Reloads not chambering

[Brians356]

My 260 has done the same as Drainmelex; although my brass started out as Win 243. I needed a small base die for some reason, on the 1st or 2nd firing. I guess when the smith chambered the barrel he used some tight ended reamer. I got a small base body die and ran the brass through which were a problem and had no more issues. I don't use it all the time, just the once or twice if needed.

It sure would be helpful for Dranmelex to tell us something (anything) about his chamber.
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[jlow]

I wonder how many rounds you have shot out of that chamber and your cleaning routine is? The reason is if you do not clean much and you have significant rounds down the tube, you could be building a carbon ring. If that is your problem, it is presumably slowly been building and so it might affect a few rounds that might be seated slightly longer. Do the sharpie coloring thing as suggested by gunsandgunsmithing. If you have a carbon ring, you will see scratches at around the case neck opening bullet junction.

 

[Mark C]

Once again, Neck Sizing dies prove their worthlessness.....at least in the competi
.

My 260 has done the same as Drainmelex; although my brass started out as Win 243. I needed a small base die for some reason, on the 1st or 2nd firing. I guess when the smith chambered the barrel he used some tight ended reamer. I got a small base body die and ran the brass through which were a problem and had no more issues. I don't use it all the time, just the once or twice if needed.

Do you think small base body dies has any effect on a accuracy ?

 

[Mark C]

My 260 has done the same as Drainmelex; although my brass started out as Win 243. I needed a small base die for some reason, on the 1st or 2nd firing. I guess when the smith chambered the barrel he used some tight ended reamer. I got a small base body die and ran the brass through which were a problem and had no more issues. I don't use it all the time, just the once or twice if needed.

 

[Darrel Martin]

So I've been reloading for about 15 years and never came across what I came across this evening. I loaded 110 rounds of 260 for a long range course I'm taking next weekend and shot 10 today to zero and get chrono info. I noticed one wouldn't chamber. So I came home and measured everything. Headspace was good, base to ogive was good, neck diameter, brass length. Everything checked out.

This was virgin brass that I ran through a body die set for .002 less than my fired brass. Then neck sized with a bushing die and seated .020 off lands. I got paranoid and ran every round through my action and had 2 of the 110 with this issue.

Only thing I could think was the base of the brass was out of spec, so I set another body up to cam over to simulate a full length sizing. Still no dice. Does a cam over on a redding body die actually simulate a full length sizing?

I just ordered a redding type s full length neck bushing die to consolidate operations. But I'm out of ideas for these two rounds. Any guidance would be appreciated.

Dan

Too simple to be the answer, but I have seen incompletely seated primers prevent bolt closure.

 

[jcampbellsmith]

Just disassemble the two problem rounds and bin the cases. Cases are ten a penny and I just bin those that don't perform. Regards JCS

 

[dkhunt14]

I just now re-read your original post. Is it possible with the body die being set for a .002 bump for your fired cases that the body wasn't supported because the new brass is small and when you sized it, it bulged the shoulder slightly. Also like jlow said I wonder if you don't have a carbon buildup in neck or throat area. Matt

 

[Rsadams]

Mark the cases and see were they are tight..

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

Mark the cases and see were they are tight..

It's obviously more fun just blindly guessing.

 

[foxguy]

Deranmelex,

What are you Finding on the 2-rounds that didn't want to chamber?
What you find and share may help others.

 

[basshusker]

Are you running a Hornady lnl press by chance?

So I've been reloading for about 15 years and never came across what I came across this evening. I loaded 110 rounds of 260 for a long range course I'm taking next weekend and shot 10 today to zero and get chrono info. I noticed one wouldn't chamber. So I came home and measured everything. Headspace was good, base to ogive was good, neck diameter, brass length. Everything checked out.

This was virgin brass that I ran through a body die set for .002 less than my fired brass. Then neck sized with a bushing die and seated .020 off lands. I got paranoid and ran every round through my action and had 2 of the 110 with this issue.

Only thing I could think was the base of the brass was out of spec, so I set another body up to cam over to simulate a full length sizing. Still no dice. Does a cam over on a redding body die actually simulate a full length sizing?

I just ordered a redding type s full length neck bushing die to consolidate operations. But I'm out of ideas for these two rounds. Any guidance would be appreciated.

Dan

 

[Dranmelex]

Dranmelex,
Check the diameter of the bottom of the shoulder on your case. It is possible that neck sizing can force the shoulder to expand at the shoulder/body junction.

The point at the neck shoulder junction is about 3-4 thou bigger which I believe is causing my issue. I'm not sure why it only happened on a couple pieces though. I'm assuming it's because the dies are set for fired brass and there was some inconsistency in the virgin brass.

Like a couple others stated, I could have some carbon build up. I recently started shooting prs style matches and only clean about every 2-300 rounds when velocity and/or accuracy degrade. Is there a way to check and clean carbon ring without disrupting a fouled barrel?

 

[dkhunt14]

The point at the neck shoulder junction is about 3-4 thou bigger which I believe is causing my issue. I'm not sure why it only happened on a couple pieces though. I'm assuming it's because the dies are set for fired brass and there was some inconsistency in the virgin brass.

Like a couple others stated, I could have some carbon build up. I recently started shooting prs style matches and only clean about every 2-300 rounds when velocity and/or accuracy degrade. Is there a way to check and clean carbon ring without disrupting a fouled barrel?

On most guns a clean barrel shoots better. I bet every Bench rest shooter cleans after every target. There is a reason for that. They require the ultimate accuracy. It usually only takes two or three rounds to settle a barrel back down.

