Question on scopes with 1/8 MOA clicks

[SGK]

I have a Kahles 1050 MOAK. It has 1/8 MOA clicks. The markings are in MOA i.e. 8 clicks to move from 0 to 1 on the dial. I'm wondering if this is typical. The reason I ask is because I use Ballistics AE and I just realised that dialling for, say, 32 1/8 clicks as per a correction from Ballistics AE is NOT dialling to 3 plus two more clicks on the scope. If 8 clicks per whole number is the norm it would likely make more sense for Ballistics AE to express their 1/8 click output adjustments as X.YZ where X is the number of whole MOA and Y is the fractional number of 1/8 clicks (and Z the number of 10ths of an 1/8th). Otherwise basically it's less confusing to have Ballistics AE output in MOA and do the fractional part manually.

 

[Leeman]

I would say your last sentence makes the most sense to me, have the output in MOA as that directly translates to the adjustments on your scope. If you're shooting any kind of high power matches, the target dimensions and wind flag corrections are all generally given as MOA so one system for everything. I much prefer 1/4 MOA adjustments, far simpler for me and as most of the ranges I shoot at require hold over/under depending on wind direction and strength, I don't need that additional increment in an attempt to centre the group. Most target scopes would be 1/4 or 1/8 MOA, with those designed for military/tactical use in milliradians. I would think most ballistics apps would provide output in either.

 

[SGK]

I had Ballistic AE set to output number of 1/8 MOA clicks but had a "duh moment" when I realised an adjustment of 32 clicks was not the same as dialling to 3 plus two more clicks. I hate imperial fractional math and it takes me awhile to figure out the conversion of decimals to 1/8ths. (I much prefer MRAD but bought this scope with a view to competition and hence having to deal with MOA)

 

[dthomas]

The 1/8 min clicks are for benchrest and f class where you need the fine adjustments. Most other types of shooting is better off with 1/4 moa or mil adjustments.

 

[Ned Ludd]

IMO - the issue is trying to use some specified number of "clicks". If you know your scope turret gradations and use a total MOA or total Mil value, it won't be an issue. The problem starts any time you have to convert one set of units to another in your head.

 

[coldboreshot]

I'm not familiar with Ballistics AE but does the program allow selection between IPHY as well as Mil and MOA? The variation may come from the selected measurement application. If your gaging MOA and the program is running IPHY computation, then that might be the offset difference in click adjustments. Just a thought.

 

[Richard Jones]

"I'm not familiar with Ballistics AE but does the program allow selection between IPHY as well as Mil and MOA?"

It does.

 

[coldboreshot]

1 MOA at 100 yards equals 1.047". The fractional calculation changes.

 

[Nature Boy]

I have a Kahles 1050 MOAK. It has 1/8 MOA clicks. The markings are in MOA i.e. 8 clicks to move from 0 to 1 on the dial. I'm wondering if this is typical. The reason I ask is because I use Ballistics AE and I just realised that dialling for, say, 32 1/8 clicks as per a correction from Ballistics AE is NOT dialling to 3 plus two more clicks on the scope. If 8 clicks per whole number is the norm it would likely make more sense for Ballistics AE to express their 1/8 click output adjustments as X.YZ where X is the number of whole MOA and Y is the fractional number of 1/8 clicks (and Z the number of 10ths of an 1/8th). Otherwise basically it's less confusing to have Ballistics AE output in MOA and do the fractional part manually.

I have your scope and also use the Ballistic AE app. I'm just using clicks, which is fine for F Class since you're are doing a lot of turret manipulation like you would for PRS. If using 1/8 MOA you'd need to convert the decimal to a fraction.

 

[rammac]

32 1/8 increments is not 3 MOA plus 2 clicks,
3 MOA x 8 clicks = 24 clicks plus 2 more is 26 clicks total

so I don't know how you come up with the idea that 32 clicks should be 3 MOA plus 2 clicks...Oh I see what you're doing. Your mistake is that you are still thinking that 1 MOA is divided in to 10 increments, not on your scope. On your scope 1 MOA is divided in to 8 increments.

32 1/8 increments or clicks is 4 MOA

32 clicks / 8 clicks per MOA = 4

So 32 1/8 clicks means you turn to the number 4 (MOA) on the turret.

If you are saying that your ballistics calculator is saying that you need 32 clicks but you have to actually use 3 MOA plus 2 clicks to hit the target then either the scope is malfunctioning or your ballistics software is giving you incorrect results.

1/8 click scopes aren't very useful to anybody except a long range target shooter. They are slower to adjust due to the math being more difficult to work with and there are more clicks per MOA (8 rather than 4). Yes, they can be more accurate since each click is one half the size of a 4 click scope but as you've proven, they can complicate the math unless you've got a lot of practice using them under pressure.

 

[_Raining]

32 1/8 increments is not 3 MOA plus 2 clicks,
3 MOA x 8 clicks = 24 clicks plus 2 more is 26 clicks total

so I don't know how you come up with the idea that 32 clicks should be 3 MOA plus 2 clicks...Oh I see what you're doing. Your mistake is that you are still thinking that 1 MOA is divided in to 10 increments, not on your scope. On your scope 1 MOA is divided in to 8 increments.

32 1/8 increments or clicks is 4 MOA

32 clicks / 8 clicks per MOA = 4

So 32 1/8 clicks means you turn to the number 4 (MOA) on the turret.

If you are saying that your ballistics calculator is saying that you need 32 clicks but you have to actually use 3 MOA plus 2 clicks to hit the target then either the scope is malfunctioning or your ballistics software is giving you incorrect results.

1/8 click scopes aren't very useful to anybody except a long range target shooter. They are slower to adjust due to the math being more difficult to work with and there are more clicks per MOA (8 rather than 4). Yes, they can be more accurate since each click is one half the size of a 4 click scope but as you've proven, they can complicate the math unless you've got a lot of practice using them under pressure.

The problem with the app is it has MOA or Clicks but when you set it to MOA it can give you numbers like "32.33" instead of "32 and 3/8". If you have a MIL scope, it is easy to round that to 32.3 but 1/8 MOA will take a little longer to do the mental math. Applied ballistics will give you MOA and Clicks but the MOA is still in decimal, although it is rounded to the nearest value of your scopes sub-tension, ex 32.375 which still takes some mental math to figure out how many 1/8ths past 32.

 

[Terry]

When I teach our Long Range Training Class, we avoid talking in terms of clicks. We speak in terms minutes. This eliminates a lot of confusion. When you dial in 3 1/2 minutes, you dial minutes. 1/8 or 1/4 minute clicks don't matter. You can have 10 guys in the room and all are at the right place.