Pistol Brass...?

[Rsadams]

How many times are you guys reloading you pistol brass..? I have heard all my life just keep going till it splits or won't hold a primer anymore.... But it seems like after a bunch of times they get hard and you start having strange results like rifle brass.... Anyone else run into these strange flyers after a bunch say 10 reloads or am I just imagining it..?

Thanks in advance...
Shawn

 

[Jdne5b]

I dont count the # reloads. Typically it splits or I lose it. Ive never worn out a primer pocket on a pistol round, but my loads are minor PF.

If Im shooting a big match that matters, I use new or once fired.

 

[CarlGeorge]

For context - I don't do "precision" pistol stuff. I mostly plink at steel.

I don't track reload counts on my brass. My pistol brass I consider a total commodity. If there is a split mouth it goes in the trash. If a primer is especially loose when a case is being primed I take a Sharpie and draw a line around the body of the case. I then either leave it on the ground or toss it when I deprime.

Given how I shoot pistol I haven't noticed (nor would I think I would notice) cases at the end of their life being less accurate. This is making me realize that would be an interesting exercise: Load up a mag of rounds that have loose primer pockets and see how they do.

 

[Jdne5b]

They'll get to where they etch a breechface, just like a rifle primer.

 

[Uncle Ed]

The more the pistol case is fired and reloaded the harder the brass gets and springs back after sizing.

Lee makes undersized carbide dies that size the case .002 to .003 smaller in diameter to compensate for brass spring back.

My practice ammunition is not loaded "hot" and the cases die of split mouths and I do not count how many times the case was loaded.

If my rifle or pistol primers feel like they seated too easily I use a Lee depriming tool to check the primer. If the primer moves with just finger pressure the case goes in the scrap brass bucket. And I do not have any firearms with etched bolt faces.

NOTE, my finger in the photo above is 69 years old and has never set off a primer with this method of checking primers.

 

[Rsadams]

I also don't load hot for my target rounds... I just seem to get 2-3 strange flyers everytime... Maybe it's just me losing concentration.... It's easy to do in this heat in central Texas , thank goodness it's almost over for a small amount of time...

I don't have any etching on my breech face etc and have put at least 5000 rounds through it , almost all reloads and all exactly the same... Going from single stage RCBS to last December a Dillon 550c and the quality seems to be the same I had the flyers before the Dillon etc...

Load is for 9mm out of a G19...
124gr Berry's RN
4.2gr of Win231
Coal of 1.150 or close...
S&B , Winchester , CCI or even federal primers...

Over a crono the numbers are good and flying right under 1000 fps....

These are nothing but paper punchers at between 15-25 yards out of my carry gun... Other than the strange flyers Maybe 4-6 out of 60 rounds I have never had a problem... I will normally cut the bullseye out of the target so they aren't horrible... Like I said maybe it's just me losing concentration or going to dang fast....

 

[cem]

For .45 ACP with an H&G #130 and 3.5 grains Bullseye I load until the case splits or is lost.

For maximum loads of H110/296 in a magnum pistol I limit it to once or twice maybe three times in times of shortage - then either anneal carefully or replace for full power loads with new and use the previously fired brass for reduced power gallery loads.

Part of the rationale is a taper crimp gallery load stays pretty consistent for a long time. The very heavily roll crimped, wasp waisted high bullet pull loads show a lot more variation a lot sooner.

Then again I shoot a lot more plinking loads than I do full power magnum revolver loads so the cost of using fresh brass in a full power roll crimped load doesn't hurt me as much as it would for gallery pistol.

 

[rr2030]

About 10 years ago I stopped loadin the .45acp cases that I had been using for Bullseye pistol since Highschool, 1970. Could not fathom how many times they have been loaded with 3.5 of Bullseye. Now I load them heavier for IDPA and have another 1500 new cases stamped WCC 80 I use for bullseye.

 

[1911nut]

I’ve loaded mixed brass 38spl 148g wadcutters over 2.8g of bullseye more than 50 times just tossing the occasional split ones.

Remington brass 45 acp 200g swc’s for bullseye matches, about 20 times and I toss them when a couple split.

45 hardball loads less than 20 times when some split.

Hot 9mm Remington brass around 15 times, start splitting. Lite 9 mm loads more than 20 times.

I’ve loaded way over 500k of handgun cases and have found Remington brass lasted longer than Winchester, Starline was good for a lot loadings , don’t have as much experience with Starline.

I taper crimp everything except 357 mag loads

 

[ToddKS]

Based on the information provided there are other things I would look at before the number of times your brass has been fired.

You are shooting plated bullets out of a Glock. If your G19 is Gen 4 or older then this is likely the source of your issues, especially at 25 yards. The polygonal rifling in the Gen 4 and older Glock barrels does not work well with plated bullets. Beyond the barrel compatibility issue, those are just not the best bullets for accuracy. You really need a jacketed bullet to get accuracy out of a Glock. I would recommend either something from Precision Delta or the Hornady HAP bullets.

Are you sorting your brass down to matching headstamp? If you are shooting mixed brass you may get mixed results. At the very least I would cull the foreign headstamps.

Win 231 is not the ideal powder for 9mm accuracy. I use N320 in my match ammo. I costs more but does make a difference. I use Tightgroup in my practice/carbine ammo.

I am a master class GSSF shooter and have spent a good deal of time figuring out how to get good, consistent accuracy out of a stock Glock pistol, especially in 9mm.

 

[pirate ammo]

I would recommend either something from Precision Delta or the Hornady HAP bullets.

Whats your opinion of Zero Bullets, we're testing Precision and Zero against each other with N320, Power Pistol, and Auto Comp.

 

[Jdne5b]

Zero and Hornady are the most common bullets you'll see at accuracy (PPC, Bianch, Bullseye) competitions. Sierra and Nosler also, but they are more costly.

