300 weatherby and Berger 210 vld load info

[Codeman]

I'm looking for load sugestions for 300 weatherby and berger 210 vld hunting bullets for an Elk hunt.

Thanks

 

[JRS]

NORMA MRP
And of course the 200 grain NF bullet 8)

 

[Codeman]

Factory Mark V, weatherby brass, Fed 215M
Powder I have on hand- H1000- IMR 7828, RL 25, H50bmg, H4831, H4350

 

[4xforfun]

I have been shooting the 300 wby for both hunting and 1000 BR. Been using the 210 VLD since forever. I can't offer concrete load info....my match bbls have been between 73 and 83 gr RL 25......my Hunting gun..Rem 700 with a Clay Spencer BBl..is right in at 80 gr. Was at 82, but it was tough on brass. I have one BBL for my match gun that didn't make the cut for 1K ended up shooting AWSOME with a HATFULL of Retumbo and 210's. I am embarrassed to give out the load and chrono data...it is off the charts fast!!!! I use it as a LR deer HAMMER!!

Now, NONE of my BBLs have anything resembling the WBY freebore. I am jammed up against the lands. MY OAL is 3.95"...ie....LONG!!

Just do a little load development with good brass (norma) and find what works best.

RL 25 or Retumbo
Berger 210's
Fed 215 primers
Prepped Norma brass.

As far as MRP...can you even get that any more?

Good luck and have fun!!

Tod

 

[1holeaddict]

I have a 300 weatherby built on a German Mark V action by Bobby Hart . It was short throated and he suggested RL22 and 180 SST. I shot under an inch with the very first load i tried and havent proceeded with any development yet. I have been wanting to try some vlds but dont think they would work with the short throat.

 

[Codeman]

I'm not having any problems with tons of freebore, I can easily touch the lands and fit in the magwell. 3.700 oal

 

[4xforfun]

I have a 300 weatherby built on a German Mark V action by Bobby Hart . It was short throated and he suggested RL22 and 180 SST. I shot under an inch with the very first load i tried and havent proceeded with any development yet. I have been wanting to try some vlds but dont think they would work with the short throat.

The Beger VLD's actually work BETTER in short throated chambers. Remember..the VLD likes to live IN the lands...you can't get there with the LOOOONG WBY freebore. My hunting 300, before I set the chamber back after 1100 rounds...had a lot shorter throat. I could fit the 210's in the mag and still be into the lands. It shot lights out. Just for fun I shot it in an IBS 1000 yard LG shootoff...circa 2008...short throat and all. Won the shootoff with a 5 inch group. It was a little funny becuse it was 80+ degrees and I am putting on a hoodie and a THICK Ski-Doo jacket...just to tame the recoil. Got lots of WTF looks.

 

[1holeaddict]

I have a 300 weatherby built on a German Mark V action by Bobby Hart . It was short throated and he suggested RL22 and 180 SST. I shot under an inch with the very first load i tried and havent proceeded with any development yet. I have been wanting to try some vlds but dont think they would work with the short throat.

The Beger VLD's actually work BETTER in short throated chambers. Remember..the VLD likes to live IN the lands...you can't get there with the LOOOONG WBY freebore. My hunting 300, before I set the chamber back after 1100 rounds...had a lot shorter throat. I could fit the 210's in the mag and still be into the lands. It shot lights out. Just for fun I shot it in an IBS 1000 yard LG shootoff...circa 2008...short throat and all. Won the shootoff with a 5 inch group. It was a little funny becuse it was 80+ degrees and I am putting on a hoodie and a THICK Ski-Doo jacket...just to tame the recoil. Got lots of WTF looks.

Have you ever tried the RL22 powder in them??

 

[4xforfun]

I have a 300 weatherby built on a German Mark V action by Bobby Hart . It was short throated and he suggested RL22 and 180 SST. I shot under an inch with the very first load i tried and havent proceeded with any development yet. I have been wanting to try some vlds but dont think they would work with the short throat.

The Beger VLD's actually work BETTER in short throated chambers. Remember..the VLD likes to live IN the lands...you can't get there with the LOOOONG WBY freebore. My hunting 300, before I set the chamber back after 1100 rounds...had a lot shorter throat. I could fit the 210's in the mag and still be into the lands. It shot lights out. Just for fun I shot it in an IBS 1000 yard LG shootoff...circa 2008...short throat and all. Won the shootoff with a 5 inch group. It was a little funny becuse it was 80+ degrees and I am putting on a hoodie and a THICK Ski-Doo jacket...just to tame the recoil. Got lots of WTF looks.

