Bullets leaving range hitting houses
- Thread starter ngoforth
- Start date
rkittine
Gold $$ Contributor
About 10 years ago, my home private club was accused of the same thing. The club is in The Hamptons, which in the winter has a predominantly Conservative population, but when the Summer Season Crowd hits, things swing to the left. Most of the Summer Only Crowd (also including weekenders more and more) have the most expensive houses with the highest taxes. Some 20,000 have signed a petition to try to get our gun club in East Hampton and the one in Southampton shut down along with either shutting down East Hampton Airport or tightly restricting it due to too many things to go into here.
So back to 10 years ago, a person probably 2 miles north and no in line with our rifle range, found a projectile in their yard and brought a suit against the club. There is a power line area in between the club and this house and people who don't belong to any of the clubs (they are all private here) shoot along the line. In all probability the projectile came from there. We had an independent engineer do all the math and geometry and unless someone stood outside of the shooting section and held a rifle on a ridiculous angle, the projectile could not possibly come from our club, but the home owner prevailed. Fortunately we did not get shut down, probably more because we let the local police departments use the pistol ranges for free.
What we did have to do though is install 4 foot square concrete tunnels, 30 feet long each at all of the rifle bench positions.
So now we have to shoot through a 30' tunnel so that we could not possibly elevate the gun to an angle that would go over our berm.
At the time this started we had 400 members and the cost was $150.00 per member. Not too bad, but no longer as much fun shooting rifles there.
Bob
So back to 10 years ago, a person probably 2 miles north and no in line with our rifle range, found a projectile in their yard and brought a suit against the club. There is a power line area in between the club and this house and people who don't belong to any of the clubs (they are all private here) shoot along the line. In all probability the projectile came from there. We had an independent engineer do all the math and geometry and unless someone stood outside of the shooting section and held a rifle on a ridiculous angle, the projectile could not possibly come from our club, but the home owner prevailed. Fortunately we did not get shut down, probably more because we let the local police departments use the pistol ranges for free.
What we did have to do though is install 4 foot square concrete tunnels, 30 feet long each at all of the rifle bench positions.
So now we have to shoot through a 30' tunnel so that we could not possibly elevate the gun to an angle that would go over our berm.
At the time this started we had 400 members and the cost was $150.00 per member. Not too bad, but no longer as much fun shooting rifles there.
Bob
Just to add but not to cause a conflict please let me say that at Camp Perry Ohio after the days pistol competitions with our 45 cal. 1911's we would stroll about the range picking up brass and inspecting the impact areas that our bullets made in the grass. What was obvious is that the bullets impacted the ground as they traveled to the 1000 yard rifle target frames several times before they could be found imbedded in the wooden target frames at 1000 yds. So to everyone watch your muzzle direction at all times. This with the 230 grain round noses.
A $33,000 electronic gate records personal data, time in & out at one club near me. The card has info. Membership is expensive. But it keeps a record of who is shooting. NRA membership required.
My club , no gate. Is $20 a year. But someone dumped a car into the pond. No one knew till low water in summer. Hazmat clean up , over $2000. Now if we had a gate..............
Seen out buildings with bullet hole. Even the outhouse got shot up. Some people just ruin it for others.
My club , no gate. Is $20 a year. But someone dumped a car into the pond. No one knew till low water in summer. Hazmat clean up , over $2000. Now if we had a gate..............
Seen out buildings with bullet hole. Even the outhouse got shot up. Some people just ruin it for others.
hpshooter
Gold $$ Contributor
"At our 60 year old club, we drill into all members the possibility of losing their club should any round leave the range. We have been called "fudds" on line because we insist on aimed fire only and don't allow full auto or bump fire. We don't care....we are not about to allow a careless act threaten our club."
Parallel experiences at our club. Those of us who are RSO's are often refereed to as "Range Nazis" Some folks do not understand that most ranges are only one carelessly fired shot from potentially being closed. and even fewer people understand the potential danger from low angle ground ricochets leaving the range.
