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Wolf SRM Primer Missfire

ridgeway

Silver $$ Contributor
I have 5k of the new Wolf SRM primers with the gold cups. I used almost 100 primers and I had a missfire! I never had an issue with CCI, Fed or Remington since I've been reloading in '90. I even have primers from the early '80's that I use for fire forming that work!

Anyone else have missfires with Wolf? I hope this is not a trend for 5k worth of primers!
 
Yes I and others have had misfires with Wolf primers. I think the real problem with a misfire with a Wolf primer is not the primer itself. I think it is improper seating of the primer in the case. These primers have a hard cup and if you will look at them really good you will see that the anvil sticks up a little higher out of the cup than most primers. When you seat the Wolf primers it is best to use something like the Lee hand primer so you can feel the primer when the anvil bottoms in the primer pocket and then you need to put a little more pressure on the leaver so you can feel the primer cup bottom in the primer pocket and that will push the anvil against the priming compound and the cup to stress the compound so it will go bang when the firing pin strikes it.
My misfires were with the Large Rifle primers and upon breaking the rounds down and removing the primer I hit them with a hammer and both went BANG. I have had no more problems with Wolf primers since I really started paying attention to their seating properly. This is just my 2 cents worth of experience with Wolf primers.
 
Never ever had a problem with them if they are seated properly, and I use a lot of them in both large and small, in a variety of rifles........
 
There was not a problem with seating...I use a K&M priming tool. The cup definitely bottomed out. I'm on my 8th firing on a Dasher case...the primer pockets aren't as tight as they used to be and its easy to feel.

I even re-cocked with the dud in the chamber and re-fired. Nothing. Did that like 3 times. Once I removed the round...the cup was a little distorted from being hit numerous times with the pin.
 
I haven't had a problem with any of the Small Rifle Magnum Primers, but that's not to say that one can't sneak up on Me some day. What lot are yours...
 
They are from Powder Valley when they got the huge shipment in a few weeks ago. They have gold cups. I'll check the lot # when I get home.
 
I bought 5k of the Wolf Small rifle Magnum primers with the gold cups to try in my 6 BRX . They seemed to shoot okay and I was getting pretty good accuracy and ES numbers but every once in a while I can hear the primer 'crack' before the actual charge ignites . It's almost like a hang fire but much quicker. I haven't noticed that round making my group go any bigger but it kind of un-nerving to hear that primer go off and then the rifle goes bang. Until I get this sorted out I'm sticking with CCI-450's for match loads. I use a Sinclair primer seating tool and my load was 33 grs Varget under a Berger 105 VLD. FWIW

Rodney
 
I have noticed on my wolf primers they seat deeper then other brands, I would check to see if firing pin has enough length to set them off! Just an idea something to check.
 
Ridgeway, have you installed a light firing pin in the rifle? Has the spring been checked lately?

Either condition,light pin, worn spring) can lead to misfires. This is assuming that the primers are properly seated since you indicated that you are confident of that.
 
German...the action is a new Panda with about 375 rounds on it. No modifications have been made to the bolt spring or pin. I re-cocked like 3-4 times and nothing happened other than smash and distort the primer. Is the spring in a Panda bolt on the light side?

Primer seating...I can definetly feel them bottom.

This is just one incident...not going to worry unless it happens again. Maybe its a fluke?
 
I don't know if the Panda firing pin and spring are lighter than 'standard' which I define as a Remington 700. I'll see what I can dig up, Otteson's book The Bolt Action Rifle might have those specs. I'll check.
 
Let's take a look at some specs...

Otteson, The Bolt Action Rifle, Vol. 1, pg. 138,
Rem. 700,short action, post 1968):

Lock Time: 2.6 ms
Firing pin fall,to impact): 0.213 in.
Impact velocity: 15.2 ft./sec.
Impact energy: 87.2 in.-oz.
Impulse: .96 oz. sec.

Unfortunately, Otteson didn't specify the weight of the firing pin on the 700. Impact energy and impulse, by the way are important to proper ignition, but often overlooked in the overemphasized quest for fast lock time. All modern rifles have darn good lock times and improvements are nearly meaningless - except as they reduce energy and impulse and thus reduce ignition reliability.

As we move on to the Panda, we run into a brick wall, because Otteson covered that action in his later book Benchrest Actions & Triggers, and the level of detail provided on the basic action functions is greatly reduced.

Lock Time: 2.7 ms
Firing pin fall,to impact): 0.24 in.

