Where all all the shooters???

[JEFFPPC]

When I started shooting IBS tournaments, it cost $30 to shoot in the 3 local Ranges Tournaments. Each year there after they raised the cost to finally $50. I along with 7 other shooters I know of, no longer participate because of this. It's not because I can't afford it it's just I can't justify paying that much. Each shoot used to draw between 25 to 30 shooters, now they're lucky to get 7. They complain that there's not any new shooters coming into the sport but they can't see why. You have a young man with a new family that just can't swing $50 when in my case there is 3 ranges that each have 5 shoots a year. I still go to the range and shoot but just not as much competition. Good Luck On The Journey!

You are correct to a point. However, they seem to have money for tattoes, new trucks, booze, gaming devices, gaming chairs......but how about those who are now into late 30s or 40s and sliding into middle age. I agree as was montioned above in one post our society has worked hard to get rid of any competitive nature, all starts with particapation trophys . I guess I will fall back on....Im glad I'm old. I am happy to say I have had several PMs asking me about matches here in Pa so that's worth getting beat up a bit, lol. I hope all you guys who compete have a good year and if we all recruted 1 new shooter this year we would double our numbers.oh by the way, it does not require a new big dollar rig to get started, many matches have factory classes,, that is how many of us started and some guys stay there forever. Yes there are a million reasons, oops excuses, if one chooses to use them. Hope I never get one of those guys in my foxhole.

 

[hogpatrol]

No it's not! With all due respect Hog it's as different as night and day.

Hunting is, or at least should be, an adventure. You're doing something almost all the time even if it's sitting in a tree watching and waiting. You're not competing against guys at other benches, it's you against the quarry and it has a lot more at stake than you do.

Benchrest, with the possible exception of silhouette, is really, really boring. Shoot five shots, wait a couple hours, look at the posted scores, repeat until finished, then drive home. The thing that used to make it interesting and popular was the camaraderie. A bunch of guys you enjoy hanging out with, swapping lies, re-telling jokes, etc. and there happened to be guns involved instead of beer. Even the drive to and from the match might have been fun. I don't know what all happened to all that. Some died off of course. You would think new guys would gradually fill in but it never seemed to happen.

I think that a team competition format rather than, or in addition to mano a mano might help even if the teams are ad hoc by drawing during registration. Might piss Morton off to find out his entire entourage is shooting against him but such is life.

Dave, My context wasn't too good in that post. What I meant to say is that hunting is suffering from the same demographics as match shooting. They definitely aren't the same game.

 

[jimmymac]

I have the equipment. Time is my biggest problem. I work full time. Chores still need done above and beyond the 40. Vacation time is limited so I have to be choosy on where and when I shoot. This isn't excuse making. It's just life.

I shot a handful of matches last year. I'd love to shoot more, but the reality is it will only be a handful again this year. I'd love to go to group shoots every weekend or every other weekend, but the time commitment kicks my butt. If I get to two NBRSA group shoots this year I'll be doing good. It's two days at the match, plus you better get there a day early at a minimum to set up a loading area, place flags and get a little trigger time in. As much as I like group shooting, I see myself gravitating more and more towards UBR. One day matches within a few hours from home is logistically easier to pull off. Show up in the morning, go home in the afternoon. It's a long day, but doable. UBR score shooting turned out to be more fun than I thought it would be, and the competition in WV and Maryland was stiff. The local club matches don't excite me much, other than the HV group matches at the Chippewa rifle club in Ohio. For a club match, you better bring the "A" game to that place because you may end up shooting next to a HOF shooter. There are always excellent shooters in attendance.

All that said, I shoot every weekend, just not every weekend at a match. My local range is less than 10 minutes away. Even on my busy schedule I can get there for an hour or two to work on my skills. I'm glad I dragged my neighbor down the hole with me. We are always competing informally.

 

[dragman]

You are correct to a point. However, they seem to have money for tattoes, new trucks, booze, gaming devices, gaming chairs......but how about those who are now into late 30s or 40s and sliding into middle age. I agree as was montioned above in one post our society has worked hard to get rid of any competitive nature, all starts with particapation trophys . I guess I will fall back on....Im glad I'm old. I am happy to say I have had several PMs asking me about matches here in Pa so that's worth getting beat up a bit, lol. I hope all you guys who compete have a good year and if we all recruted 1 new shooter this year we would double our numbers.oh by the way, it does not require a new big dollar rig to get started, many matches have factory classes,, that is how many of us started and some guys stay there forever. Yes there are a million reasons, oops excuses, if one chooses to use them. Hope I never get one of those guys in my foxhole.

As someone who is younger I will shed some light. It's way more than the participation money. It's the 5-8K in equipment to compete. Then you have gas day or days to go do it entry fee's etc. That kills argument Tattoo's, Trucks, Booze, Gaming, etc. The only one that costs more is the Truck and you need a vehicle.