Have you ever tried the RL22 powder in them??

I started with RL22 and 180 class bullets back in the mid 90's. Then switched to the Sierra 220 and RL22. Then about the time they came out with RL 25 I switched to the 210 Berger. Now I am tinkering with the 215 and 230 Bergers and RL25/Retumbo. I use RL22 in the 300 WIN mag almost exclusively.

 

[HeavenlyPlaces]

I have a 300 WBY Mark V and am shooting Berger 230 OTM using 83.5 Grains of H-1000 at 2920 FPS with an OAL of 3.699. I have also worked with Retumbo and the 210 VLD and 230 VLD. I am having trouble getting my accuracy consistently under MOA. I have worked the rounds up with loads and OAL all over the map trying to tighten the groups and have pretty much resigned to rebarreling with a Krieger #4 or #5

 

[MJU]

I am also starting to load Berger 210 VLDs in my Cooper 300 WBY. Anyone have experience with maximum load guidlines using Retumbo?

 

[warrbuk]

RL25 worked better for me than retumbo at 3005 FPS out of a 26" barrel.

 

[Zero333]

I have a 300 weatherby built on a German Mark V action by Bobby Hart . It was short throated and he suggested RL22 and 180 SST. I shot under an inch with the very first load i tried and havent proceeded with any development yet. I have been wanting to try some vlds but dont think they would work with the short throat.

I have a few barrels with shorter throats and the VLD's work perfectly in them. Their secant ogive and short bearing surface allows me to seat them farther out before they hit the lands, compared to same weight non-vld tangent ogive bullets.

 

[wboggs]

I had a German WBY with a 26" factory chamber. Used Norma MRP and the old 205. Got 3200+ with 180's and 3000+ with 200's. Accuracy was very good. Around 1 3/4" grps (3shot) at 300 yds. Used Hornady and Speer bullets seated 3.59" which were not anywhere near the rifling.

 

[barefooter56]

I'm looking for load sugestions for 300 weatherby and berger 210 vld hunting bullets for an Elk hunt.

Thanks

Codeman,
Please contact us at techsupport@bergerbullets.com and we can get you helped out with load information . Also please read the Eric's article below on bullet seating depth testing.

Getting The Best Precision And Accuracy From VLD Bullets In Your Rifle
Posted April 8, 2009

Background

VLD bullets are designed with a secant ogive. This ogive shape allows bullets to be more efficient in flight (retain more velocity = less drop and wind deflection). While this result is desirable for many rifle shooters the secant ogive on the VLD bullets produces another result in many rifle. It can be difficult to get the VLD to group well (poor accuracy).

For years we encouraged shooters to use a base of cartridge to end of bearing surface OAL (I will use the term COAL to represent this dimension) which allows the VLD to touch the rifling or to be jammed in the rifling. This provided excellent results for many shooters but there were others who did not achieve top performance with the VLD jammed in their rifling. These shooters were left with the belief that the VLD bullets just won’t shoot in their rifle.

Other groups of shooters were discouraged by our recommendation to touch the rifling. Some of these shooters knew that at some point during a target competition they will be asked to remove a live round. With the bullet jammed in the rifling there was a good chance the bullet will stick in the barrel which could result in an action full of powder. This is hard on a shooter during a match.

Yet another group of shooters who were discouraged by our recommendation to touch the rifling are those who feed through magazines or have long throats. Magazine length rounds loaded with VLDs could not touch the lands in most rifles (this is the specific reason that for years we said VLD bullets do not work well in a magazine). When a rifle could be single fed but was chambered with a long throat a loaded round that was as long as possible still would not touch the rifling.

Until recently, shooters who suffered from these realities were believed to be unable to achieve success with VLD bullets. Admittedly, we would receive the occasional report that a rifle shot very well when jumping the VLD bullets but we discounted these reports as anomalies. It was not until the VLD became very popular as a game hunting bullet that we were then able to learn the truth about getting the VLD bullets to shoot well in a large majority of rifles.

After we proved that the Berger VLD bullets are consistently and exceptionally capable of putting game down quickly we started promoting the VLD to hunters. We were nervous at first as we believe the VLD needed to be in the rifling to shoot well and we also knew that most hunters use a magazine and SAMMI chambers. Our ears were wide open as the feedback was received. It was surprising to hear that most shooters described precision results by saying “this is the best my rifle has ever shot.”

