where to begin

[nra-for-life]

hi everyone. 1st post here

id like to get some thoughts on where to start. im new to reloading and i will be loading up 22-250 for my first caliber for a specific bolt action rifle. my purpose for reloading is to try to shrink my group sizes and ultimatly create some specific loads for certain hunting and target applications that are as accurate as i can possibly get them.

there are so many variables to play with in reloading that im a little overwhelmed so id like to hear from you experts and see what you would do...

i have currently 2 powders... reloader 15 and varget.

i have 100 bullets to play with in 5 variations (500 total)... nosler 35 gr balistic tip LF, nosler 40 grain varmint balistic tip, sierra 50 grain blitzkings, sierra 53 grain HP mathkings, and hornady 52 grain ballistic tip a-max.

i have 148 casings. i have done all my prep work to the best of my ability. the casings were all fired from the same rifle, are the same make, they are all fireformed, necksized, uniformed, prepped and ready to load.


so i am curious as to how i should start in regards to variables. would it be better to experiment more with bullet seating depth, powder loads, or something else.

lets say for example if i load 20 rounds with the amax, would i be better off to try to keep the bullet seating depth the same on all and then just do different powders and powder charges, or would i be better to keep the powder consistant end experiment more with bullet seating depth? id like to load all 148 casings up and shoot this weekend, and i am tryying decide on what variable would be the bast to play with at first.

if i find that a certain bullet shoots the most accurate with a particular combination of powder type and charge, and bullet seating depth, is it reasonable to assume that the same bullet seating depth will likely be the most accurate with another powder type and charge? is it reasonable to assume that my gun will like the same seating depth (as measureed in distance from the rifling) in different bullet types and wieghts?

give me your thoughts please. how do you go about loading rounds for initial testing and what variables do you focus on and experiment with in trying to achieve the best accuracy?. thank you

hopefully this is the beginning of a new era for me and shooting, thanks everyone. this is an awesome forum you all have here.

 

[RJinTexas]

I've never seen a 22-250 with a decent barrel that wouldn't shot Hornady's listed long time pet load into sub .3's 5 shot groups.
38.0 gr - H380 pushing a 52 gr bullet.

RJ

 

[necchi]

Well, guy's do it both ways,
I prefer to do load development working the powder charge as the first variable, keeping the seating the same. Once I have an area where the charge is best, I'll start messing with the seating depths.
Now a gun will most likely find a small window of a preferred charge, Lets say as an example I get the tightest groups with 34.0-34.4 grns of powder,, I'll choose 34.2 and work the seating depth,, then when the best seating is found I'll go back and try
34.1-34.2-34.3-34.4 looking for the best groups.

When it comes to different bullets, different powders and seating depths, No, you'll need to work each bullet differently. The thing is, as you gain experience loading, you'll also be gaining experience with your gun, you'll begin to learn it's likes and dislikes,,
(in other words, Your rifle might be very happy with a certain seating depth of a particular bullet)

It may like bullets just at sammi OAL, it might like really close to the lands, or someplace in between. It's really hard to recommend to a new loader what part of the load development variables he can skip,, my opinion it's best to let'm learn their gun themselves and it really doesn't take that long.
`bout the time you get through your first pound of powder you'll be getting the hang of it.

Here's a great way to start load development, when I learned this method I saved time, powder and bullets,,
http://optimalchargeweight.embarqspace.com/

Oh, and Welcome to the Forum, you've found a really great place, Here's another link from the sites main page;
http://www.accurateshooter.com/cartridge-guides/22-250/

 

[artbosco]

id like to get some thoughts on where to start. I'm new to reloading and i will be loading up 22-250 for my first caliber for a specific bolt action rifle. my purpose for reloading is to try to shrink my group sizes and ultimately create some specific loads for certain hunting and target applications that are as accurate as i can possibly get them. there are so many variables to play with in reloading that I'm a little overwhelmed so i'd like to hear from you experts and see what you would do...

First, Read this Over and Over many times: http://www.accurateshooter.com/cartridge-guides/22-250/

There are a lot of variables to choose from for the 22-250, too many as a matter of fact.

When you reload/tune you start with a powder/brass/primer/bullet combination that gives you small groups, then fine tune with neck tension and seating depth.

No need to reinvent the wheel. Go back to the article on the 22-250. Look at the 22-250 REM LOAD MAP. To Keep Things Simple: Pick only ONE or TWO loads that will give you what you're looking for.

Once you've made your selection, use the data given, as the base, for starting your own load work up for YOUR Barrel's preference. Use the Powder type, Primer type, and Bullet type and weight from the LOAD MAP. Start with a charge 10% below what's given then work your way up slowly and safely. If you can afford it, I highly recommend LAPUA brass.

A lot of what you're looking for has already been done for you. Piggyback off the data presented in the 22-250 Remington Cartridge Guide and in particular, the Load Map.