Competitive is cool, but it is a double edge sword. I hear this ALL the time (if I was only younger with your eyes) it gets old hearing it as I take it as an insult) Old guys in this game generally have an advantage from the stand point of money and time. Young people have stamina and sometimes vision. Younger people are alienated sometimes by everything said and done around shoots.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Benchrest is a great game with great people involved and if it's boring, you're probably doing it all wrong. It's a competition...If you aren't giving it all you have, you're order in the standings will likely reflect your effort into it.

I have said this many times but I'll say it again..Matches that last for several days are not conducive to bringing in younger shooters that have jobs, families and other time commitments. There are far more people that can afford the game from a monetary standpoint than from time. It's a hobby that competes with other hobbies for new participants that is really not terribly expensive but does take a lot of time. Younger people have to keep Momma, the kids, the boss and the banker happy. Retired people with a comfortable income can check all of those boxes but one...Momma, and she's probably a little more understanding at this point in her life of you being gone a few days. She might even be glad! Lol!

Score shoots that are typically one day events are much, much less demanding of time away from home and in my case, require much less travel.

The sport is great and so are the people involved, but if you're gonna be competitive at it, it does takes a huge amount of time.

 

[Lefty Trigger]

A lot of the guys around here are changing over to air rifles and shooting other guy's basements in custom ranges they have built. No noise, no smoke, no reloading, no foul weather and no wind,... not sure I'm ready to go down that road yet.

 

[JEFFPPC]

A lot of the guys around here are changing over to air rifles and shooting other guy's basements in custom ranges they have built. No noise, no smoke, no reloading, no foul weather and no wind,... not sure I'm ready to go down that road yet.

Lefty, I have been saying for years we will all be shooting air rifles some day. I have a friend who is into bench air rifle. He has more money invested than I do but his advantage is not needing new bareels, powder, making cases etc. I think a lot of guys who have never tried a match would find some good people and a good time if they would take whatever they had and gave it a try. I started shooting IBS with a factory rifle shooting off sandbags. The third year I bought a used PPC, that was about 25 years ago. Still have it although it's now a 6 BRX , no need to build a new rifle to start and be competitive.

 

[Rtheurer]

As a match Here are my observations on our Across the Course Program. (1) It is an expensive hobby, some of the younger shooters struggle to afford it.

I hear this one all the time. However I shoot both XTC, and dabble a little in PRS shooting. If you go see what these 20's and 30's aged shooters are using to play PRS you would see this is NOT a problem as just the scope and Rifle alone that they shoot would Fully Equip them to shoot Prone or XTC matches. They are spending HUGE money to shoot PRS.

 

[Shooter13]

A lot of the guys around here are changing over to air rifles and shooting other guy's basements in custom ranges they have built. No noise, no smoke, no reloading, no foul weather and no wind,... not sure I'm ready to go down that road yet.

Nope, I love air rifles BUT not for competition, not enough ways for me to mess up

 

[JEFFPPC]

I hear this one all the time. However I shoot both XTC, and dabble a little in PRS shooting. If you go see what these 20's and 30's aged shooters are using to play PRS you would see this is NOT a problem as just the scope and Rifle alone that they shoot would Fully Equip them to shoot Prone or XTC matches. They are spending HUGE money to shoot PRS.

You are correct. My purpose of this post was not to recruit benchrest shooters but to encourage guys that enjoy accurate rifles to get out, compete, and while doing so learn and improve. It isn't on no way a challenge to other disciplines. Shoot what appeals to you, but get it there, do it, and enjoy it. Those who do will have an advantage of those who do not.

 

[swadiver]

Amongst the younger generation, esports is HUGE. Arenas have heat and AC, food and refreshments, fixed toilet facilities and the cost of entry to a tournament is low, ten to twenty bucks to participate.

i think that's very sad. i am glad i was born when i was. (1956). outside in the real (physical) world is way more interesting, imho

 

[CharlieNC]

I shoot Fclass, and it continues to grow a bit, but the younger shooters are jumping into PRS at a rapid rate. If I was younger I would too! PRS involves multiple positions, distances, etc; it's more "exciting" than the traditional NRA sports. More options these days.

 

[Trophied]

Retired and enjoying it, on fixed income, put my current rifle together before I got retired and since then I don't have the disposable income to do matches since there aren't any very close to me other than the PPC benchrest shooters/matches in the area. I don't have that equipment and probably won't ever have it. My rifle was put together more as a hunting and hobby paper puncher than a competition gun. My motorcycle trips, a couple of cruises a year, and a long trip to visit friends once a year are much more satisfying than turning a shooting HOBBY into something more like WORK. I get to the range every couple of months or so, and shoot well enough that if I ever had the opportunity to hunt at an affordable price (not really likely in my area) I would feel confident in taking a shot. The time and cost involved in prep, practice, and travel severely limits my ability to do much in the competitive shooting sports. Just to put my toy to the test I had my friend that had never shot a centerfire, never looked through a scope, and hadn't shot any rifle in over 40 years shoot it and he put up a .481 first group, and backed that up with a .337 second group out of my rifle with factory ammo. I only shot one group that same day, a .547. He was ranked in the top ten nationally in smallbore in high school, so he shoots between heartbeats. At least now I know what is the worst accuracy this rifle can do if the triggerman is on his game.