Beyond those scant figures, we are told: 'The firing pin assembly follows a Remington pattern except for a smaller diameter striker tip, which allows better primer support.' Indeed, the closeness of the figures indicates a great similarity in the underlying mechanism. Let's bear in mind however, that while the Remington probably hasn't changed in the 30+ years since the review, the Panda may have evolved a bit, so let's not assume these specifications necessarily remain valid for current production Pandas.

I don't have a Remington firing pin to weigh, other than the one in my 40X. If you want to take your Panda apart and weigh the firing pin with the cocking piece and separately weigh the spring,1/2 the weight of the spring should be considered in the weight of the striker) then I will do the same with the Remington.

For the benefit of others, I will say that primer seating is the primary area to examine in these situations and only after it has been determined that you are doing it correctly should your attention turn to the firing mechanism. The primer should bottom in the cup and then a slight additional forward movement, which gives a small degree of pre-compression to the pellet, should be felt. I have never been able to get this degree of 'feel' from a press mounted priming tool. I use the Sinclair tool, but the K&M tool is equally good; the RCBS hand tool will do, although its heavy spring reduces feel to a certain degree.

One last thing - you asked if it might be a fluke, a bad primer or two in the lot. Generally speaking, no. Modern primer manufacture in the US and abroad and especially in the Murom plant where the Wolf primers are made, is held to such a close standard that the possibility of a bad primer is infinitesimal, the odds of more than one are essentially zero. When misfires are experienced, the primer is generally the last place to look for the cause. I'm not suggesting it is impossible to have a bad primer, simply that the probability of that is exceedingly low.

That the primer would not fire with repeated hits is normal. Once a primer has been struck, the pellet is complressed to a degree. If the impact energy and impulse were insufficient to ignite, there is not enough compression distance remaining in the primer,between the cup and anvil) to ensure ignition on a subsequent strike. In some cases it might, but it shouldn't be counted on.
 
Just like eggman I too have experienced the primer 'crack' before the round fires. I thought maybe I was just imagining it, but now I'm sure that's what I was hearing. I also had a misfire in the first 30 primers I used. I used a Lee hand primer to seat them. These were Wolf SRM primers fired in a Barnard action chambered in 6BR. This is the first time I have used Wolf primers, so far I'm not real happy with them.

Mike
 
Jim, That's about right on the fall of the pin, the missing part of the equation is the weight of the firing pin.

Mike - Lapua 6BR brass and Russian primers are a challenging combination to seat well because the pockets are very tight and the primers are about a tenth or two bigger than US primers. Make awfully sure they are seated and have a touch of compression. Also, check to make sure the Allen screw on the bolt cap is on tight or the firing pin spring will lose tension and lead to problems - I've seen that a few times on Barnards.
 
I haventhad any experience with the small rifle wolf primers but have had more than a little bit with the LRMs. What i have found is that they are a few 1000s shorter than most other brands and so seat deeper by abt 3-5 thousanths, now a rifle with a serious firing pin such as a Remington 700, the little buggers fire every time, however some of the more gentile rifles such as Browning Abolts or Savage 10 types with little bitty firing pins and gentle firing pin springs do infact misfire with an astonishing degree of regularity. I havent done the math on either of these other rifles but they are of smaller diameter firing pnis and my impression is that the springs are a bit lighter. I suspect bench actions are of the same mold. Im too lazy to pull my Panda out of the safe and look but I remember that its fp is smaller in diameter. Most of the shooting Id done with these was in less than 40*. and a good smack fired every time. Id loaded abunch of ammo up for the Browning and quickly found it wasnt gonna work. Just hope that load shoots well in the 700. Hate to have to pull 40+ E-tips......
 
Have fired well over 5000 Wolf Small Rifle Magnums in my 2 Nesika K actions, and have never had a no-fire or miss-fire or sputter. Anybody who has such problems should consider having their gunsmith install and properly set up a new or stronger firing pin spring....about the only part of your action that will show any measurable wear during a season. Springs are amazingly cheap and should be changed every year. Mine shrink nearly 1/2' after a year of heavy shooting and surely loose some of their striking power.

Standard, uniformed primer pocket depth in my 6.5-47 and 6 BR Lapua cases is .004 deeper than the total length/height of the Wolf SRM's. I seat the primers with .004 clearance between primer and case head. This places the legs of the anvil in contact with the pocket with little stress.

The primers go into the primer pocket with the 3 tips of the anvil protruding and after firing they come out of the pocket with the tips protruding. I use a long-handled bench-top RCBS primer seater...which has an adjustable seating depth stop... and cannot envision any reason for using any of the significant amount of available leverage to crunch the anvil. Trying to do so will further flatten and even dimple the primer if enough force is applied....making an even longer jump for the firing pin.

Longranger
 

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