Personally, I'd start with the data for H4895 because I'm more interested in Accuracy and there are two different bullet weights I could choose from or try both. Make YOUR choice based on your preferences.

 

[bozo699]

id like to get some thoughts on where to start. I'm new to reloading and i will be loading up 22-250 for my first caliber for a specific bolt action rifle. my purpose for reloading is to try to shrink my group sizes and ultimately create some specific loads for certain hunting and target applications that are as accurate as i can possibly get them. there are so many variables to play with in reloading that I'm a little overwhelmed so i'd like to hear from you experts and see what you would do...

First, Read this Over and Over many times: http://www.accurateshooter.com/cartridge-guides/22-250/

There are a lot of variables to choose from for the 22-250, too many as a matter of fact.

When you reload/tune you start with a powder/brass/primer/bullet combination that gives you small groups, then fine tune with neck tension and seating depth.

No need to reinvent the wheel. Go back to the article on the 22-250. Look at the 22-250 REM LOAD MAP. To Keep Things Simple: Pick only ONE or TWO loads that will give you what you're looking for.

Once you've made your selection, use the data given, as the base, for starting your own load work up for YOUR Barrel's preference. Use the Powder type, Primer type, and Bullet type and weight from the LOAD MAP. Start with a charge 10% below what's given then work your way up slowly and safely. If you can afford it, I highly recommend LAPUA brass.

A lot of what you're looking for has already been done for you. Piggyback off the data presented in the 22-250 Remington Cartridge Guide and in particular, the Load Map.

Personally, I'd start with the data for H-4895 because I'm more interested in Accuracy and there are two different bullet weights I could choose from or try both. Make YOUR choice based on your preferences.

Outdoorsman has given you some good advice and I agree with it, he missed a little though that I think he will come back and comment on later so I will take the liberty and touch on one thing for him, save yourself some trouble and buy a good F/L die and F/L size every time, bump the shoulder .001, if you have a factory tube you probably have a 1:14 twist and you will be better off with 50-55 grain bullets, the smaller ones are to susceptible to the wind and 60 and over won't stabilize properly, some 1:14's will shoot the 60 grainers but not many will. I like RJ have never seen a 22-250 that wouldn't shoot H-380 and a 52 grain bullet but it can be temp sensitive, H-4895 or IMR-4895, Varget, and H-4350 are excellent powders for the 50-55 grain bullets IMHO.

Welcome to the forum, Welcome to the world of re-loading, don't be scared to ask questions and if your in doubt at all,..DEFINITELY ask, be safe and have fun
Wayne.

 

[MGYSGT]

Varget is a good choice. Used it for my 22-250 (Savage) for all bullet loads. Never saw a reason to change. 50ish gr bullets worked very well. Tried some small Speers once and they blew up on the way to the target. Were not made for the velocity of the 22-250. Never had to tune a bullet/charge. Got lucky right off the bat with the 50 gr. VMax and Blitzking. Just left well enough alone. Load data from Serria or Hornady books worked well.

Tom

 

[nra-for-life]

hey thanks for all the replies everyone..

just for the record the gun barrel is a 1=12 twist.

Wayne, can you elaborate a little on full length re-sizing... i was under the impression that fire-formed brass from the same chamber should yield more accurate results. but i can still full length size the babies.

on the lapua brass, yes everyone seems to think it is the best and i will probably go that route in the long run. for the time being, and for learning purposes i sort of wanted to experiment and learn with less expensive components. i already screwed up a few casings in the prep process so there is a bit of a learning curve here yet.

so the general consensus is that for the first run out i should just test different powder bullet combinations and not so much bullet seating depth? i will have a look at the recommended loads on the guide here on this site. i did get the powder and bullets for two "accuracy loads" in the sierra manual. their test barrel however is a 1-14 so i don't know how that will effect things. i guess i will find out soon enough.

 

[K22]

H380 is a time proven powder for the 22 250 especially with 50 to 55 grain bullets. 38.0 grain with a 52 grain bullet is the legendary load. This is a ball powder, somewhat temperature sensitive and dirty.

Varget, IMR 4064 and H4895 will also work and less temperature sensitive. So will IMR 4350 but you may not be able to obtain top velocity with this latter powder. However out of my rifle, this powder shoots tightest of all the other powders.

I've had my best results with 55 grain Nosler BT and Sierra 55 BTHP bullets. Groups under 1/2 moa are common out of my rifles with have heavy varmint barrels.

Since the 22 250 is a tapered case be careful full length resizing. You don't want to oversize the case pushing the shoulder back too far since this case tends to stretch, epecially with hotter loads. I'm not a big fan of neck sizing but the 22 250 is one cartridge that can benefit from neck sizing to increase case life.

You can still full size and achieve excellent results. In fact, I now full size all my 22 250 cases but I set the die up so I'm only bumping the shoulder back slightly. I use a Wilson Case Gage (available at Midway or Sinclair) to set up my die to give me the optimum amount of sizing. I get less run out and more accurate reloads using this method.

