AckleymanII
Gold $$ Contributor
I only formed 50 cases on the 22/243 AI.
Considering a 22-243.
- Thread starter tjassman84
- Start date
There are two "Cheetahs".
The Mark I flavor is a near twin to the .22-243AI, sharing the 40 ° shoulder. The Cheetah Mark II has a 28 ° shoulder. Main difference is that the Cheetahs are built off necking down (small primer pocket) .308Palma brass. Whereas, the .22-243Win & AI are a simple step down of .243Win brass.
I had a .22-243Win for a few years, it opened my eyes to the capability of what a fast twist .224 hotrod can do. I could plaster my 1K steel target relative ease, courtesy of Alliant powders & 75 Amaxs.
Fast forward a couple years, compared my .22-243Win case side by side to a .22-243AI. That got the wheels turning on how to make a very good thing, better!
Side by side:
Cool thing about the .22-243Win is, there is brass, everywhere for it. Heck, I just picked up 50pcs. of Hornady at the local range, for free. Or, you can load with Lapua & roll in style.
For reloading, if you have .243Win dies already, you're either halfway home...or already there! A .243Win bushing die with proper bushing is all ya need for sizing. And, a .243Win seater will work fine for heavy .224 bullets.
Same rules apply for .22-243AI dies, all ya need is a 243AI bushing die. The 243AI seater works fine.
Middlested is a cool round, almost like a .22SLR. But, if I'm fireforming, I'll go 'full monty' and blow it all the way out to AI & enjoy the extra capacity. Beyond that, the Middlested is gonna need a custom die if you wish to FL size at all. Might get away with a .243AI sizer? For that, the net gain in performance is negligible over a .22-243Win. I have 'one off' wildcats & custom dies, but only because there wasn't an easy alternative. Simple fact is, a .22-243Win is just that...easy!
For easy peasy, throttle up a .22-243Win with RL-22 or 17. By the time you need to trim brass, it'll be toast. And ya won't fret losing one, here & there...
Or, fireform that .22-243Win to an AI. More capacity = ability to run a full case of slow burn powder like H1000 or Retumbo. Might just eek ya out a couple hundred more rounds on the back end, and you'll still hit that 35-3700fps 'sweet spot' where a 75-80gr bullet seems to perform optimally, without over-stressing the bullet...
Performance wise, whatever a .22Creed can do, a .22-243Win has already been doing for a long time. .22Creed is just the new kid on the block to reach the same end. If Lapua 6.5Creed (smal pocket) brass comes out, you'll need two steps to get to .224. Whereas, Lapua .243 brass is one step. Up to you, if you think the percieved benefit of (small pocket) Creed is worth the extra step?
.22x47L is a little badazz, but you'll need to pressure those cases to the roof to match a .22-243AI. And likely, that will negatively impact barrel life that is already short on a .224 hotrod. Up to you, if you consider that a good idea?
Wild card (for me) with the .22-243AI is using RL-26. I still haven't been able to find any! Bet that would make a .22-243AI even more of a short action monster than it already is...
Obviously, we've all got our favorites! If you've got components for any of 'em, that makes decisions easier. Regardless of what ya go with, you'll have ALOT of fun!!!
The Mark I flavor is a near twin to the .22-243AI, sharing the 40 ° shoulder. The Cheetah Mark II has a 28 ° shoulder. Main difference is that the Cheetahs are built off necking down (small primer pocket) .308Palma brass. Whereas, the .22-243Win & AI are a simple step down of .243Win brass.
I had a .22-243Win for a few years, it opened my eyes to the capability of what a fast twist .224 hotrod can do. I could plaster my 1K steel target relative ease, courtesy of Alliant powders & 75 Amaxs.
Fast forward a couple years, compared my .22-243Win case side by side to a .22-243AI. That got the wheels turning on how to make a very good thing, better!
Side by side:
Cool thing about the .22-243Win is, there is brass, everywhere for it. Heck, I just picked up 50pcs. of Hornady at the local range, for free. Or, you can load with Lapua & roll in style.
For reloading, if you have .243Win dies already, you're either halfway home...or already there! A .243Win bushing die with proper bushing is all ya need for sizing. And, a .243Win seater will work fine for heavy .224 bullets.
Same rules apply for .22-243AI dies, all ya need is a 243AI bushing die. The 243AI seater works fine.