We scratched our heads about this for awhile until we started getting feedback from hunters who were competition shooters as well. Many were the same guys who were telling us for years that the VLDs shoot great when jumped. Since a much larger number of shooters were using the VLD bullets with a jump we started comparing all the feedback and have discovered the common characteristics in successful reports which gave us the information needed to get VLD working in your rifle. We were able to relay these characteristics to several shooters who were struggling with VLD bullets. Each shooter reported success after applying our recommendation.

Solution

The following has been verified by numerous shooters in many rifles using bullets of different calibers and weights. It is consistent for all VLD bullets. What has been discovered is that VLD bullets shoot best when loaded to a COAL that puts the bullet in a “sweet spot”. This sweet spot is a band .030 to .040 wide and is located anywhere between jamming the bullets into the lands and .150 jump off the lands.

Note: When discussing jam and jump I am referring to the distance from the area of the bearing surface that engages the rifling and the rifling itself. There are many products that allow you to measure these critical dimensions. Some are better than others. I won’t be going into the methods of measuring jam and jump. If you are not familiar with this aspect of reloading it is critically important that you understand this concept before you attempt this test.

Many reloaders feel (and I tend to agree) that meaningful COAL adjustments are .002 to .005. Every once in a while I might adjust the COAL by .010 but this seems like I am moving the bullet the length of a football field. The only way a shooter will be able to benefit from this situation is to let go of this opinion that more than .010 change is too much (me included).

Trying to find the COAL that puts you in the sweet spot by moving .002 to .010 will take so long the barrel may be worn out by the time you sort it out if you don’t give up first. Since the sweet spot is .030 to .040 wide we recommend that you conduct the following test to find your rifles VLD sweet spot.

Load 24 rounds at the following COAL if you are a target competition shooter who does not worry about jamming a bullet:
1. .010 into (touching) the lands (jam) 6 rounds
2. .040 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
3. .080 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
4. .120 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds

Load 24 rounds at the following COAL if you are a hunter (pulling a bullet out of the case with your rifling while in the field can be a hunt ending event which must be avoided) or a competition shooter who worries about pulling a bullet during a match:
1. .010 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
2. .050 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
3. .090 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
4. .130 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds

Shoot 2 (separate) 3 shot groups in fair conditions to see how they group. The remarkable reality of this test is that one of these 4 COALs will outperform the other three by a considerable margin. Once you know which one of these 4 COAL shoots best then you can tweak the COAL +/- .002 or .005. Taking the time to set this test up will pay off when you find that your rifle is capable of shooting the VLD bullets very well (even at 100 yards).

Regards,
Eric Stecker
Master Bulletsmith

 

[JRS]

I have been shooting the 300 wby for both hunting and 1000 BR. Been using the 210 VLD since forever. I can't offer concrete load info....my match bbls have been between 73 and 83 gr RL 25......my Hunting gun..Rem 700 with a Clay Spencer BBl..is right in at 80 gr. Was at 82, but it was tough on brass. I have one BBL for my match gun that didn't make the cut for 1K ended up shooting AWSOME with a HATFULL of Retumbo and 210's. I am embarrassed to give out the load and chrono data...it is off the charts fast!!!! I use it as a LR deer HAMMER!!

Now, NONE of my BBLs have anything resembling the WBY freebore. I am jammed up against the lands. MY OAL is 3.95"...ie....LONG!!

Just do a little load development with good brass (norma) and find what works best.

RL 25 or Retumbo
Berger 210's
Fed 215 primers
Prepped Norma brass.

As far as MRP...can you even get that any more?

Good luck and have fun!!

Tod

Powder Valley usually has MRP in stock.

 

[barefooter56]

I am also starting to load Berger 210 VLDs in my Cooper 300 WBY. Anyone have experience with maximum load guidlines using Retumbo?

MJU,
We show the RETUMBO load information based on a COAL of 3.560 of:
START - 77.5 gr . MAX - 81.5 gr
Approximate velocities - 2789 to 2917 FPS
Approximate fill ratio is 102%
Please see my reply to Codeman in my previous post in regards to bullet seating depth testing. Any seating depth testing should be done at the lowest powder charge listed for the bullet/powder/cartridge combination you are testing for. Once the seating depth
accuracy node is found. Work your load back up slowly checking for pressure signs and accuracy until you find your highest velocity accuracy node. If you have any questions please feel free to contact us on this site or at techsupport@bergerbullets.com
Thanks for using our bullets guys!
Take care,