We may have lost our indoor range!

[Deleted outa08]

Next to our outdoor pistol range, there's a HUGE sign stating TRADITIONAL handgun cartridges only. Go there on a Sunday and wait all day. You'll see the jitterbug magdumpers pull out their ARs and go to town. Same with the rifle range, the sign says NO SHOTGUNS. In the weeks before deer season, it'll be littered with shotgun shells. It's sort of like the traffic signs. Some people think they're just suggestions.

Good morning HP, Down here in Lower Slower the traffic signs are dual purposed, suggestions and targets. From my careful observation, I believe the 9mm is king for slaying rabid traffic signs. Have a good day and if you visit below the canal, don`t spend any time behind a sign. Jeff

 

[KMart]

Holy crap, someone needs to hold his head underwater for just a little while.......

 

[KMart]

+++ Our range has 400+members. Each one goes thru a 1.5 hour orientation class that includes a written test at the end. 90% of the problem behavior that has been caught on video and reported by members happens on the pistol range.

Our club is of a similar size and have a similar orientation and test. In our case, we have found that the majority or our violations happen when a member takes a guest to the range. The guest commits the violation and the member suffers the consequences.
The member fails to inform the guest of the range rules and, for a lack of better words, doesn't maintain control of his guest.

Then you have the "the rules don't apply to me" group.

 

[AccelR8]

A guy i work with asked me if i could load him up some 223 ammo. I said sure what you need? He said it dont matter hes going to blast it from his ar. I said how many you need? He said he wanted 5000. He caught his ak handguard on fire the week before. Needless to say he thought my price was a bit high for blasting ammo. He doesnt even save his brass and shoots over 1000 every weekend- said he had some kind of electric magazine loader too. That must be how he is able to dump those mags

Wow. Money to burn I guess.

One of the people who had the biggest influence on my shooting was my Dad (no surprise there). He was born in 1914 and was a Marine for 18 years. His approach was, basically, "Every round has a purpose."

 

[Lefty Trigger]

Man, I sure am glad no one with a bolt gun ever fouls something up. All these damned AR-15 shooters are ruining everything for the rest of us. It’s not the type of rifle fellas, it’s the person behind it. Let’s try to remember we’re all on the same team here.

While I will agree with you 100% that it's not the gun there is a pattern following the AR, like it or not.

 

[J.d. Popkes]

I have not shot on a range w others in a decade. Well coupla times in N.C. Scared the s**t outta me, those guys. Worst shooters ever, RO kept us all alive I'll take the high desert by my lonesome. fwiw.

Agree 100%. I don’t understand why people feel like they need to congregate.

more people, more problems

 

[akajun]

Man, I sure am glad no one with a bolt gun ever fouls something up. All these damned AR-15 shooters are ruining everything for the rest of us. It’s not the type of rifle fellas, it’s the person behind it. Let’s try to remember we’re all on the same team here.

You sure about that? I’ve been on the line at several 3x600’s watching some of the f class guys launching several rounds over the burm or mystery crossfires no one fesses up to. But it’s us service rifle shooters who get the bad rap

 

[DR1586]

@akajun

My comment was very sarcastic. I see no relevance in singling out the rifle type. To me it all stems back to Ill-informed, under trained, or willfully negligent shooters. The rifle, pistol, or shotgun is not to blame whatsoever. In the times we’re in, I see no need to publicly single out a type of rifle. I do however see a need to try and help newer shooters learn more and become better members of our community. No better place for this than a shooting range that hosts competitions. The level of mentor ship and training gained through competitive shooting is unparalleled and is something I firmly believe could benefit all shooters.

 

[pirate ammo]

If your from Virginia you may lose all your indoor and probably the outdoor ranges period. Thank the Demons.

 

[dellet]

The pattern I see emerging among long range shooters on public land is more disturbing in many ways, than anything I've seen at a range.

Since it's safe to say most ranges aren't longer than a few hundred yards, these characters venture out to wherever they think they can find something to shoot at 1000 yards or more, often rocks, and blaze away. Since they don't setup a target, they have no clue what's between, behind or to the side. No one knows they are there until the random bullets start flying by or they are shooting over a road they did not know existed and get reported. fearing getting shot on public land is no longer just a hunting season issue.

Idiots show up behind a lot of different triggers. The more popular the style of rifle, the more idiots you will have, just due to percentages. Now that you can buy a 1/2 MOA, 1000 yard rifle (according to the magazines) and a case of ammo for a few hundred dollars, you too can buy it in the morning and be shooting elk (or rocks) at 1000 yards in the afternoon.

At least that's what they said on the hunting channel.....

 

[Oso]

I am member of a private range that has everything (pistol bays, 25 yard, 50 yard, 100 yard, 200/300 yard, and the 600-100 yard range. The funny observations of the average club member is that 90% of all gas guns (AR, AK, etc.) are shot on the 50 yard range and no further (I guess their bullets magically falls out of the air at 51 yards), and remaining 10% are split between 25 yards and 100 yards. Mosen Nagants are only good for 50 yards. AR10's get split between 50 and 100 yards, with a few shooters stretching it to 300 yards.

Our pistol bays are for pistols (pistol calibers), and not shotguns or anything with any center fire rifle cartridges even if it has a "pistol brace". I am always amused when I stop a shooter with his AR "Pistol" and the discussion from the shooter is "...but it is a pistol... How am I supposed to sight it in???" and I typically reply, "Take it over to the 25 yard range, where rifle calibers are permitted." It is like a light bulb has gone off... you can see it in their eyes... as if I offered them Mana from God?!