Middlested is a cool round, almost like a .22SLR. But, if I'm fireforming, I'll go 'full monty' and blow it all the way out to AI & enjoy the extra capacity. Beyond that, the Middlested is gonna need a custom die if you wish to FL size at all. Might get away with a .243AI sizer? For that, the net gain in performance is negligible over a .22-243Win. I have 'one off' wildcats & custom dies, but only because there wasn't an easy alternative. Simple fact is, a .22-243Win is just that...easy!
For easy peasy, throttle up a .22-243Win with RL-22 or 17. By the time you need to trim brass, it'll be toast. And ya won't fret losing one, here & there...
Or, fireform that .22-243Win to an AI. More capacity = ability to run a full case of slow burn powder like H1000 or Retumbo. Might just eek ya out a couple hundred more rounds on the back end, and you'll still hit that 35-3700fps 'sweet spot' where a 75-80gr bullet seems to perform optimally, without over-stressing the bullet...
Performance wise, whatever a .22Creed can do, a .22-243Win has already been doing for a long time. .22Creed is just the new kid on the block to reach the same end. If Lapua 6.5Creed (smal pocket) brass comes out, you'll need two steps to get to .224. Whereas, Lapua .243 brass is one step. Up to you, if you think the percieved benefit of (small pocket) Creed is worth the extra step?
.22x47L is a little badazz, but you'll need to pressure those cases to the roof to match a .22-243AI. And likely, that will negatively impact barrel life that is already short on a .224 hotrod. Up to you, if you consider that a good idea?
Wild card (for me) with the .22-243AI is using RL-26. I still haven't been able to find any! Bet that would make a .22-243AI even more of a short action monster than it already is...
Obviously, we've all got our favorites! If you've got components for any of 'em, that makes decisions easier. Regardless of what ya go with, you'll have ALOT of fun!!!
Good point Dean... that sure is some serious Dragon Breath
GREAT POST... Fredo
GREAT POST... Fredo
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The reason I went with the Middlestead over they other two options is, the 22-243 I could only find the reamer no dies, and the 22-243AI I could only find the dies and no reamer, but I found both for the middlestead.
Dean
PS: I love this section of forum section, no pissing contest just good stuff.
Dean
PS: I love this section of forum section, no pissing contest just good stuff.
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After reading Fredo post now I know I want one!!! Good job Fredo!
Phil
Gold $$ Contributor
Fredo... every time i look at that picture of the two cases... I just shake my head...WOW... what a difference in case capacity... I'm sticking with the AI.
Those 80 Bergers will hold up at those speeds and even faster but not with an 8 twist, it takes a 10 twist or slower, to make them stay together.
Dean
And how does a 10 twist stabilize the 80 VLD? Recommended twist is 8.
I couldn't ever get them to stay together in my 8 twist.
This is how 
LOL
By "staying together" did mean stabilize or the jackets coming apart due to excessive bullet RPM.
I Present to you exhibit A
PS:The 12 twist sends them well over 4000fps. How much more, you would not believe me anyway.
PPS: I can even send those sierra 77gr, with there short bearing surface in the 14 twist. They are substantially faster than they 80gr for only 3gr difference.
LOLBy "staying together" did mean stabilize or the jackets coming apart due to excessive bullet RPM.
I Present to you exhibit A
PS:The 12 twist sends them well over 4000fps. How much more, you would not believe me anyway.
PPS: I can even send those sierra 77gr, with there short bearing surface in the 14 twist. They are substantially faster than they 80gr for only 3gr difference.
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My .22 Vais shoots 80 Berger VLDs at 3560 across 30 inch barrels just fine but it DOES use moly coated bullets and a 3 land Lilja 8 twist barrel. How important is the moly? How important is the 3 land? Don't know, but the combination works.
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I share your enthusiasm for large and fast 80 grain .22's. The included article on the .22/243 and .22/.243 AI is spot on. I think it would be foolish to build such a wildcat for paper and steel, but for hunting at long range, they create excitement. When the article addresses smashing steel at 1000 yards, he is not kidding.
I am a long range groundhog hunter and normally will have two benches set up, one for the .22 Vais and one for my .260 AI. My 6/284 has become redundant while I cover to 1500 yards or maybe even more.
Just handling a high speed big .22 puts a smile on my face.
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The .22-284 with the 80 Amax is whispering to me.......
Hope you are kidding because it would have no use except to impress others with the WOW factor. Even if your family makes rifle barrels, it is a non-starter.
I've shot my AI that many times, and it's still good.... you just gotta use a slower burning powder instead of shooting it like a bomb.
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