Hart prototype 5 groove?

[dmoran]

Over the years, I personally used 4-grove barrels exclusively until my last 2 barrels, which are both 5R's. Have one on my HV-Gun (Benchmark) and one on a LT-Gun (Bartlein), both are 31" / .237 bore / 8-twists. Here are my own assessments between my 4-groove and 5R-groove barrels:
- Accuracy - not much difference, just that the 5R's have not given up any to the 4-grooves.
- Speed - the Bartlein is the slowest barrel I've ever owned and the Benchmark is the one of the fastest.
- Fouling - as good or better then my better 4-grooves
- Cleaning - have to give a small edge to the 5R's
- Barrel life - the 5R's have advanced and eroded near the same as my 4-grooves
Have a 3rd one chambered and ready to go (6Dasher / Benchmark), but have not yet shot it.

As to results and raw accuracy potential between barrel aspects, feel most are simply coincidental.
My 2-Cents,
Donovan

 

[JBT47]

I've used Krieger 5R and 4 groove, Broughton, Bartlein 5R, Brux, and Schneider. I have no preference as to how many grooves or the geometry of the same. If it shoots I am happy.

 

[Tim Singleton]

Jeff Summers is a bad man with anyone's barrel
Doesn't matter how many grooves are in it

 

[Tim s]

The Hart is a 5 groove conventional-ish. I spoke with the guy who designed and made the button, but cant remember his name now. 10 degrees more cant than conventional. That doesn't put them in the 5r category in my book. Should have one here any day.

Good Lord, exactly what degree of cant constitutes an "R" designation precisely ?
Likely you talked to Jack Sutton...the guy that runs Hart's barrel shop.

 

[GerryM]

I bought 10 new barrels from Hart last month
They are 5 R rifling. I'll let you know what happens as to accuracy. The older ones i have still shoot very very well
Hart barrels seem to last longer then some of the other brands.

 

[butchlambert]

I bought 10 new barrels from Hart last month
They are 5 R rifling. I'll let you know what happens as to accuracy. The older ones i have still shoot very very well
Hart barrels seem to last longer then some of the other brands.

Tell us why they last longer.

 

[Raythemanroe]

Tell us why they last longer.

Doesn't take 100-150 rnds to settle in vs cut..


Ray

 

[butchlambert]

Doesn't take 100-150 rnds to settle in vs cut..


Ray

Settle in? Mine shoot from the get go or don't shoot, regardless of brand. I don't understand settle in.
Ray I will look at your reply later. I'm leaving one shop and going to my other.

 

[Raythemanroe]

Settle in? Mine shoot from the get go or don't shoot, regardless of brand. I don't understand settle in.
Ray I will look at your reply later. I'm leaving one shop and going to my other.

Butch, I feel button seem to clean easier or with less coppering from the get go..

Ray

 

[Alex Wheeler]

You guys be the judge. This is the muzzle drop from a 8 twist hart five groove.

 

[dedeadeye]

I think what Ray is referring to is speed. Most, if not all of my Krieger's actually reach max velocity between 80-100 rounds. In my short range years the Hart button barrels were at max speed from the get go. I would assume that would also hold true with the new 5 groove.
In conversation with a number of shooters across the country, it would appear Hart's are doing extremely well in short and long range. Really great to hear as the Harts and Jack Sutton are very fine people and have always been a credit to the accuracy game.
Roger Gower

 

[g.ross]

You guys be the judge. This is the muzzle drop from a 8 twist hart five groove.View attachment 1020937 View attachment 1020938

Is this a new unfired blank?Great cleaning method it is used!!!

 

[Tim Singleton]

Jeff may just have a new bullet die and happen to shoot them thru a Hart

 

[Raythemanroe]

Alex, if it is canted I don't see it..


Ray

 

[Tim s]

Good Lord Alex, the thread started relative to short range BR and what the shop is doing there......as in 6MM 14 twist barrels .
Why did you not splain to the class what the hell you ordered. How this is relevant to the initial question is beyond me, it's not even the same button.
You believe whatever blows your skirt up.

 

[butchlambert]

Ray, as you probably know, I don't think a lapped barrel needs any "break in". Your copper in a new barrel comes from the fluff in the throat from chambering. Take care of that and you are "broke in". My Ohler 35P show no difference in velocity fro the beginning until it is retired.

 

[Raythemanroe]

Timmy mad

Ray

 

[butchlambert]

He'll get over it.

 

[Raythemanroe]

Ray, as you probably know, I don't think a lapped barrel needs any "break in". Your copper in a new barrel comes from the fluff in the throat from chambering. Take care of that and you are "broke in". My Ohler 35P show no difference in velocity fro the beginning until it is retired.

I don't think your wrong Butch, in a perfect world.. I don't think all Barrels are equal, even from the same maker.. Button in my opinion need less lapping because of the nature of manufacturing processes.. Therefore ship a higher percentage that copper less from the get go.. The Wheeler built 6BRA is a cut barrel and I haven't had much copper at all.. I'm just going by my general experience..


Ray

 

[Tim s]

Tell us why they last longer.

Butch,
I don't want o step on Ray's answer but I tend to suspect it boils down to the precise "R" in 416R.
Back when most everything was sourced from Crucilbe they had their formulation down pretty good but even then you had lot to lot varience.
As PJ once told me " you gotta remember the difference between straight 416 and R is primarily sulpher which is basically dirt and does'nt really want to mix well" .
Most guys do not understand that when a button shop gets a new lot of steel, they have to play with drill and reamer sizes to end up with the hole they want. When they get a great lot of steel which yeilds great barrels.....better pick up a few while they last because when that lot is gone they're back to page one to some degree.
Tough to earn a living making barrels.