I refuse to shoot at indoor range that does not separate rifle calibers from the pistol shooters. What hearing I have left I would like to keep... and I don't like shooting around fools and shooters that can barely operate a can opener.

 

[Lefty Trigger]

Guys while I did not intend this thread to be a "bash the black rifle" thread however a few of you get it. The younger crowd of shooters are buying them because that's the happening rifle to have. Our club has service rifle matches but you never seen the young crowd over there shooting them,... because they cant. All they manage to do is blast away at what ever and leave a mess behind. One time there was a guy in his early 30's show up with a AK and he managed to chip the paint on two cars in the parking lot with his rifle flinging brass violently that way, they run him off real fast. Our outdoor range is not policed or supervised unless the RO happens to be there it works on the honor system and sadly that is failing us both indoor and out.

 

[Downhill]

Our range has experienced most of the issues listed here. We were in danger of losing our lease that has been held since 1974. The solution was paid Range Officers during business hours, a camera system and an increase in membership dues and the day rate for non members. We have also instated a "damage and vandalism" fee for intentional misuse of range targets. The way we work this is pay for damages or visit with the sherriff's dept. for criminal trespass.

 

[Oso]

I grew up shooting and remember the hay days of gun shows with velvet table clothes here high-end shotgun were king... this was father-son time on the weekends. You drooled over exotic woods and engraving and even custom knives. I am somewhere in the middle age of or club's membership. The thing that I keep in mind is that for many guy (mid-40's and younger) the AR15 is the only rifle they have ever known. There are predominantly two groups of users (military/former military) and average civilian who played a lot of video games. In both cases their training on the rifle is only precursory. There are people who bought an AR for fear/panic under Obama that someday they might not be able to by one. I watched a young guy (18-20 years old) looking to buy an AR15 at Bass Pro during the great panic... they were all sold out, except they had a AR22 (polymer replica) The salesman kept stressing that it was only a 22 long rifle...this meant nothing to purchaser... salesman even showed him the different bullets (22lr and 5.56). Guy was set on having an AR ...

A gentle hand and some advise on use/safety goes far. I have taken advantage of the "pistol" loophole, but never have I considered it any less capable then a rifle...

 

[AccelR8]

I think, as some have mentioned, it's television, movies, video games and internet that gets a lot of people interested in guns. They didn't grow up around them and didn't learn any thing like safety, range etiquette, or responsibility as a young person and now they're adults and they're showing up at places that for the most part have been the territory of those that DID learn the importance those things.

I figure there's different ways to treat them. You could try to ignore them as long as they're not damaging anything or endangering others, or try to make them feel welcome and offer guidance and advice. The problem with that is a lot of people today are incapable of receiving any kind of advice. Many people seem to interact with others with a “you're wrong” attitude right off the bat.

Funny story, I was a guest at a range way out in the farm lands away from any big city. Half dozen young guys parked their cars on the road leading up to the locked gate and walked in carrying Mosin Nagants. They didn't look like farm boys by the way. I mentioned to one member that they are obviously not members and he said “Yeah we get them here all the time.” They didn't put up any targets, they just fired into the back stop cranking their bolts frantically as if trying to see who could shoot the fastest.

That range, there were several porta-potties that had been shot through numerous times and when I mentioned this the member said “Oh that's nothin', look at this” and walked me over to the club house. Someone had fired a shot that went through the entry door, through the entire club house and out through the back door.

 

[AccelR8]

Another funny story to bolster one of my points above; a friend of mine wanted to shoot an AR15 because he never had done so and just wanted to learn a little about them. I took him to a public DNR range. Turned out I forgot to bring ammo! There were no stores anywhere nearby. So I walked over to the 50 yard range where all the AR15 and AK shooters were and noticed this biker looking guy and (I assume) his son who were blazing away with an M4gery. They had large amounts of cheap factory ammo. During a lull in the barrage when they were stuffing their 30 round mags I approached them and said “Excuse me gentlemen...” and that guy jumped in my sh*t with both feet. Very aggressive attitude. When I told him to settle down and explained that I wanted to ask him if I could buy a box or two of his ammo, and why, he changed his attitude and wanted to give me two boxes. Which I insisted on paying for.

A little later another guy walked over and said “Thank you for putting that guy in his place. He's an a** hole.” I said I think you misunderstood, I didn't really do anything other than buy ammo from him.

 

[hpshooter]

"In our case, we have found that the majority or our violations happen when a member takes a guest to the range. The guest commits the violation and the member suffers the consequences."

Ditto for our range. The only unpleasant interaction I have had on our range in 43 years as a member and 37 years as an RSO was with a guest that was called out for having several rifles on the bench loaded with the actions closed. When told he would have to clear the firearms, insert a clear chamber and leave the action open on any firearm he was not actively firing I got the "who the hell are you to tell me that" and the "I spent xx years in the military" speech. He was told that I am an RSO and you and the member who brought you here are done for the day, your member friend can come back but you can't. The member attempted to tell the guest the same thing I told him with the same results prior to me addressing the situation.

 

[hpshooter]

"If your from Virginia you may lose all your indoor and probably the outdoor ranges period. Thank the Demons."

Following this closely. At this point that bill is in committee and has not reached the floor.

Our 325acre facility is actually zoned residential and has been since the 50's. There were several thing in the past that made it advantageous do do that good chance it will work against us now.

 

[hogpatrol]

I haven't seen anyone yet with a golf club but I swear our pistol and 100 yard rifle ranges double as driving ranges. At least there's enough divots to make me believe it.

 

[Danoh]

I haven't seen anyone yet with a golf club but I swear our pistol and 100 yard rifle ranges double as driving ranges. At least there's enough divots to make me believe it.

Same at my range.