First attempt at neck turning (take 2)

[brokeasajoke]

This is for a Rem 700 VS in 308 w/factory chamber. Thought I'd take a whack at neck turning. Trying to make the best possible ammo (and something new to play with). So I'm asking for critique and help before I move on to the lapua brass. I think I'm going to far into the shoulder. Not trying to completely turn neck but just true it up some. As you can see the cutter angle isn't close to the brass shoulder angle or maybe I'm doing something wrong. Didn't cut as far into the shoulder on top brass. Is pic size ok or too large? Thanks for help.

 

[savageshooter86]

You actually want to match cutter angle to shoulder angle of case. And you want to slightly cut into the shoulder. This helps preventry the dreaded donut forming.

Be sure to push case into cutter nice and slow. And same when taking off cutter

 

[brokeasajoke]

Wonder if K&M makes a cutters with different angles. Got the doughnut reamer mandrel.

 

[1newmexkid]

Well, I gotta ask. Are you sure you got the correct angle on the cutter?

 

[LCazador]

Well, I gotta ask. Are you sure you got the correct angle on the cutter?

Like Savage shooter says you need to cut into the shoulder more to prevent that donut from forming. I cut about 1/32 into the shoulder and I've never had a donut form. I've been neck turning since my first 6PPC in 1975. Cut only .001-.0015" at time. Yes they make different cutter angles. I believe most neck turners come with a 25-30 degree cutter angle. That will work on most cartridges. I added a 40 degree cutter for my Punkin turner to cover all my cartridges.

 

[Joe R]

IMO you're doing it just right. You are cutting very minimally into the shoulder right now, look at the arrows I placed on your picture, you can see a very slight step. That is enough to avoid the dreaded doughnut. IMO you don't need a different cutter, you have the right one now.

 

[Brians356]

To my eye the cut into the shoulder looks deep, but I'm here to learn as well (still getting my neck turning rig assembled.) If that's how deep it should be, I'm glad for these photos.

Also, I agree the cutter angle seems to be much more acute than the shoulder angle, otherwise there wouldn't be such a pronounced step. By today's standards, the 308 Win's 20-deg shoulder angle is fairly shallow. Judging from the shape of the step, the cutter appears to have at least a 35-deg angle, but that could an optical illusion.

 

[brokeasajoke]

Seems I cant find replacement K&M cutters with different angles. You can see torwards the mouth of the case it didnt cut at all. cases were sized in a redding type s FL and expanded on K&m mandrel.

 

[Gabe22BR]

Going to have to say, that in a factory chamber rifle, neck turning is a waste of time. But you can get used to turning necks for when you do get a custom chambering. This has just been my experience....

 

[Dos XX]

It looks like those are turned further into the shoulder than I do it. That doesn't make it wrong. I don't want to feel the step with my fingernail on mine, or at the most just barely feel it. I go for kind of blending the cut from the neck to the shoulder and not making a step.

That said, I don't care about donuts because I don't load bullets that far into the neck, so I am not turning for donut prevention. If you could post a pic of an unturned neck next to one of those turned necks, it would really show how far into the shoulder you are.

 

[Brians356]

You can see torwards the mouth of the case it didnt cut at all.

I noticed that. That suggests the neck walls get progressively thinner towards the case mouth, which is how most cases mic out for me.

 

[Webster]

This is for a Rem 700 VS in 308 w/factory chamber. Thought I'd take a whack at neck turning. Trying to make the best possible ammo (and something new to play with). So I'm asking for critique and help before I move on to the lapua brass. I think I'm going to far into the shoulder. Not trying to completely turn neck but just true it up some. As you can see the cutter angle isn't close to the brass shoulder angle or maybe I'm doing something wrong. Didn't cut as far into the shoulder on top brass. Is pic size ok or too large? Thanks for help.View attachment 973701 View attachment 973702

It's a low cost factory rifle for hunting. You shouldn't see accuracy improvements by neck turning. On my 6BR varmint rifle I don't turn into the shoulder area. I do a light clean up only removing metal from about 50-70% of the neck. 70 gr bullets are seated only half way down the neck. I don't care if donuts form. I don't like the idea of thinning the shoulder unless it's necessary. Your probably removing more than the donut. From what others have said on this website donuts are only a problem seating heavy bullets that go deep into the neck and the donut interferes with seating. You have 308. Determine how far down the neck 150-175 GR bullets go. If your nowhere near the bottom of the neck I wouldn't turn into the shoulder. Most of your improvement will come from trying different powders and bullets and bench rest skills.

 

[Scott Harris]

PMA makes good stuff. You can get a cutter for the exact shoulder angle, which allows you to cut into the shoulder without fear.

 

[/VH]

Here is how I was taught; turned on a pumkin with a cutter that has a matching shoulder angle.

 

[Brians356]

It's a low cost factory rifle for hunting. You shouldn't see accuracy improvements by neck turning. ... Most of your improvement will come from trying different powders and bullets and bench rest skills.

You're spot on, of course. But, you're taking all the fun out of it! Some guys seem to think of neck turning, case cleaning, and case annealing as hobbies in and of themselves.

 

[Brians356]

In the 2nd photo it looks like the cutter blade needs to be reversed (Turned around)???

I wonder what you're seeing? The cutter seems correctly oriented to me, with the angled edge towards the shoulder (albeit with a too-steep angle.)

 

[brokeasajoke]

I wonder what you're seeing? The cutter seems correctly oriented to me, with the angled edge towards the shoulder (albeit with a too-steep angle.)

I dont see how you could turn it any other way and have cutter angle facing shoulder. I understand I will probably gain nothing and probably shouldn't touch the lapua brass, reloading and all it entails is very enjoyable.

 

[brokeasajoke]

I'm not having much luck finding replacement cutters with different angles. The ones I have found dont even list the angle. Couldn't find anything on K&Ms website either. They just list steel, carbide and large caliber with no specifications.

 

[Brians356]

PMA makes good stuff. You can get a cutter for the exact shoulder angle, which allows you to cut into the shoulder without fear.

Unfortunately, the way those cutters are oriented in the photo, they all look identical, since the actual shoulder cutters are hidden in the shadows - or somewhere?

 

[lightman]

The picture that Scott Harris posted is what I consider to be a correctly turned neck. To get this you will need the angle on your cutter to match the shoulder angle. I agree, you probably will not see any improvement in your groups with a factory rifle. Still no reason not to try it for yourself though. I would only remove a couple of thousands or maybe clean up 60-70% of the neck. Most companies that make neck tools offer cutters with different angles. I'm sure K&M does. When I'm turning necks I put a small (very small) drop of oil at the case mouth. I advance the cutter very slowly, in and out. I also touch a piece of 4/0 steel wool to the finished cut.