Parallel experiences at our club. Those of us who are RSO's are often refereed to as "Range Nazis" Some folks do not understand that most ranges are only one carelessly fired shot from potentially being closed. and even fewer people understand the potential danger from low angle ground ricochets leaving the range.
MGYSGT
Silver $$ Contributor
The range in Prescott Az was on Federal property. Some folks built houses on the other side of the side berms and kept claiming their houses were being hit. Bullets without land and groove marks used as evidence. The range was closed down. Kind of like the people building houses under the flight path to an airport and then complaining about the noise.
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
99% of the time those houses were built after the range was there, kinda like building a subdivision next to a chicken house or railroad track.
Good thing it was only a .223
If it was a Creed it would have destroyed the house and left a crater 5’ deep
If it was a Creed it would have destroyed the house and left a crater 5’ deep
Airports like gun ranges are always built far from town, yet they have been under assault for decades. Developers buy land nearby for cheap, and then try to shut them down and reap a huge increase in value and profit. Keeping in mind that land value equates to tax income for the city, the scheme requires cooperation from city leaders and judges, all of whom participate in the same pension plan. See the connection?
Airport and gun range owners are robbed and frequently bankrupted to satisfy retirement plans for elected officials. Unfortunately that is what passes for serving the public in every city in America.
Airport and gun range owners are robbed and frequently bankrupted to satisfy retirement plans for elected officials. Unfortunately that is what passes for serving the public in every city in America.
I heard of one instance here where a realtor agent purposely avoided telling a prospective buyer that a gun range was in the area. The client found out after the deal was closed and they moved in.
Judges are elected here too, but who in the hell would vote for someone with NO experience. Altho sometimes common sense isn't so bad. I cam think of one around here I'd like to strangle the sumbitch.
And here I am thinking I'd buy that house to be so close to the range...
Out here is the wild west; we still have people getting hit in their house because somewhere else a group of people celebrating are firing their guns into the air...
Lots of open land though, so great shooting ranges. Just look at Raton, but please take caution in the city on a celebratory day.
-Mac
Out here is the wild west; we still have people getting hit in their house because somewhere else a group of people celebrating are firing their guns into the air...
Lots of open land though, so great shooting ranges. Just look at Raton, but please take caution in the city on a celebratory day.
-Mac
I remember almost buying a new home in a new neighborhood the developer said was not in the approach path the the nearby airport. When he told me that, I said "what are you talking about. These homes are directly under the pattern for the south runway. I've been watching these homes being built from my airplane. They're right under me when I'm landing". Being in Ca. where everyone sues for everything, they updated their sales speech. My wife lost a job while in closing and we backed out.
Some woman who'd been renting a home under the approach path for 9 years was offered an opportunity to buy it. She did, and then came to the next airport meeting ( I was there too as a flight school owner at that airport) and complained about aircraft noise and wanting to shut down the airport. To which I responded "you've been living there for 9 years and suddenly you're hearing aircraft noise after you bought your home. Couldn't be you imagine your home value would go up appreciably if the airport was closed?"
She was busted at that point and shut up.
I agree.
You would think common sense should win the day, and say, you built this house close to a Plant, gun range, airport, or whatever, and you knew it was there, so tough luck, but that's not the way it happens in most cases.
I have personal experience with a manufacturing plant that was built miles away from anything, as urban sprawl caught up with it, someone built a sub-division next door. Long story short, to end the lawsuits, the plant bought five or six houses that could feel the bump of the punch press, that was bumping years before they built the houses.
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Longtrain
Gold $$ Contributor
One club we frequent had to install baffles after one left the property and went through a garage and into a car parked inside. Town closed the range for a long time until an approved plan was implemented. Even then do-gooders campaigned to keep it shut down.
