223AI Guidance

[sqrlgtr]

Ok got this blueprinted Remington 700 with 1/14 twist Krieger barrel chambered in 223 rem.Pillered and bedded in beautiful rem classic wood stock.This rifle has always shot great and still does but getting a little long in the throat and I’m thinking of getting someone to ream it out to 223AI.Just looking for some advice on free bore and any thing else I need to consider. Im thinking zero on the throat/free bore.Keep in mind the 1/14” twist so will be shooting the light weights.
Thanks

 

[STS]

I've had a .223 AI for quite awhile, (a couple of barrels worth) and I wouldn't bother doing it again. It simply doesn't offer that much real world performance gain over the plane vanilla .223 IMO.

 

[AckleymanII]

Consider a 22-204, feeding issues will be nill in a 700 magazine. 223 AI will need a detachable mag floor plate, inletting, etc.

I have had a number of 223 AI's slow twists, no down side...none other than feeding issues.

40g at 4000-4100

50g at 3800+ 28g of H335 is a standard load in a zero FB, 14T.

55g at 3650+

I have 23" on it's third re chamber, and a new 27".

Often, feed rails need to be altered to feed an AI from 700 magazines, thus the 22-204 Ruger to solve the feeding problems.

I have no idea why STS has seen no improvement over regular 223 velocities in his AI, other than a slow barrel.

My quotes are not hot rod quotes, they would be higher.

 

[sqrlgtr]

Should have mentioned its a 24” tube and factory bdl bottom metal.Hadnt even considered feeding problems with the AI. Thanks for the heads up.AckleymanII,Could you elaborate a little more on the problems with feeding.

 

[centershot]

I have an AI. Love it! 53 V-Max at 3,500fps. You be the judge.

 

[B23]

I bought a new Rem LTR 223 quite a few years ago and shortly after owning/shooting it I got a wild hair up my arse and thought I needed a 223AI instead. Dropped it off at my gunsmiths with the intention of having him just turn it into a 223AI but decided for only $330 more I'd hang a new Hart 22in 9tw barrel on instead. I've pretty much only ever shot the 53gr Vmax in it and it is one of the best shooting guns I own.

Is it worth the extra effort to AI the 223, only the individual can decide, but even though mine turned out extremely well, I'm not sure I would bother with AI'ing a 223 again. There is so little to be gained, and if you truly want more velocity, go to something with more case capacity.

Pressure being equal, the 223AI only shoots about 100 +/- fps faster than the standard 223 but you'll hear allllllll kinds of stories about how the 223AI will shoot hundreds of fps faster than the standard 223 but you can't hot rod the bejeezus out of one and not the other, then jump up and down about how much faster it shoots.

Also, if you plan on using your current 223 barrel, at the least, have it set back and rechambered, don't let anyone just run a 223AI reamer in your current chamber to turn it into an AI version.

 

[varmintshooter]

I have an 8 twist that is on a Savage action and it feeds ok but it is the staggered feed which I understand feeds better than the center feed. I have no exp with rem. I really like the 223AI with 50 - 75 grain bullets. It is what consider to be right between a 223 and a 22-250. With 53 vmax I'm getting just shy of 3600 with good accuracy.

 

[sqrlgtr]

Should have worded my first post a little better had planned on having barrel set back which ever direction I go in.Im in no hurry just trying to way all my options.Rifle still shoots great but has lost a little compared to when it was first built,and I'm still a big fan of the plain jane 223.Never had an AI cartridge and thought this may be a good way to get my feet wet Just had'nt thought about feeding problems so thats probally going to be a deal breaker for me....

 

[searcher]

How about .22 Nosler? No fireforming and faster. Not sure about feeding in what you are running.

 

[B23]

As mentioned above, my 223AI is a rebarreled Rem 700 LTR. When I first had it rebarreled and turned into a 223AI I used the standard BDL bottom metal it came with, then later on put a HS Precision Det Mag system in it, neither one ever gave me a single problem and both always fed fine.

