barrel groove pics

[swadiver]

just did a big JB Bore-paste cleaning of my Bartlein 14 twist 6BR, 4 groove barrel. about 1700 rds through this barrel, mostly with either LT-32 or Benchmark. more of the Benchmark.

I was seeing some erratic performance prior to this cleaning. have not shot it since the cleaning. i used Speedy Gonzales" method of applying the borepaste. saw that on a thread on this board.

what is interesting is the bore-scope pics after the cleaning. 2 of the grooves came out almost perfectly clean with no apparent firecracking, the other two show as pictured below. the two clean grooves are i believe the "top" grooves

comments?

 

[tmwinds]

Same on my barrels. The bottom gets the fire cracking worse and before the top. Something to do with the way the hot flame erodes the barrel I guess. Your barrel actually looks pretty good. I have barrels that would make yours look new and they still shoot.

 

[Raythemanroe]

Chemicals and cleaning would be my guess, try using a foaming bore cleaner like wipe out..

I have seen fire "cracking" clean right up..

Ray

 

[fyrewall]

Can't see how a deterioration or penetrating damage to surface would be polished off with an abrasive like JB - my guess is what is seen is fouling & carboom.

For my use, a 6 BR looking like that should be good for another 2000. A replacement would provide economic benefits to others.

Great photos - thanks!

 

[Dusty Stevens]

At 1700 rds, according to what you use it for, its on its last leg anyway. Flitz it and i think youll see more even colors

 

[ridgeway]

Bronze brush and scrub and scrub...

 

[Ned Ludd]

With regard to the apparent unevenness of the firecracking, I have observed carbon fouling on patches from a couple particular rifles as I'm cleaning them that would suggest a similar non-uniformity. These are 5R barrels and the carbon pattern on the early patches seems to be three adjacent very dark and heavy lines, with two being much lighter, or almost non-existent. I've never tried to determine whether the grooves that apparently had lighter carbon fouling were on the top/bottom of the bore at the chamber end.

 

[Dusty Stevens]

With regard to the apparent unevenness of the firecracking, I have observed carbon fouling on patches from a couple particular rifles as I'm cleaning them that would suggest a similar non-uniformity. These are 5R barrels and the carbon pattern on the early patches seems to be three adjacent very dark and heavy lines, with two being much lighter, or almost non-existent. I've never tried to determine whether the grooves that apparently had lighter carbon fouling were on the top/bottom of the bore at the chamber end.

With a hawkeye theres a groove on the mirror sleeve you turn that points to where the mirror is pointing- if you have a hawkeye

 

[Dusty Stevens]

Regarding the difference in the top and bottom of the barrel and the difference- have you ever looked down your barrel after a few shots and noticed the difference in the top and bottom? Also have you ever checked your barrel temp on top and bottom? Theres 2 things that could explain why theres a difference

 

[Ned Ludd]

I do have a Hawkeye. I just haven't been concerned enough about the apparent non-uniformity of the carbon pattern in the grooves in the past to try and decipher it with the Hawkeye. Maybe now I'll be motivated enough to do so, thanks for the tip.

 

[swadiver]

With a hawkeye theres a groove on the mirror sleeve you turn that points to where the mirror is pointing- if you have a hawkeye

my were taken with a Lyman. i ran the pics through Adobe's Lightroom program to enhance them a bit. only so much you can do though, with these low res pics.

 

[swadiver]

At 1700 rds, according to what you use it for, its on its last leg anyway. Flitz it and i think youll see more even colors

got another 1 in 14 twist blank to send off to the smith very soon. the new one is a Select Match Shilen. we will see how that works

 

[coldboreshot]

just did a big JB Bore-paste cleaning of my Bartlein 14 twist 6BR, 4 groove barrel. about 1700 rds through this barrel, mostly with either LT-32 or Benchmark. more of the Benchmark.

I was seeing some erratic performance prior to this cleaning. have not shot it since the cleaning. i used Speedy Gonzales" method of applying the borepaste. saw that on a thread on this board.

what is interesting is the bore-scope pics after the cleaning. 2 of the grooves came out almost perfectly clean with no apparent firecracking, the other two show as pictured below. the two clean grooves are i believe the "top" grooves

comments?

