TrxR said:
This would be for a single shot bolt action being used in F/TR. So the Redding bushing neck die doesnt bump the sholder? Is there a disadvantage to the Forster F/L and neck die where they arent a bushing die? Would I be safe in just getting either the Forster F/L and Ultra seater alone then adding a neck sizer or bushing bump die down the road or would a Redding Competition Seater/Bushing f/l die be a better starting point the add the neck sizer?
Thanks
You're correct about the Redding neck-sizer. The Forster B-B is the only such die from the major die-makers that I know of. That type was a limited speciality producer only tool until Forster adopted the idea.
You can happily use a standard Forster F-L die set with or without the Ultra seater upgrade and its extra cost, and as you suggest upgrade to a bushing type at a later date when finances allow, assuming you still want to try fancier kit at that stage.
Forster stuff is very, very good indeed. The only downside - and this applies to any make of standard non-bushing sizer whether neck or full-length is the amount you work the case-neck brass. The makers of non-adjustable dies have to take into account variations in the thickness built into any of no end of makes and sources of case. I have a lot of old 1980s vintage Norma brass, the infamous 160gn batches, that has necks that run from twelve to thirteen thou' thickness while Lapua 308W averages fifteen thou' in most batches but can be a thou' either side depending on lot. I'm sure there are yet thicker military cases around. So standard dies over-size the neck downwards as you pull the press handle, then use an expander button or ball to take it back up to around the correct dimensions for a bullet to be seated and gripped firmly. I say 'around' as neck tension depends mostly on the expander button diameter, but also partly on brass thickness, metallic alloy composition and degree of annealing, number of times fired, work hardening etc, etc - a lot more to encompass than most handloaders think about.
The result of having to cope with almost everything is that you end up working the brass more than is needed and the die / expander often impart more neck tension on the bullet than is ideal. Move to a bushing die and you decide, not the die-maker, how much sizing you're going to do and how much neck tension you want in your ammunition. (I run with much less tension than I'd get with standard dies for my F/TR ammo, both 223 and 308, and this is fairly common in this game.)
An alternative low-cost solution that I see many people on this forum advocate is to use a Lee Collet die, a neck-sizer that is semi-adjustable and can be used to set tension fairly low, plus a Redding or similar body die. The collet type gives very good results as long as the rifle chamber is a good one - it won't 'true-up' cases whose necks are a little off concentricity in their fireformed state. The body die keeps the shoulder back as well as full-length sizing everything bar the neck. I used Lee collet dies for many, many years going back to when Lee first introduced them and they worked very well in I don't know how many different cartridges. I still use them sometimes to save time and effort (no lubing needed, just clean the case neck and shoulder), but they do quickly produce tightish chambering if used on their own just on the necks. Although Lee claims its 'dead-length' seater supplied with the Collet in two/three die set form gives great results, it's not as good as Redding or Forster in my experience, although I'll likely stand challenged by some users on that.
