Discussion in 'Main Message Board' started by Bart B., Dec 21, 2018.
Would mechanical engineering moment of inertia calculations suffice?
Fluting cost more ? Makes your Rig look Cool ? Won't help Win a match ..
If the Person doing the Fluting is half asleep your Barrel is Bent
If looks are your thing ?? Go for a nice stock ! it will out last a Fluted Barrel
Someone else already commented
Barrels of the same weight fluted are stiffer
Barrels of the same dia non fluted are stiffer
Barterlin offers fluting services on their barrels...Shilen voids the warranty difference is cut rifled vs buttoned.
I have one barrel that is fluted to make weight. It is no less accurate then my non fluted barrels.
If cost wasn't an issue i spec all my barrels to include flutes for the same weight.
I scribe to the theory that fluted barrels of the same weight on avg show better vertical then non fluted.
I don't scribe to the idea that fluting results in more hummer barrels
I compete in Long range F class
All the best
What he said.
Most button rifle folks don't like fluting as they think it induces stress. Probably true, but Skip Otto set a 200yd record in Phoenix several years ago with a fluted Shilen. The 200 yd was .099 and I was able to witness it.
Now a 36" fluted barrel at 6lbs would be stiffer than a 24" unfluted barrel of the same weight? I don't think so. If you A lot of variables to consider.
The sibling of this issue is, will a 243 Win barrel rebored to 308 Win be equally stiff?
Long, not toooooo long story. Thirty years ago I was friends with Carl Hildebrandt who ran the the R&D at Savage. H&R had filed bankruptcy and was selling off their machinery; and Carl got Ron Coburn (CEO) to go to the sale with him. As Carl tells me, this odd-looking piece of machinery came up. Carl tells Ron. "Buy me that!". He would not tell him why or what it was for, but got the tooling bought. About two (?) weeks later, he calls him down to the shop. Carl has a barreled action set up in a jig he had fashioned. As Ron watches, Carl indicates the machine on the barrel, and starts it up. It proceeds to slowly mill six equally spaced cutters down the barrel, and back up. Half the depth down, and the other half on the way back to the receiver end.
The tooling was used by H&R to simultaneously cut six flutes at 60-degree intervals on their revolvers. Carl figured out that cutting all six at once, using hydraulic pressure to equal the stresses would not "bend" the barrel, as cutting them one at a time might. Carl had tested the process on a couple dozen barreled actions beforehand. He would have the employees fitting barrels to actions, send him several each day. He clamped the barreled action in a sort-of Railgun, and tested them for accuracy. He would then flute each one, and retest. He told me that about 85% of the barrels fluted shot more consistently (accuracy), the rest accuracy level did not degrade. His conclusion was that their system did not hurt, but usually increased both absolutely accuracy, and made the groups more rounded, with fewer fliers. It seems logical...
So, that is what I know, VS what I think.
As far as Shilen voiding the warranty if you flute, one spring afternoon I was sitting under the awning of Ed's motorhome, someone asked Ed about fluting. Ed replied that the warranty was voided if you did so. Tony Boyer then told the assembled multitudes that Ed shipped him six LV and six HV barrels each year. He had his gunsmith flute them, with the barrel fit, chambered, and headspaced to the action. Ed just sort-of sat there...
I think yes and maybe even stiffer but I’ve been wrong before.
Even though there's less metal to resist bending?
Yes, because there is more surface area which is where most of the resistance to bending comes from.
Hart’s offers it for both hunting and BR barrels.
Then reboring a 243 Win barrel to 358 Win or 375 Win wildcat would make it even more stiff as the surface area has increased?
Surface area for cooling....yes...true.
If what you say is true, then boring it out to 600NE will make it stiffer yet.
Again...what did I miss?
"I" beams are stronger and stiffer than a piece of solid steel of the same dimensions, same with other types of structural steel. A fluted barrel of the same diameter is stiffer than a solid one of the same diameter.
Take a piece of 1" steel rod, ten feet long, lay it on two horses, one positioned at each end, check the sag. Do the same with a piece of 1" steel rod that is fluted, measure the sag. The solid will sag more. Which one is more stiff?
Still not convinced? How many suspension or other bridges are built with SOLID steel?
Hence my initial disclaimer, I answered based purely off of about 2 minutes of thought on the subject with no previous experience on the subject other than seeing a bunch of different sized pipe handled with various ODs and IDs. I would speculate that there would be a point of diminishing returns as the wall thickness decreased.
A quick google search landed me on a physics discussion board with a similar discussion.
My apologies if this is off track from your question.
Edit: After some more reading I’m going to revise my original answer to your question. In your example the drilled out barrel would be weaker due to losing mass when drilled. I think that in two barrels with the same mass, the one with the larger hole will be stiffer.
Not a problem at all. Yes, diminishing returns happens.
Turn this question over to our government. They can spend yrs and millions of $$$$ investigating, but we may never get an answer. Just a thought. LDS
I have to ask a question, is more important to look cool, and cool faster? or to be more accurate???
Merry Christmas to all......
If you are a TACTICAL guy, it's the first one.
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