I know this is an old question but modern powders, bullets, and guns raise it again. How can a .308 be ballistically superior to the .06' when they both fire the same bullets and the .06 has a larger shell??? I'm just curious because I own both guns but haven't had the opportunity to shoot them both beyond 200 yards (yet). The .06' has been my go to deer gun for the last 10 years, I used a 25-.06 before that which was stolen. I won the .308 Ruger American last year in a gun raffle and just changed the stock to get a better cheek weld. I'm just curious if there's an advantage to the .308 that I'm not aware of.
.308 or 30-.06?
- Thread starter Rustypipes12
- Start date
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
Where are you seeing better ballistics? You may be seeing more custom handloading and refined performance with the 308 Since its used more in precision shooting
It can't, at least if you are talking about conventional downrange exterior ballistics.
You can do almost as much (and practically everything you need) with less powder and less recoil.
And you can do it in a short action, with it's lighter weight and shorter bolt throw, if that matters to you.
Myself, I prefer short actions for various reasons, but there is no way it "ballistically superior".
XTR
F-TR obssessed shooting junkie
For most bullets the -06 can achieve 100 to 150 FPS more MV, esp once you get to heavy bullets.
In a hunting (i.e, not a target rifle) setup with limited OALs the 308 really isn't setup to push bullets heavier than 175s, but the -06 can.
The 308 uses a short action and less powder, for hunting deer smaller than elk shooting a 165 grain bullet at 100 FPS less makes them just as dead with pretty much the same efficiency at most reasonable ranges with less recoil.
Target shooting, German Salazar once upon a time had a season long comparison of his two identical rifles shooting at 1000 yards. One was a 308 the other was an -06. The -06 showed a slight score advantage over the course of the yr (less than 1% of possible score) He shot over 99% with both.
In a hunting (i.e, not a target rifle) setup with limited OALs the 308 really isn't setup to push bullets heavier than 175s, but the -06 can.
The 308 uses a short action and less powder, for hunting deer smaller than elk shooting a 165 grain bullet at 100 FPS less makes them just as dead with pretty much the same efficiency at most reasonable ranges with less recoil.
Target shooting, German Salazar once upon a time had a season long comparison of his two identical rifles shooting at 1000 yards. One was a 308 the other was an -06. The -06 showed a slight score advantage over the course of the yr (less than 1% of possible score) He shot over 99% with both.
For hunting in the west, choose the 06 for the higher velocity and the ability to shoot heavier bullets. Elk are a tad tougher than deer. For hunting in the east either will do fine. If ranges get real long the 06 will do better but not by a lot. I have both and push come to shove, I'll usually gravitate towards the 06 for hunting.
Try the 185gr berger juggs in your 308 and see how they shoot
Have owned and shot both for many years. Both are outstanding white tail cartridges and both will get the job done. For 150 grain bullets, the 308 can approach the 06 in performance but were the 06 shines is at 165 grain bullets and above. With the heavier bullet and powder charges in the 06 the recoil is noticeably higher but still not severe.
Trust me, a white tail will never know the difference at reasonable ranges, 300 yards and under.
I personally like the 308 because of the shorter action. My favorite white tail load is Varget and 150 Sierra Pro Hunter bullets. The recoil is mild, accuracy is in the 1/2 moa range and terminal performance is excellent.
Trust me, a white tail will never know the difference at reasonable ranges, 300 yards and under.
I personally like the 308 because of the shorter action. My favorite white tail load is Varget and 150 Sierra Pro Hunter bullets. The recoil is mild, accuracy is in the 1/2 moa range and terminal performance is excellent.
ballistics are very similar 308 Vs 30 .06 But not the same.
Both are military cases designed for military use .
Both were tested to no end by our government.
The 06 is superior at long ranges with heavy bullets The down side of the 06 is the proper powders that were available back during it's testing.
Both do their jobs very well but the 06 does it better past 600 yds.
The 308 has the advantage of quite a lot of surplus ammo being available.
Both are fine cartridges
Both are military cases designed for military use .
Both were tested to no end by our government.
The 06 is superior at long ranges with heavy bullets The down side of the 06 is the proper powders that were available back during it's testing.
Both do their jobs very well but the 06 does it better past 600 yds.
The 308 has the advantage of quite a lot of surplus ammo being available.
Both are fine cartridges
By superiority is this something perceived due to popularity? The military moved to .308WIN to have similar ballistics in a short action with notably less recoil (pound for pound). .308s ballistics are inferior to the .30-06. .308WIN also has a NATO equivalent, while to my knowledge the .30-06 does not.