25 yards and in, Montana gold, and precision delta are great if your gun likes them. 50 yards is where you'll likely see big differences.

Edited to add... this is mainly relevent for guns that shoot 2inches or better at 50 yards. If your gun wont do that, you may not be able to see a difference in accuracy between some of these brands.

 

[Hoser]

For precision pistol, ditch the plated bullets.

 

[pirate ammo]

Zero and Hornady are the most common bullets you'll see at accuracy (PPC, Bianch, Bullseye) competitions. Sierra and Nosler also, but they are more costly.

25 yards and in, Montana gold, and precision delta are great if your gun likes them. 50 yards is where you'll likely see big differences.

Edited to add... this is mainly relevent for guns that shoot 2inches or better at 50 yards. If your gun wont do that, you may not be able to see a difference in accuracy between some of these brands.

That's what we're loading for, PPC, 38 spc. wadcutters we got under control, now it's the 9MM we're working on.

 

[Rsadams]

Based on the information provided there are other things I would look at before the number of times your brass has been fired.

You are shooting plated bullets out of a Glock. If your G19 is Gen 4 or older then this is likely the source of your issues, especially at 25 yards. The polygonal rifling in the Gen 4 and older Glock barrels does not work well with plated bullets. Beyond the barrel compatibility issue, those are just not the best bullets for accuracy. You really need a jacketed bullet to get accuracy out of a Glock. I would recommend either something from Precision Delta or the Hornady HAP bullets.

Are you sorting your brass down to matching headstamp? If you are shooting mixed brass you may get mixed results. At the very least I would cull the foreign headstamps.

Win 231 is not the ideal powder for 9mm accuracy. I use N320 in my match ammo. I costs more but does make a difference. I use Tightgroup in my practice/carbine ammo.

I am a master class GSSF shooter and have spent a good deal of time figuring out how to get good, consistent accuracy out of a stock Glock pistol, especially in 9mm.

Everything is matched brass wise even all very close to the exact length.... I do absolutely agree about the bullets , I have actually had to send back a thousand pack because the weights were so far off they were getting to what I would consider dangerous in a hot load.... I like GEN.3 Glocks so that could very well be my problem... I have some tight group and will give the HAPS a try.. I just started shooting this combo years ago when I first started reloading and never switched... Funny you say this because a few hours ago I went to the range and shot at 10 yards which is almost point blank to me to see if it was just me and cut the center out of the target with no problem... But at even 15 yards I have always gotten strange flyers I have never been able to explain...

EDIT... This isn't for a precision pistol it's for my duty gun basically for nothing but practice.... I do shoot alot and am a better shooter than most I see on my range , but that's not saying alot...LOL

 

[riflewoman]

Whats your opinion of Zero Bullets, we're testing Precision and Zero against each other with N320, Power Pistol, and Auto Comp.

Zero, Magnus, and Precision Delta are all high end in accuracy and quality.

My go to 50 Yard load is 185 Magnus JHP with 4.2 Bullseye in my 45.

 

[ToddKS]

Everything is matched brass wise even all very close to the exact length.... I do absolutely agree about the bullets , I have actually had to send back a thousand pack because the weights were so far off they were getting to what I would consider dangerous in a hot load.... I like GEN.3 Glocks so that could very well be my problem... I have some tight group and will give the HAPS a try.. I just started shooting this combo years ago when I first started reloading and never switched... Funny you say this because a few hours ago I went to the range and shot at 10 yards which is almost point blank to me to see if it was just me and cut the center out of the target with no problem... But at even 15 yards I have always gotten strange flyers I have never been able to explain...

EDIT... This isn't for a precision pistol it's for my duty gun basically for nothing but practice.... I do shoot alot and am a better shooter than most I see on my range , but that's not saying alot...LOL

My plated bullet experience was very similar except the Extreme plated bullets I was using would normally group reasonably well out to 15. Beyond 15 yards things changed. I did enough side by side testing to convince myself that it was the bullet. Coated bullets do much better than plated out of the older Glock barrels if you are looking for a lower cost alternative. I like SNS Casting myself but have also had good luck with Bayou coated bullets.

 

[pirate ammo]

Zero, Magnus, and Precision Delta are all high end in accuracy and quality.

My go to 50 Yard load is 185 Magnus JHP with 4.2 Bullseye in my 45.

Another powder to look at, Durn woman your killing me. My friend just bought a Ransom rest with the windage tray so we should be able to test better, just need to get the speed right.

 

[riflewoman]

Good luck with your Random Rest....

And I’m not being facetious...

They are quirky to use right...

 

[Rsadams]

My plated bullet experience was very similar except the Extreme plated bullets I was using would normally group reasonably well out to 15. Beyond 15 yards things changed. I did enough side by side testing to convince myself that it was the bullet. Coated bullets do much better than plated out of the older Glock barrels if you are looking for a lower cost alternative. I like SNS Casting myself but have also had good luck with Bayou coated bullets.

Ok thanks , I have a friend using coated blue bullets may give them a try.... I will go out and pick up some HAP bullets I can get them local normally.... I have never tried them but I have another friend that uses them... I dang sure don't mind trying , for years I have only loaded the Berry's but for years I have had crazy flyers...Even when making sure everything is good one gets outside , sometimes way outside.... I normally stay at 15 yards , that's the furthest my CHL test shoots from but I do like 25 also.. So all my experience is at these distances , I very very rarely shoot any closer...

I own several Glocks , some still new in box but the one I carry has an obnoxious trigger but I carry that one because there's no way your going to accidentally pull the trigger...lol.. It's in no way an accuracy pistol but it's a decent combat shooter , nice sights etc....

Thanks for you help , I will give it a try....