 

[Retired Grunt]

I started F Class last year for the first time, I had tried Service Rifle and CMP with an M1A. I struggled in the Sling and Jacket due to my injuries. I started F Class with a Bipod and struggled so I got a cheap rest and bag improving my next match, then upgraded again and went up again. So for shooting 500yrds is the process, starting with the empty case, reloading it and the putting it in the 5 inch circle which I do on occasion. It's relaxing and I have met a lot of great guys. My little club uses the Shoot Marker and has increased participation last year according to those that have been around a few years. It is addictive, I want to improve each match, I may try to try the 300/500/600 this year. If I can muster the courage I may swing a 1000yd match at least once. it's been 35 yrs since I shot 1000, i was like 21 year old in the Army. I think I could actually see the Target.

 

[Shooter13]

On a up note, there were over 100 guns (I think 106-110?) at the UBR Nationals and @Greyfox or Billy Henson could verify. We had fun, and I got a lot of experience doing this, really looking forward to this year.

 

[Bill Norris]

From my angle looking at this and being brutally honest about why I never tried to compete I arrive at this realization. We all know in this game there are 3 main elements that must be at the top shelf or as close as possible. The equipment, the ammo, and the shooter. Either one that is not up to parr at a match will definitely leave a shooter absolutely dumb founded. Within this trio I've had and still have good accurate rifles and rest, etc. and have been hand loading since 1995. I feel my hand loads are capable of winning a match as well due to the time I spend making sure each loaded round is clone material and some groups I have shot in the past (Maybe luck LOL.) But, the third aspect which is the shooter of course leaves a lot to be desired. I simply do not feel my ability to repeatedly drive the rifle straight and be consistent in a match would ever match the rifle or the ammo. Therefore, the reason I never tried to shoot against anybody but myself. Again, just being honest.

 

[Shooter13]

From my angle looking at this and being brutally honest about why I never tried to compete I arrive at this realization. We all know in this game there are 3 main elements that must be at the top shelf or as close as possible. The equipment, the ammo, and the shooter. Either one that is not up to parr at a match will definitely leave a shooter absolutely dumb founded. Within this trio I've had and still have good accurate rifles and rest, etc. and have been hand loading since 1995. I feel my hand loads are capable of winning a match as well due to the time I spend making sure each loaded round is clone material and some groups I have shot in the past (Maybe luck LOL.) But, the third aspect which is the shooter of course leaves a lot to be desired. I simply do not feel my ability to repeatedly drive the rifle straight and be consistent in a match would ever match the rifle or the ammo. Therefore, the reason I never tried to shoot against anybody but myself. Again, just being honest.

I understand, do I think my skills will ever be what most of these guys are? No, not really due to the "head start of 10+ years shooting" but is that going to stop me? Not at all! I'm going to have fun and do the best I can and if I get lucky.......just maybe.........win an agg and if I don't.....well, I'll have fun talking to the competitors regardless and maybe, just maybe, I'll pick up that one grain of knowledge that will put me over the top. If not, I'll still have fun.

 

[Bill Norris]

I understand, do I think my skills will ever be what most of these guys are? No, not really due to the "head start of 10+ years shooting" but is that going to stop me? Not at all! I'm going to have fun and do the best I can and if I get lucky.......just maybe.........win an agg and if I don't.....well, I'll have fun talking to the competitors regardless and maybe, just maybe, I'll pick up that one grain of knowledge that will put me over the top. If not, I'll still have fun.

And I totally understand that. I certainly admire your ambitions as well. But, I personally feel that for me its best to just not bother.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

And I totally understand that. I certainly admire your ambitions as well. But, I personally feel that for me its best to just not bother.

Well...there are two ways to look at this. First is..you're beat before you start. Ya gotta believe that you CAN do this, or you won't.
Second is, if ya haven't tried it, ya can't know.
I'm working with a relatively new shooter who I consider to be a natural at this game. In fact, he won a National Championship last season. He made mistakes early that most , myself included, could never make up during a match that day. At the end of the day he was a CHAMP!
If he will do as he has promised me and puts in the time, he can be unstoppable.

You may be like him!

 

[Bill Norris]

Well...there are two ways to look at this. First is..you're beat before you start. Ya gotta believe that you CAN do this, or you won't.
Second is, if ya haven't tried it, ya can't know.
I'm working with a relatively new shooter who I consider to be a natural at this game. In fact, he won a National Championship last season. He made mistakes early that most , myself included, could never make up during a match that day. At the end of the day he was a CHAMP!
If he will do as he has promised me and puts in the time, he can be unstoppable.

You may be like him!

I think I probably fit into the First category. LOL. Because I don't have the confidence level needed.