With your die set to bump fired cases, a new case fits loosely. If the case is not supported in the die it can bulge the case at neck shoulder junction. Read my previous post. Matt

 

[Dranmelex]

On most guns a clean barrel shoots better. I bet every Bench rest shooter cleans after every target. There is a reason for that. They require the ultimate accuracy. It usually only takes two or three rounds to settle a barrel back down.

With your die set to bump fired cases, a new case fits loosely. If the case is not supported in the die it can bulge the case at neck shoulder junction. Read my previous post. Matt

Thanks Matt! Yeah, I agree a clean barrel will provide better accuracy. However, cleaning between stages and refouling is not an option for the matches I intend on shooting.

I am trying a new die setup going forward consisting of a redding s full length bushing die where I intend to remove the neck button and follow up with a sinclair expanding mandrel to set neck tension to around 0.002. Any thoughts, experiences?

 

[basshusker]

That is what a body die does.......all it is is a FL die that does not have any neck sizing function or have a decapping pin. They do, if set up correctly, bump the shoulder and size the body. I have one for my Dasher, 6-47L, and 6.5-284. LOVE them!!

Absolutely do!

 

[basshusker]

Do you have a Hornady LNL press by chance that you used on this sizing operation?

Reason I ask I had been using one for some of my operations for years. Sizing some larger brass and over time the bushing flexed up when seated. The press lnl bushing and die replaceable bushing had given up the ghost.
I bought two sets of Hornady dies for cousins 243 and neither would bump the shoulder back enough. Sent them to Hornady and they sent back two sealed new dies. Said the first two were in spec. Sent me the press bushing part of the lnl setup to replace for free.

I ran this with a brand new die bushing on the die, and it bumped it slightly more but still not enough (yes I measured shell holders and even ground an extra down).

After 3 dies, put it exact same die and lock ring in the Forster Co-ax and boom (no pun intended) it worked like a charm.

I thought back to my first sizing down of brass for my 6x47L. I had a problem at the neck shoulder Junction and some would barely chamber and others were a smidge back. I had to body bump then neck sized with the Reddings. Even bought a Forster FL sizer. Same thing. Grabbed a new box that I was getting into rotation, same thing on Hornady but no prob on Co-ax!

Also tried 243 die in LNL Progressive. Sized it fine.

For those of you with Hornady that has been used a while, and see an issue like this, might be worth checking out.

 

[Dranmelex]

Do you have a Hornady LNL press by chance that you used on this sizing operation?

Reason I ask I had been using one for some of my operations for years. Sizing some larger brass and over time the bushing flexed up when seated. The press lnl bushing and die replaceable bushing had given up the ghost.
I bought two sets of Hornady dies for cousins 243 and neither would bump the shoulder back enough. Sent them to Hornady and they sent back two sealed new dies. Said the first two were in spec. Sent me the press bushing part of the lnl setup to replace for free.

I ran this with a brand new die bushing on the die, and it bumped it slightly more but still not enough (yes I measured shell holders and even ground an extra down).

After 3 dies, put it exact same die and lock ring in the Forster Co-ax and boom (no pun intended) it worked like a charm.

I thought back to my first sizing down of brass for my 6x47L. I had a problem at the neck shoulder Junction and some would barely chamber and others were a smidge back. I had to body bump then neck sized with the Reddings. Even bought a Forster FL sizer. Same thing. Grabbed a new box that I was getting into rotation, same thing on Hornady but no prob on Co-ax!

Also tried 243 die in LNL Progressive. Sized it fine.

For those of you with Hornady that has been used a while, and see an issue like this, might be worth checking out.

I am using a RCBS rockchucker single stage press. I have thought about upgrading to the co-ax eventually, but RCBS has done well for me thusfar. I am going to start using a redding full length bushing die and set it to push shoulder 0.002 and neck size in one operation. Then I intend on using a sinclair expander die to standardize the case neck tension.

 

[SheepDog]

What makes you think you need to push the shoulder back .002"?
Have you had problems with the case to shoulder dimension causing problems?
Do you also trim your cases to the "trim to" length every time?

Pushing the shoulder back, trimming cases and neck turning should only be done as necessary. There is no reason to make the case sloppier in the chamber than it needs to be.

 

[jlow]

What makes you think you need to push the shoulder back .002"?
Have you had problems with the case to shoulder dimension causing problems?
Do you also trim your cases to the "trim to" length every time?

Pushing the shoulder back, trimming cases and neck turning should only be done as necessary. There is no reason to make the case sloppier in the chamber than it needs to be.

Not sure I agree with this. I still remember reading in Glen Zediker’s book “Handloading for Competition” that if you don’t bump a nominal amount, you stand a chance of sizing the shoulder with your bolt which can cause galling on the bolt which in turn can cause a change in your chamber dimensions.

 

[SheepDog]

You are saying that pressure from brass can gall a tool steel bolt? That chambering around made of brass can change the dimensions of a chrome-molly chamber? C'mon...
It should chamber with more room around it than when you extracted it from the chamber after firing. The shoulder is supported by the die as you size, you just aren't moving it back. Think the process through.

The cartridge might have a small chance of being flared by a sizing die if you used it to partially sized the neck without bringing the case and die together at the shoulder neck junction but it would still not damage the rifle. It would just chamber hard or not chamber at all. If the steel in your bolt or chamber can be galled by a brass case you should be using black powder and not smokeless.