I think that last statement is the reason why .308 is so popular. People like to own "military cartridges" for multiple reasons. With NATO rounds specifically ammo is comparatively cheap and extremely available on a multinational level.
In the US it's almost as easy to get 30-06 ammo as .308. .308 should still be more slightly more available. If not 7.62X51mm gives you a second option as an ammo source when times get tough.
I think that last statement is the reason why .308 is so popular. People like to own "military cartridges" for multiple reasons. With NATO rounds specifically ammo is comparatively cheap and extremely available on a multinational level.
In the US it's almost as easy to get 30-06 ammo as .308. .308 should still be more slightly more available. If not 7.62X51mm gives you a second option as an ammo source when times get tough.
CaptainMal
Silver $$ Contributor
You are getting GREAT answers. Only thing I perceive is you may not need, want or understand that.
You read like you never shoot far and only shoot deer. That's a nothing and either one would be fine for those needs. People talk about target. You don't do that. Non-issue.
Answers dealing with energy and bullet weight, surplus ammo (available for both), action length, bullet speed etc. are also probably not relevant. You might not have a need to understand the minor differences.
As soon as you mentioned "cheek weld", I had a red flag thrown up. To me that means you want to push your head into some kind of tight stock position that probably feels comfortable but also puts pressure on the gun that make it harder to repeat holds for accuracy.
I say use what you like. It will make no difference if your knowledge and needs are limited to 200 yard deer hunting. Enjoy both rifles.
You read like you never shoot far and only shoot deer. That's a nothing and either one would be fine for those needs. People talk about target. You don't do that. Non-issue.
Answers dealing with energy and bullet weight, surplus ammo (available for both), action length, bullet speed etc. are also probably not relevant. You might not have a need to understand the minor differences.
As soon as you mentioned "cheek weld", I had a red flag thrown up. To me that means you want to push your head into some kind of tight stock position that probably feels comfortable but also puts pressure on the gun that make it harder to repeat holds for accuracy.
I say use what you like. It will make no difference if your knowledge and needs are limited to 200 yard deer hunting. Enjoy both rifles.
Albany Mountain
Silver $$ Contributor
The 308 has noticeable lower recoil which makes it easier on the shooter to shoot well. And it is easier to make an accurate load from the reloading bench.
The military didn't care about recoil.
The move to smaller rounds had to do with weight and size, in a logistical sense.
If they can move many many thousands of rounds of 308 (7.62 NATO) in less space and with less weight (think airlift) compared to the larger 30-06, and if the average soldier can hump day 1000 rounds of 308 instead of say 800 rounds of 30-06, well, you can see the advantages all around. You can take that even further with the move to the 5.56 NATO (223 Rem).
As far as "short action", keep in mind that machine guns don't care, they weren't thinking "short action" (at least in the conventional bolt action sense) with the M-14, and our sniper rifles (M-40, M-24, etc) are all built on long actions anyway.
shoot4fun
Gold $$ Contributor
Do not worry about what you may gain or may give up between 308 and 30-06. Where one shines the other does not but the +/- columns usually total up about even.
IF you have hunted with a 30-06 for the last ten years you should be completely familiar with its diamonds and stones; enough so that it wouldn't get me to give it up for anything else.
IF you have hunted with a 30-06 for the last ten years you should be completely familiar with its diamonds and stones; enough so that it wouldn't get me to give it up for anything else.
TheOtherZilla
Pull my finger
I know it has been noted before, but they both can shoot the same projectile as both are 30 cal. That said I would take a 30-06 over a 308 any day. IMO the 308 is highly over rated..
Actually machine gun designers DO care about action length. The longer the action requires higher energy springs and more cycling mass. These tend to make the gun heavier and can lead to higher failures cuz all that mass has to be stopped and started at the end of the recoil. The original 30-06 was longer than the 7mm Mauser because of powder volume issues with Americn powders. This caused the 1903 rifle to be heavier than the Mauser short rifles.
Isn't the recoil in an 06 dependent on the load?
How, then, can a heavy .308 have less recoil than a light 06?
How, then, can a heavy .308 have less recoil than a light 06?
Thanks for the corrections. : ) I'm not a military history buff.
Logistical concerns make more sense and I'm sure they don't care about the SA vs LA. I would think that "less recoil same stopping power" was a good selling point at some meeting with a bunch of big heads, but you're probably right that the bigger selling point was, "More bullets, less money."
You nailed it Jammer. Perceived recoil is a function of bullet weight, powder burned, and the weight of the rifle/weapon.
A .308 absolutely can kick harder than a 30-06. All things held constant the 30-06 is going to whoop you a bit more.
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