I am not super new to reloading but I am newer to precision reloading. I shoot a 6.5 creedmoor. My load right now is 41.5 grains of reloader 17 shooting a 140 grain nosler custom comp. I thought you were supposed to crimp your bullets I have always used the lee factory crip die and have had groups sub moa out to 600 yards. I “learned” that for accuracy you should not crimp your rounds. So I did not and watched my groupings go to crap. 8-14+ at 300 and missing target at 600. Why would not crimping make things worse when everyone says not crimping makes better accuracy??
What the hell????
- Thread starter schleutj
- Start date
You have to tune to the pressure differences
BoydAllen
Gold $$ Contributor
My advice is to do your own testing and believe your targets. I will add that no one that I know of ,including several record holders and world champions crimps. Draw your own conclusions. If you were to shoot five five shot groups, one after the other, with your rifle and loads, what would the average accuracy be? In other words,how well is your current system for reloading working? What sorts of velocity extreme spreads are you getting?
Keith Glasscock
Gold $$ Contributor
Crimping is a small differences thing. If it shoots that bad at 300 without crimping, I'd suggest that it might be more than out of tune.
The worst out-of-tune loadings produce markedly better groupings than you are talking about in my known good barrels.
So, I'd suggest loading say, 40 rounds crimped and shoot 4 ten shot groups at 300 or 600 and see what happens. If it shoots good crimped, shoot crimped rounds. Nobody is going to think less of you as a shooter if you win with crimped ammunition.
The worst out-of-tune loadings produce markedly better groupings than you are talking about in my known good barrels.
So, I'd suggest loading say, 40 rounds crimped and shoot 4 ten shot groups at 300 or 600 and see what happens. If it shoots good crimped, shoot crimped rounds. Nobody is going to think less of you as a shooter if you win with crimped ammunition.
It seems to me that you had unsatisfactory results from many things going on in your reloading/rifle-scope-rest/shooting process experience and you changed one thing that made things worse and so concluded that one thing must be the cause. Not necessarily so at all I would suggest.
It's maybe like a guy that keeps getting speeding tickets driving his old chevy so he changes tires and things get worse.
The 2 are not necessarily even related to the problem.
It has been suggested and proven I think that crimping in a non-semi auto rifle is not good for best accuracy...but ..as suggested there is something to learn as others have noted that possibly you may need more neck tension, but there are numerous other things that most likely need some adjustment also to make things better. Neck tension;powder choice; powder charge; bullet choice; bullet weight for your rifle's twist; bullet seating depth; rifle bedding; trigger pull; your shooting form; weather conditions (wind) and on and on....BUT that's the FUN of it all.
World class shooters do not come overnight. Sometimes there are "lucky" shooters that do great right off the bat, but they don't last long because they don't understand the what's and why's of what they did....SO, I think you are the lucky one because you are on your way to "paying your do's" so to speak and understanding the whats and whys you are doing.
Best Wishes and stay with this website and things will get better, I promise. Many of the BEST are here to help
It's maybe like a guy that keeps getting speeding tickets driving his old chevy so he changes tires and things get worse.
The 2 are not necessarily even related to the problem.
It has been suggested and proven I think that crimping in a non-semi auto rifle is not good for best accuracy...but ..as suggested there is something to learn as others have noted that possibly you may need more neck tension, but there are numerous other things that most likely need some adjustment also to make things better. Neck tension;powder choice; powder charge; bullet choice; bullet weight for your rifle's twist; bullet seating depth; rifle bedding; trigger pull; your shooting form; weather conditions (wind) and on and on....BUT that's the FUN of it all.
World class shooters do not come overnight. Sometimes there are "lucky" shooters that do great right off the bat, but they don't last long because they don't understand the what's and why's of what they did....SO, I think you are the lucky one because you are on your way to "paying your do's" so to speak and understanding the whats and whys you are doing.
Best Wishes and stay with this website and things will get better, I promise. Many of the BEST are here to help
joshb
Gold $$ Contributor
I agree. Crimping holds the bullet just like more neck tension does.
No amount of change in neck tension is going to make groups go from sub-MOA to 3-5 MOA at 300 yards.
Something else is going on.
Not being argumentative but I ran a test in early spring of this year.
I built my original load with rcbs dies with lite crimp. Every body said why you crimping.
So I tested hornsby dies against rcbs.
Both neck sized half of each were crimped the other half were not.
The crimped load held tightest group whereas the others had a 3.5"-5" spread.
So I'm going to have to politely disagree.
I'm a firm believer that if you change even 1 lil thing in you recipe, your outcome will be different weather its crimp,dies, primer, seating depth.Respectfully, Brett
Crimp vs. non-crimp in your test has groups different by at most 50%. [How about posting the group measurements?] The OP's groups opened by 300%-500% or more. That has nothing to do with neck tension or crimping.
DirtySteve
Gold $$ Contributor
Crimping is deforming your bullets.... I never crimp a rifle cartridge not even in semi autos.
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
It could be different conditions on the day of no crimp
Not trying to be a jerk here, but with a rifle shooting at best 2 MOA at 100 yards, you can't tell much. The bottom right target is just a weather report.
I have done a lot of competitive shooting at 300 yards, and tested a lot of different variables. This is what 300-yard groups are supposed to look like, even when I can't keep the 10th shot in:
This is a fireforming group I shot off a bipod on my first trip to the range with my 6BR critter gitter. I wouldn't keep even a hunting rifle that shoots worse than this. As Townsend Whelen said, "Only accurate rifles are interesting."
A blizzard?
What cartridge and rifle ?
joshb
Gold $$ Contributor
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