Another local range banned any position shooting after one left the property, since prone shooting was more likely to go over the hill, according to the clubs powers to be, that wasn’t a problem with bench shooters
Another club which has frequent matches, has strict rules on closing the bolt only when on the target (which is common sense), however RO’s still catch sling shooters with their rifle 45 degrees up, watching their targets come up through their spotting scopes, then loading a round in the same position, closing the bolt and then going into position. Generally, it’s a short match for those individuals.
Another local range banned any position shooting after one left the property, since prone shooting was more likely to go over the hill, according to the clubs powers to be, that wasn’t a problem with bench shooters
Another club which has frequent matches, has strict rules on closing the bolt only when on the target (which is common sense), however RO’s still catch sling shooters with their rifle 45 degrees up, watching their targets come up through their spotting scopes, then loading a round in the same position, closing the bolt and then going into position. Generally, it’s a short match for those individuals.
There’s a well known range near Spring, TX, that has a lot of skeet and trap and a huge store. They’ve been there for at least 50-60 years. They previously had a rifle range out to a real 200 yds and maybe farther than that if you time travel back far enough, but they’re now down to an actual 88 yds on their so-called “100 yd” rifle range, thanks to noise complaints from all the urban sprawlers who bought houses in a neighborhood that was built behind the range, and also thanks probably to the shooters that couldn’t hit the berm. Politicians (including elected judges) care about dollars and votes much more than about doing the right thing.
rkittine
Gold $$ Contributor
Land around out local airport in East Hampton was sold at really attractive prices. Starting in 1992 a buyer had to sign an affidavit that they knew they were near both the gun club and the airport and could not hold the township responsible or engage in a suit against either. Surprising how many buyers never knew that they signed that, when they signed so many documents at closing.
We are in the process of putting in cameras and new security protocols. Should help, but I am not sure how much. It is funny who are the biggest offenders at our club. You can guess.
Bob
We are in the process of putting in cameras and new security protocols. Should help, but I am not sure how much. It is funny who are the biggest offenders at our club. You can guess.
Bob
jackieschmidt
Gold $$ Contributor
At the Tomball Gun Cub northwest of Houston, we were hit with several lawsuits through the years from developers trying to close us down. We won them all.
Then, Texas passed the Safe Range Act which protects us from frivolous lawsuits.
The club has been there since 1961. I have been member since 2000. We have a closed membership of 300. We have quite a long waiting list of shooter’s applications.
We are a zero tolerance club. Absolutely no alcohol allowed on the property. You shoot at nothing but paper targets hung on the target frames. Rapid fire cannot exceed one round per second. At cease fires, flags must be in all actions.
any violations can result in dismissal from the club.
It’s really pretty laid back. Often on Sundays me and a couple of other Benchrest Shooters will have the run of the place for most of the day. I get there early, get my flags set, and often don’t leave until dusk
I like to say that a membership in the Tomball Gun Club is worth as much as great bullets. I would say gold, but To a Benchrest shooter, great bullets are worth more than gold.
Then, Texas passed the Safe Range Act which protects us from frivolous lawsuits.
The club has been there since 1961. I have been member since 2000. We have a closed membership of 300. We have quite a long waiting list of shooter’s applications.
We are a zero tolerance club. Absolutely no alcohol allowed on the property. You shoot at nothing but paper targets hung on the target frames. Rapid fire cannot exceed one round per second. At cease fires, flags must be in all actions.
any violations can result in dismissal from the club.
It’s really pretty laid back. Often on Sundays me and a couple of other Benchrest Shooters will have the run of the place for most of the day. I get there early, get my flags set, and often don’t leave until dusk
I like to say that a membership in the Tomball Gun Club is worth as much as great bullets. I would say gold, but To a Benchrest shooter, great bullets are worth more than gold.
This reminds me of a media story trying to shut down one of the ranges here in Australia. The presenter held up an UNFIRED round, looked like a 9mm as well, saying it had been fired from the pistol range next door.
The anti’s just can’t win. Supposing they could figure out how to pull a bullet out of the case without setting it off, we’d just say, hey there’s no rifling on that bullet.
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