Heavy 10 First Step - Power

[hoz53]

just sayin' that in MY experience with city/county/state administrations, ain't NUTTIN' ever simple....

Truer words have never been spoken about building departments and they get worse every year.

 

[hoz53]

Wouldn't it be simpler to upgrade your power source. Then have an electrical contractor pull a permit and wire it correctly?

Another thing around here the utility will want to know how much electricity you will be buying from them every month if you want to install 3 phase. The minimum is much more than a hobbyist or even a guy with a one man full time shop would use.

 

[hoz53]

The VFD that I just Googled looks similar to the well controller I've had installed in a couple of new home projects. They ran off a 30 amp breaker, am I with you on that?
Administrations I deal with on a daily bases so I'm cool there.

A VFD is much different than a well controller for a house. VFDs come in many different sizes. You can get one for a 100 horse motor if you want.

 

[hoz53]

I've never been asked that question,
I do however calculate load and locked rotor current when filling out my power apps , new transformers cost me around 6k upgrading a 25 K pole transformer is under a grand I've paid 2700 to have a new pole set etc. Extending a gas main is $60 a ft now

Well ok here they ask about the load and # of hours you will be using the equipment so they calculate their revenue from it. With 3 phase you need 3 transformers. Sometimes they are all built into one housing.

 

[Someoldguy]

Why would they need to calculate hours?
There's a meter..

The electric utility is not interested in installing or maintaining equipment that is not creating a positive revenue stream.

For someone who claims to deal with these situations all the time, you certainly seem to lack a fundamental understanding.

 

[Someoldguy]

A VFD is much different than a well controller for a house. VFDs come in many different sizes. You can get one for a 100 horse motor if you want.

They get much bigger than that. I deal with stuff that's 1000 HP per motor and I've no doubt there's bigger stuff out there.

 

[hoz53]

When they ask you about load they may be calculating your current transformer for capacity

They want to know before the meter is there - when things are in the planning stages so they can project revenue also yes they need to size the transformer but they want to calculate revenue also.

 

[hoz53]

They get much bigger than that. I deal with stuff that's 1000 HP per motor and I've no doubt there's bigger stuff out there.

I know they do - I was using that as an example. I have installed some bigger than that to. Thanks

 

[Someoldguy]

That's the most ridiculous statement .. does the nurse know your on the internet?

Oh, now that's a real zinger. I should ask you the same about your mother.

 

[hoz53]

That's the most ridiculous statement .. does the nurse know your on the internet?

. oldguys statement about the utility’s and revenue is right on the money

 

[Shrek]

I've never been asked that question,
I do however calculate load and locked rotor current when filling out my power apps , new transformers cost me around 6k upgrading a 25 K pole transformer is under a grand I've paid 2700 to have a new pole set etc. Extending a gas main is $60 a ft now

The cost of a good quality VFD is under $300 for a 3hp and around $200 for a 1hp and adds a bunch of performance features to a South Bend 10L. I checked on 3 phase power to my house a few years back and it was going to cost thousands to hook it up and since I was residential and wouldn’t use anywhere near the minimum I was going to be charged a $120 a month access fee for 3 phase. A RPC will work great but you’re missing all the features a VFD brings. If you’re just going to have a couple of old technology 3 phase machines the VFD is the way to go and if you’re going to have more than four or five machines then a Phase Perfect would be the way to go imo.

 

[hoz53]

The cost of a good quality VFD is under $300 for a 3hp and around $200 for a 1hp and adds a bunch of performance features to a South Bend 10L. I checked on 3 phase power to my house a few years back and it was going to cost thousands to hook it up and since I was residential and wouldn’t use anywhere near the minimum I was going to be charged a $120 a month access fee for 3 phase. A RPC will work great but you’re missing all the features a VFD brings. If you’re just going to have a couple of old technology 3 phase machines the VFD is the way to go and if you’re going to have more than four or five machines then a Phase Perfect would be the way to go imo.

I’ve got a rotary phase converter I built. It is handy for hooking up any miscellaneous 3phase motor I want to run. I’ve also got VFDs on machines where they are useful- like the lathe, mill ect. Everyone’s situation is a little different. I worked on MGM City Center in Las Vegas and they put VFDs on every motor in that place.

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Greg, you are on the right path. 3 phase is not practical unless it's already there... and still not, at that.

 

[Shrek]

I’ve got a rotary phase converter I built. It is handy for hooking up any miscellaneous 3phase motor I want to run. I’ve also got VFDs on machines where they are useful- like the lathe, mill ect. Everyone’s situation is a little different. I worked on MGM City Center in Las Vegas and they put VFDs on every motor in that place.

Sounds like you have the best of all options. A low cost rotary and VFD’s where they do you the most good.

 

[hoz53]

That's not what p... me off

i know

 

[GSPV]

Hey guys, just a power update on my SB10L project.

I looked into doing the 220 outlet myself and got snowed under in all of the NEC associated with it.

So, I’ve got an electrician coming out Sunday to put in the 220 outlet.

I’ve got to double check my rewiring of the motor from 440 to 220. Just something that occurred to me and I can’t get out of my head.

From there, I’ll start on the VFD part of the project.

In an ideal world, I would have liked to run an initial test of the motor without the VFD in place. You know, the “change one thing at a time” philosophy. But, because I need the VFD for 1P-to-3P conversation, I can’t.

I’ve been following this tutorial. I’m not sold on the Teco VFD. I’m going to do quite a bit of research before selecting one. Looking for models that have awesome support. Life is too short to wade through incorrect documentation written by someone with poor English writing skills

 

[Shrek]

GSPV , what , you can’t read and understand Chinglish ?...

 

[GSPV]

GSPV , what , you can’t read and understand Chinglish ?...

It’s not that I cannot .

I *have* to deal with poor English and poor documentation in my work life. I *choose* not to in my personal life *and* I put my money where my mouth is.

 

[Someoldguy]

Hey guys, just a power update on my SB10L project.

I looked into doing the 220 outlet myself and got snowed under in all of the NEC associated with it.

So, I’ve got an electrician coming out Sunday to put in the 220 outlet.

I’ve got to double check my rewiring of the motor from 440 to 220. Just something that occurred to me and I can’t get out of my head.

From there, I’ll start on the VFD part of the project.

In an ideal world, I would have liked to run an initial test of the motor without the VFD in place. You know, the “change one thing at a time” philosophy. But, because I need the VFD for 1P-to-3P conversation, I can’t.

I’ve been following this tutorial. I’m not sold on the Teco VFD. I’m going to do quite a bit of research before selecting one. Looking for models that have awesome support. Life is too short to wade through incorrect documentation written by someone with poor English writing skills

While you have your electrician at your home, I'd suggest you have him check your motor wiring and look at the VFD you're considering while he's there. Conversations on the 'net can be difficult for many reasons, but some information you are presenting is a bit confusing. Best to make sure your set-up is what you need.

Just a suggestion, no offence intended to anyone.

 

[ridgeway]

Hook up your 220v into the input side of VFD and the 3PH output to motor(three wires). All over switches and controls are laid out in manual and controlled with low voltage(VFD side of drive).

Here is mine wired on bench.

Biggest hurdle is understanding the manual. Read it over and over...once you have an understanding of what is going on...it will fall into place. I've never touched a VFD in my life and got it figured out. I'm far from being a electrician also...then again...I'm sure many electricians never messed with a VFD.