Winchester Model 70 Super Grade - French vs other walnut?

[mensajd]

Sorry, this is a duplicate post from the varmint sub-category, but I would like the collective wisdom of a larger group of cognoscenti. What's the difference between the walnuts? French vs US (or Claro) particularly in connection with color and figure. Also, do the FN(?) winchesters shoot well? Walking varminter rifle (due to the slow default twist) in .243.

 

[Dusty Stevens]

Claro walnut is the dark wood like most american guns and french walnut will have more stripes in it like turkish walnut i do believe. Why not get a remington and put a decent barrel on it in whatever twist you like

 

[Bill Score]

Hope somebody with both can lean in on this one, was considering getting a Super Grade a few years ago and had the same question.

 

[INTJ]

Sorry, this is a duplicate post from the varmint sub-category, but I would like the collective wisdom of a larger group of cognoscenti. What's the difference between the walnuts? French vs US (or Claro) particularly in connection with color and figure. Also, do the FN(?) winchesters shoot well? Walking varminter rifle (due to the slow default twist) in .243.

The action makes almost zero difference in a hunting rifle. It's the barrel that matters most, followed by bedding. So there is no need to put up with all the Remington reliability issues to get an accurate hunting rifle.

Rifle built on FN M-70 action, initial load development:



Rifle built on M-70 Classic (338 Edge)



Another M-70 Classic build:



I have seen very good accuracy from several factory FN rifles as well. Factory rifles are more of a crapshoot with the barrel. I have seen many reports of excellent accuracy from the Winchester Extreme Weather rifles.

 

[shortgrass]

The current Winchester 70 Super Grades are stocked in Claro Walnut. Juglans Regia (French, English, Persian, Cirrcassian are all Juglans Regia) is too expensive in the higher grades to be used on a factory produced rifle. Claro has the "wow' factor of brighter colors, more 'fiddle back " and in general more figure that the general public recognizes. Juglans Regia has dark mineral streaks that run length wise and only sometimes, fiddle back and what the unknowing public would call 'figure'.

 

[shortgrass]

You have Juglans Regia (as listed above), Jugans Nigra, which is the common American Black Walnut found from the Northwest, through the central states and into the East, North and South, and Juglans Hindsii, which is native to Northern Kalifornia and Southern Oregon. Both Juglans Hindsii and Juglans Regia have been planted world wide. The root stock of Juglans Hindsii is often used to graft Juglans Regia, which produces "Paradox Walnut" or Bastone Walnut. Juglans Regia, Juglans Hindsii and Paradox are commercial nut producers.

 

[Rednexx]

If you all don't like Walnut take a look at Myrtle wood or Screwbean Mesquite, they are very nice to look at, but don't make a rifle shoot any better.

 

[mensajd]

Thanks @shortgrass. The Winchester website is showing this French walnut stocked super grade m70. It's about $500 more that the standard super grade m70. Right now my LGS is too busy to even take orders + deposits over the phone, so I need to find a different LGS. Between pandemics, fires, power outages, looters, crimson skies, etc., life in CA is now starting to resemblie the end of days. Perhaps locusts, famine, pestilence, are next!

 

[JohnKielly]

As I recall, Californian (Claro) walnut trees are grown quickly for cropping, not wood. As a consequence, the growth rings are wider & with less figure, if any. Also, it can be softer, but then again, so are some European walnuts that have grown slowly.

 

[jdh47]

Claro can do some moving around as I found out with a Weatherby once. It's pretty though. My preference to work with is French. It'll be a little lighter than Black walnut, hold finer checkering and in some grades have good figure. In a factory thing I would prefer the French offering. The pic looks good.

 

[shortgrass]

As I recall, Californian (Claro) walnut trees are grown quickly for cropping, not wood. As a consequence, the growth rings are wider & with less figure, if any. Also, it can be softer, but then again, so are some European walnuts that have grown slowly.

I think 'softer' is a reasonably loose term to use here. I'm about to wear out a USA made #49 patternmakers file on a piece of Claro. Growth rate would depend on soil and climate conditions. Maybe later I'll post a pic of some of the Claro that has "less figure".

 

[mensajd]

Just tried to place an order with a different, local gun store that happens to be a Winchester dealer. There seems to be a run on all things guns and ammo related so they were somewhat hesitant to assist with a special order. I noted that there probably isn't a run on wood stocked, bolt action, $2k varmint rifles and that if they could get it, I'd buy it. Strange times for purchasing gun stuff to be sure...

 

[shortgrass]

Just tried to place an order with a different, local gun store that happens to be a Winchester dealer. There seems to be a run on all things guns and ammo related so they were somewhat hesitant to assist with a special order. I noted that there probably isn't a run on wood stocked, bolt action, $2k varmint rifles and that if they could get it, I'd buy it. Strange times for purchasing gun stuff to be sure...

They're all busy makin' money on the stuff that's most wanted right now.

 

[3Ackleys]

Just tried to place an order with a different, local gun store that happens to be a Winchester dealer. There seems to be a run on all things guns and ammo related so they were somewhat hesitant to assist with a special order. I noted that there probably isn't a run on wood stocked, bolt action, $2k varmint rifles and that if they could get it, I'd buy it. Strange times for purchasing gun stuff to be sure...

There are 8 of them on Gunbroker. most under $1700

 

[cjames]

I have a FN made Super Grade that's a 270 Win. Its a honest 3/4" 3 shot rifle with a 130 Nosler Balistic tip and IMR4831. I also hit the lottery on the wood. It's got an awesome piece of walnut on it. If I get in my safe and get it dug out I'll take a pic. But it stays at the back of the safe.

 

[msinc]

Looks like this thread might need some photos.......here is some black walnut these are English Here are some Model 70's with Claro and English
As far as the wood itself, black walnut is harder and stiffer so some might consider it more appropriate for a rifle. The color, if left natural will not change, so what you see is what you will still see years later. English is softer and has more spring or ability to move, making it an excellent choice for the thin wrist of a double or O/U shotgun. English checkers better and can {usually does} darken with time. Claro typically darkens the most of the three and older guns can appear "too dark" over time. Claro is very soft and typically fuzzes up when you try to checker it. You can get good checkering on a piece of Claro, but it is a pain to work with. Claro dents easy and in general doesn't wear too well on a working gun.
The above photos are fairly decent examples of the different woods. English, while arguably the best wood for a stock can be very light and bland. Look at a Kimber "Select" in a gunshop, not the ones in the catalogs and you will wonder why they bothered. Claro can amount to no more than a very soft piece of figureless black walnut and black walnut can be very plain and devoid of any character.

Edit: It's funny, "English" walnut does not come from England at all. It's just a name. Most of it comes from Europe and most gun makers used it around the turn of the {last} century. But, two world wars decimated the supply and that is why it is so expensive today.

 

[Dusty Stevens]

Very good info. Thanks alot for the pics too.