 

[sscoyote]

I'm running a 223 AI in my AR 26" 9T Hart and it's one of my favorite varmint guns. Couldn't get enough of the 65 JLK Low Drag @ 3100 except for terminal effect. Most accurate bullet I've ever shot overall for faster twist 22's. Ran the 53 V-Max for awhile at 3600, and 69 TMK @ 3100--loved that bullet for coyotes, but needed a VLD magazine to use it (and the 65) semi-auto. The latest is what I think is the best overall so far the 60 TMK at 3500 produced one 3-shot 300-yd. group at about an inch. Also killed a 475-yd. head shot coyote. So far it may best the 69--we'll see-that would take a lot.

 

[GrocMax]

As similar to Ackleyman, if you push a std 223 to the limits, and then an AI, yes there is a significant difference. Case capacity, depending on brass, is in the +2g to +3g area. If you choose not to take advantage of it, you won't see an increase. If you are restricted to AR mag length, you won't make the most of it. You will see the the highest increases with the lighter bullets, simple thermodynamics.

is it worth it? Decide for yourself. Reamers, dies, fireforming- this may not be worth your time and money.

The experienced folks here that tell you 3700-3800 FPS with a 50g bullet and a case that lasts 5-8 reloads (or more) aren't lying. Because of the worldwide supply chain for 5.56/223 cases, its really the ideal cartridge to mess with- you won't think twice about tossing a case with an insignificantly minor defect, it only costs about 2 cents per poot.

I'll finish with this- Bought a metric boatload of 22-250 barrels over the years. A 223AI that is pushed pretty hard, but not stupid hard, and a 22-250 that is less than book max by a fair bit shoot the same velocity.

Which cartridge makes you spend more than the bullet cost per round in barrel wear EVERY TIME?

 

[centershot]

Just remember that a lot of velocity equals a lot of heat. Do you want to spend your time shooting prairie dogs or letting your rifle cool.

 

[hunter67]

Ok I have one cause I don't like trimming brass as much. It wears an 18" tube and I get 3394fps with 53gr vmax and 8208. Its stupid accurate and does not heat up any more than a 223. I shoot pdogs a couple times a week when there up and yes I use my vartag most till later when they start getting smart then step up to the 223ai

 

[urbanrifleman]

I am shooting 50 grain TNTS to 3850 with Lt32 in my 223a. Very stable load. Great powder.

 

[IowaGeologist]

I've had a .223 AI for quite awhile, (a couple of barrels worth) and I wouldn't bother doing it again. It simply doesn't offer that much real world performance gain over the plane vanilla .223 IMO.

But there is a gain though. And what is the real drawback if you're reloading for it either way? Can still shoot regular 223 in a pinch but typically get 75-150 fps more performance with the AI loads. Add in far less brass prep work and I don't see why it's not worth it to people. Hell, it would be worth it to me just for less brass trimming alone.

 

[JSH]

Not to derail this thread, a bunch of you on this thread that have had hands on and not hear say. Lol, several of you have helped me spend some money

Howa mini, 223 pencil barrel. I really like the action.
Tossed around a few wildcats, but leaned back towards less work. So, thought about the 223AI or the 22Nosler, both running 40-55 grain bullets.
You gentlemen’s thoughts......

Midway has 22Nosler ammo for .10 more than brass. Seems it was burning more powder and not giving back in speed?
Jeff

 

[flatlander]

My 223AI reamer has only .063" FB, which just by coincidence turned out to be the right amount when running rounds loaded with Berger 90VLDs out of AI poly 10rd mags in the 1st one I built on a trued M700 action. That rifle hammered with the 90s at mag length, using Viht N550 or Alliant 2000MR, for something like 1200-1300rds, then accuracy with 90s dropped-off after the throat had advanced to the point that mag length rounds were too short for optimum accuracy. I got 2830fps out of the 90s in that Krieger 1-7tw, 26" bbl, and good enough accuracy to get hits on 1300 & 1400yd steel targets. I do like not needing to trim, but also wish someone made quality 223AI brass so I didn't have to fireform. Only 223AIs I've built for myself both had DBM that I used with AI's poly 10-rd mags, and both on M700s that feed reliably out of these mags.

 

[sqrlgtr]

Has anyone else had problems with feeding as ackleyman mentioned???I belive I would like the cartridge but still not sure about the feeding problems thats been brought up.

 

[DogBuster]

My 223 AI is on a Savage target action........sooo......s/shot

drop a rd in & slam the bolt & kill schidt........

when Pac Nor built the tube......I said -0- free bore....9 twist/3 groove

Throat will only lengthen with use.....53 V max is main diet......