly to reiterate the quality of Whidden dies. Maybe not so much for their bushings.
 
I bought a set of the Whidden 6mm bushings for my 6BR awhile back and have noticed weird sizing problems with them. My .266 bushing is way too tight but the .267 bushing is too loose and bullets fall in the case, however the .268 bushing seems just right. I measured the inside diameter of them and found these sizes.
.264 measures .261
.265 measures .262
.266 measures .262
.267 measures .267
.268 measures .265

My Redding .266 measures .264
I'm using these with both Lapua and Norma brass.

First and foremost, if you think you have a problem with a manufacturers product the best process is to contact them directly, not a public forum. John Whidden has great customer service and can solve your problem after examining the bushings.

Second and as pointed out, your measurements are dependent on the type of tool you've chosen to use for measuring. Simple calipers are NOT the tool of choice for any degree of accuracy. Hole Micrometers or precision pins are the best options.

Call John, he'll fix this.

Does this make you wonder how accurate their dies are for sizing?

No, it doesn't.

I have over a dozen sets of John's dies which all perform as expected to the degree of accuracy I need. I have no concerns whatsoever and will continue to buy them.
 
Pin Gages can be bought in even sizes increments ie .1000 They can also be bought in half thousandths increments ie .1005 To further complicate each size can be bought in a plus or minus tolerance. The allowance on the tolerance is usually .0002 if you are purchasing Class ZZ pins. Look at MSC Direct or many other sources. Deltronic pins are availiable in .0001 increments with a +.000040 -.000000 tolerance. Plug gages are appx two dollars each versus Deltronics at approximately ten dollars each,...
To accurately measure a range of bushings it would take a wide array of gauge pins in very fine increments.

If anyone wants their 6mm to .308 bushings measured just mail them to me with $8 for return shipping and I will use my 3pt hole mic. It’s accurate within .0001 and that’s actually better than gauge pins unless you have the perfect set of very finely graduated pins.

That said, I’m sure Whidden would support you too. My offering is not to be compared to Johns support.
 
Its normal. If you want a bushing true to size and square you have to make them. Not much different to a custom die, if you want to be sure you have to make it your self.
 
I measured 22 Redding bushings using a Mit id mic. The worst was a coated bushing that was a full thou smaller than stamped but the rest were all within a few tenths.
 
First and foremost, if you think you have a problem with a manufacturers product the best process is to contact them directly, not a public forum. John Whidden has great customer service and can solve your problem after examining the bushings.

Second and as pointed out, your measurements are dependent on the type of tool you've chosen to use for measuring. Simple calipers are NOT the tool of choice for any degree of accuracy. Hole Micrometers or precision pins are the best options.

Call John, he'll fix this.



No, it doesn't.

I have over a dozen sets of John's dies which all perform as expected to the degree of accuracy I need. I have no concerns whatsoever and will continue to buy them.
I have contacted them directly and I'm not bitching per say but if this is an issue then it needs to be on a public forum. This is the only way corrections get made, those little bushings are not cheap and I should get exactly what I paid for and nothing less. If their all janky and not to proper size then the "matched set" is useless because I have two different ones that measure the same. Regardless of how they are measured they are not right as a smaller one makes a larger hole and larger one makes a smaller hole, my brass tells me that.
 
Its normal. If you want a bushing true to size and square you have to make them. Not much different to a custom die, if you want to be sure you have to make it your self.
Not everybody has that ability to make their own die bushings. We have to rely on what we can purchase and hope for the best, clearly that is not always the case but we are at their mercy.
 
Just a couple of quick things to point out...

First off, we're happy to make things right if they're wrong with any of our products.

Second, Lefty Trigger has left us an email over the weekend. We'll certainly be in touch today but also please understand that we also like a day away from work.
 
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