View attachment 1110664 View attachment 1110665 View attachment 1110666 View attachment 1110667

With this method, you have not fixed the barrel metal (firecracking) with the bore paste. You have cleaned out the fissures within the grooves and the surface spots of carbon. The top Before/after pics reveal, the striations and the fissures are still there, just less pronounced when the different colorations of carbon and copper fowling don't magnify it. As for the lack of performance before the cleaning/polishing, I suggest a carbon ring may have had something to do with it. I have seen worse looking barrel internals perform exquisitely. As I have continued to express in many threads like this...
"borescopes and chronographs should come with psychological disclaimers" !

 

[swadiver]

With this method, you have not fixed the barrel metal (firecracking) with the bore paste. You have cleaned out the fissures within the grooves and the surface spots of carbon. The top Before/after pics reveal, the striations and the fissures are still there, just less pronounced when the different colorations of carbon and copper fowling don't magnify it. As for the lack of performance before the cleaning/polishing, I suggest a carbon ring may have had something to do with it. I have seen worse looking barrel internals perform exquisitely. As I have continued to express in many threads like this...
"borescopes and chronographs should come with psychological disclaimers" !

these are not before and after pics. these are the pics of all the individual four grooves after the cleaning

 

[coldboreshot]

Is each picture within the same circumference area? If so, it makes no sense how the bore paste only cleans 2 groves and lands and not the others. Im not familiar with Speedy's method but you might want to try a more snug bore mop, if that is what you are using. I agree with one of the other suggestions, re adjust your cleaning regimen. But it still remains...bore paste polishes out the residue, not grind down the metal. Throw some carbide dust in with the paste and you would probably end up with that result. But please, dont do that

 

[ebb]

I had a friend complain about his new Sako 300 win mag go from 3/4 inch to 12 inch group. Me and the Sako rep both told him it needed a good cleaning with copper solvent. He wouldn't believe either of us and said his bore snake was good enough. So I told him to buy a bore scope. He said too much money. I asked if he would go halves on one if I had custody, he agreed. The grooves looked as if they were gold plated. I cleaned it twice with Montana extreme. But as I rotated the scope the upper grooves were still gold. I hung the rifle upside down in my cleaning cradle and the gravity didn't pull all the Montana to the bottom and with it up side down it cleaned up. Two fowlers and the next 3 shot were 5/8s of an inch. Friend shot a nice 5x5 bull elk on his trip. I still have custody of the bore scope.

 

[swadiver]

Is each picture within the same circumference area? If so, it makes no sense how the bore paste only cleans 2 groves and lands and not the others. Im not familiar with Speedy's method but you might want to try a more snug bore mop, if that is what you are using. I agree with one of the other suggestions, re adjust your cleaning regimen. But it still remains...bore paste polishes out the residue, not grind down the metal. Throw some carbide dust in with the paste and you would probably end up with that result. But please, dont do that

http://forum.accurateshooter.com/at...emanding-shooting-disiplines-std-pdf.1098940/

 

[coldboreshot]

http://forum.accurateshooter.com/at...emanding-shooting-disiplines-std-pdf.1098940/

I'm not disputing Speedy's methods of utilizing JB bore paste. The bore paste is not going to eliminate firecracking, fissures and any other anomalies that result from extreme temp and pressure in the metal. Over time, it MAY remove a minor surface scratch on the metal. The method of using the bore paste is to properly clean out the problem area. As I stated earlier, I have seen brand new chambered barrels with NO round counts yet that have fissures, pits and other anomalies from the beginning, that shoot extremely well. I would explore other reasons for the drop in accuracy aside from firecracking. And I am quite aware of Speedy's accomplishments but thanks for the memory refresher.

 

[swadiver]

I'm not disputing Speedy's methods of utilizing JB bore paste. The bore paste is not going to eliminate firecracking, fissures and any other anomalies that result from extreme temp and pressure in the metal. Over time, it MAY remove a minor surface scratch on the metal. The method of using the bore paste is to properly clean out the problem area. As I stated earlier, I have seen brand new chambered barrels with NO round counts yet that have fissures, pits and other anomalies from the beginning, that shoot extremely well. I would explore other reasons for the drop in accuracy aside from firecracking. And I am quite aware of Speedy's accomplishments but thanks for the memory refresher.

i was not expecting the borepaste to eliminate the firecracking. the whole reason for my post was the interesting difference in the firecracking among the 4 different grooves in the barrel. i will shoot the barrel until it's consistent precision no longer lives up to my expectations. thanks for the input

 

[coldboreshot]

Roger that.