 

[bozo699]

H380 is a time proven powder for the 22 250 especially with 50 to 55 grain bullets. 38.0 grain with a 52 grain bullet is the legendary load. This is a ball powder, somewhat temperature sensitive and dirty.

Varget, IMR 4064 and H4895 will also work and less temperature sensitive. So will IMR 4350 but you may not be able to obtain top velocity with this latter powder. However out of my rifle, this powder shoots tightest of all the other powders.

I've had my best results with 55 grain Nosler BT and Sierra 55 BTHP bullets. Groups under 1/2 moa are common out of my rifles with have heavy varmint barrels.

Since the 22 250 is a tapered case be careful full length resizing. You don't want to oversize the case pushing the shoulder back too far since this case tends to stretch, epecially with hotter loads. I'm not a big fan of neck sizing but the 22 250 is one cartridge that can benefit from neck sizing to increase case life.

You can still full size and achieve excellent results. In fact, I now full size all my 22 250 cases but I set the die up so I'm only bumping the shoulder back slightly. I use a Wilson Case Gage (available at Midway or Sinclair) to set up my die to give me the optimum amount of sizing. I get less run out and more accurate reloads using this method.

nra-for-life,
K22 pretty much covered it for me, I don't believe in neck sizing anything including the 22-250, the key to accuracy is consistency and you can't remain consistent with neck sizing as it always changes just a little, also most people load it to it's velocity potential which is hard on the case and it needs f/l sized, but as K22 warned just bump the shoulder .001 and it will last as long or longer then if you neck size. If you want to control your neck tention then buy a bushing neck die and a Redding body die, this set up gives you some options. Because of the tapered case it is easy to loose your concentricity if you don't lube the case good including the inside of the neck as well. I also agree with K22 powder suggestions, H-380 is the powder of choice for many, it is almost a sure bet for the 22-250 but mine shoots the best with a FULL case of 4350, so pretty much my post just mimicked K22's post.
Wayne.

 

[artbosco]

... the 22 250 is one cartridge that can benefit from neck sizing to increase case life.

Neck sizing NEVER increases case life.

When the body of the case is allowed to expand to the point that the case cannot be chambered, it's overworked by having to push it back further than normal, with additional force, to get it back to its original designed dimension. Push back over a greater distance, with additional force, degrades case life.

 

[artbosco]

If you want to control your neck tension then buy a bushing neck die and a Redding body die, this set up gives you some options. Wayne.

Two different dies working on one case, at different intervals, sets up too many variables, leading to inconsistencies.

Doing that with 50 cases, some with more malleable brass than the others, exacerbates the inconsistencies.

Combine the two into ONE die. If you're going to use Redding then use the Redding Type S Full [Length] Bushing Die.

 

[nra-for-life]

wow, okay so is there any real purpose then for my neck bump sizing die?

for the record i have the forster neck bumb sizer die. it came with three bushings. from what i had read previously and gathered on other forums and such i was under the impression that a fire formed case that fit your specific gun chamber yielded better accuracy. i also have the forster full length sizer so i can run the cases through that.

yeah i also actually went to sportsman's warehouse with the intention of buying h380, but they are out and couldn't give me any idea on when more might be in stock. they are the only local resource that has any real selection on reloading supplies. since i don't quite know what im doing yet i wanted to keep the quantities small and it seemed ridiculous to pay an extra $30 from midway because of the shipping and hazmat fee for just a 1 pound jug that only cost $20. so i went with varget and reloader 15. the reloader 15 becuase it was the accuracy load listed on two bullets that i got in the sierra manual and the varget because it happened to work with all the bullets that were available.

 

[artbosco]

Is there any real purpose then for my neck bump sizing die?

For the record i have the Forster neck bump sizer die. it came with three bushings. from what i had read previously and gathered on other forums and such i was under the impression that a fire formed case that fit your specific gun chamber yielded better accuracy. i also have the Forster full length sizer so i can run the cases through that.

A Full Length Sizing Die with a Bushing cavity/capability is all you'll ever need along with a bullet seating die.

A case that returns to its original dimensions, with a very small force applied in order to do that, regardless of chamber size, yields better accuracy because the entire case, be it one, or 50, returns to its original design and shape over and over again. The shape remains consistent and consistency is synonymous with accuracy. Which is the opposite of working with continuously mutating cases. Also, by sizing only 70% of the case neck with the bushing in the full length busing die, the unsized 30% helps center the case in the chamber.

If chamber size is a concern, go to a smaller/reduced size chamber.

Shilen offers barrels with different size chambers. They're offered in factory, "tight neck", which require turning case necks, or "minimum neck", which may or may not require neck turning: http://www.shilen.com/chambers.html If you have questions, contact them for recommendations.

If you're reloading instead of using factory ammo, Don't let chamber size dictate an unorthodox sizing regimen. Change chamber size instead. The real options are offered at Shilen.