Edward Manning
Silver $$ Contributor
What caliber would choice for mid-way f open 6.5 Creedmoor, 6.5-284 Norma and 6.5x47 Lapua
What caliber would choice for mid-way f open 6.5 Creedmoor, 6.5-284 Norma and 6.5x47 Lapua
- Thread starter Edward Manning
- Start date
Hmmm, all great choices. One has very short barrel life and would be eliminated for that. One I feel is just a tad more accurate than the other: that would be my choice.
I have no trouble using my 6.5x47 Lapua out to 600 in windy conditions...heck, it even does well at 1000.
My other F-class rifles in bigger 6.5 & 30 cal buck the wind better, but the Lapua is no slouch.
Cheers.
My other F-class rifles in bigger 6.5 & 30 cal buck the wind better, but the Lapua is no slouch.
Cheers.
I should elaborate.
I have shot F-open with a 6.5x47L (2 barrels) and it’s a great accurate calibre all the way out to 1000yards.
But as a tack holing 600yards good weather cartridge I have had better luck with the Dasher, as good as the 6.5x47L is the Dasher does it better and with 105Hybrids running over 3000fps gives up very little in the wind.
The 284win is simply a better all round ‘one gun’ choice than either the Dasher or the 6.5x47L
I have found it just as accurate as the 6.5 if anything easier to keep in tune than the 6.5. And it carries a considerable ballistic advantage over the 6 or 6.5 and still with comfortable recoil.
If you want to win competitions build a 7mm, if you want a fun tack holing cartridge get a Dasher.
Here in Australia I use a 6mm Dasher for local level prize meetings which are typically shot at 600yards and less.
For bigger shoots I use a 7SAUM or a 300WSM and most of the pointy end competitors here shoot a SAUM.
So I stand by my initial comment, as a second gun for midrange only you’ll enjoy the 6.5x47L. But in my experience there are better options.
I have shot F-open with a 6.5x47L (2 barrels) and it’s a great accurate calibre all the way out to 1000yards.
But as a tack holing 600yards good weather cartridge I have had better luck with the Dasher, as good as the 6.5x47L is the Dasher does it better and with 105Hybrids running over 3000fps gives up very little in the wind.
The 284win is simply a better all round ‘one gun’ choice than either the Dasher or the 6.5x47L
I have found it just as accurate as the 6.5 if anything easier to keep in tune than the 6.5. And it carries a considerable ballistic advantage over the 6 or 6.5 and still with comfortable recoil.
If you want to win competitions build a 7mm, if you want a fun tack holing cartridge get a Dasher.
Here in Australia I use a 6mm Dasher for local level prize meetings which are typically shot at 600yards and less.
For bigger shoots I use a 7SAUM or a 300WSM and most of the pointy end competitors here shoot a SAUM.
So I stand by my initial comment, as a second gun for midrange only you’ll enjoy the 6.5x47L. But in my experience there are better options.
I used a 7mm-08AI for my first F Open.
Fairly stock Stevens 200 with factory sporter barrel.
My range gun that i'm building is going to be 7mm-08AI with heavy 30" barrel.
Planned bullet is the 160gr TMK.
Should be a decent all around cartridge, with good enough BC, that i can get to velocity without stressing the cases too much.
Fairly stock Stevens 200 with factory sporter barrel.
My range gun that i'm building is going to be 7mm-08AI with heavy 30" barrel.
Planned bullet is the 160gr TMK.
Should be a decent all around cartridge, with good enough BC, that i can get to velocity without stressing the cases too much.
Attachments
Midrange to me is 5-600 yards and you will never go wrong with 6Dasher or 6.5 x 47
Ben_g
Your statement regarding most top level competitors using SAUM is true, hence the reason I am building a 6.5 GAP.
I’m not retiring my other cartridges I use, as I am considered a dinosaur using belted mags, but it’s what I know and they are competitive. Recoil is not an issue for me.
Anyway, hope to see you on the mound, I’m in Vic, where you at?
Cheers.
Your statement regarding most top level competitors using SAUM is true, hence the reason I am building a 6.5 GAP.
I’m not retiring my other cartridges I use, as I am considered a dinosaur using belted mags, but it’s what I know and they are competitive. Recoil is not an issue for me.
Anyway, hope to see you on the mound, I’m in Vic, where you at?
Cheers.
The 6.5GAP will be interesting. It’s certainly a very impressive combination on paper. Considering how hard the 7mm SAUM and the 6.5-284 are on barrels I can only imagine how hard the GAP will be on a barrel. Velocities should be impressive though!!
A few years ago I toyed with the idea of a 6.5x284 running the new 150sierra bullet with some of the newer powders like RE23. On paper it looked like it could be turned into a SAUM beater.
However f-open shooters with more experience than me steered me away from the idea. The required twist combined with f-class course of fire and a slightly roughened throat were potentially going to push the limits of jacket integrity.
I have heard a story from an Aussie team member shooting in Raton a number of years ago alongside a 6.5SAUM shooter. Apparently it was a hammer until bullets starting going puff!!
Anyway, in order to make a 6.5x284 with Sierra 150’s work I was looking at a 5R barrel with the bare minimum twist to avoid over spinning the pill.
In the end I just had a 7mm SAUM chambered in order to comply with Victorian muzzle energy limits.
My thinking has since gone the other way and I am jumping down the 300WSM rabbit hole. The bigger hole seems to really aid on barrel life and the grouping ability and tuning ease is up there with the Dasher.
I live in NSW near the Vic border. I run SAUMS so I can attend the Vic queens and various OPM’s. If I was allowed to use it in Vic I would definitely choose the 300WSM.
I will be at Sydney and Canberra queens. I also usually get to Wodonga/Wangaratta two day shoot in September and hope to attend the postponed Vic queens.
Might see you there.
You should bring that 6.5 of yours up to the Ungarie Bisley pairs shoot in October. I would be keen to see how it performs.
I’m studying this question myself. I’m especially interested in the trade off between bc, barrel life, and mechanical accuracy.
I’m thinking mechanical accuracy end up being more consequential than brute windage is. I’ve tended to prefer ballistic horsepower to overcome my wind calling shortfalls. But ultimately that’s a losing approach. You just cannot build a wind proof rifle. Watching the smaller 6mms run circles around bigger caliber seems to confirm that.
I think stability and barrel life are related. A super hot rod 6mm might wear so fast that you’re always chasing it.
I’m also wondering if a heavier bullet of the same bc doesn’t actually have a bit better real world wind in varying conditions.
Anyway I’m enjoying reading the inputs from more seasoned competitors.
I’m thinking mechanical accuracy end up being more consequential than brute windage is. I’ve tended to prefer ballistic horsepower to overcome my wind calling shortfalls. But ultimately that’s a losing approach. You just cannot build a wind proof rifle. Watching the smaller 6mms run circles around bigger caliber seems to confirm that.
I think stability and barrel life are related. A super hot rod 6mm might wear so fast that you’re always chasing it.
I’m also wondering if a heavier bullet of the same bc doesn’t actually have a bit better real world wind in varying conditions.
Anyway I’m enjoying reading the inputs from more seasoned competitors.
The current single match 20 @ 600yds NRA record is 23X shot by Jim Fowler last October. He was shooting a .284. I was pulling the target and it grouped as well as any Dasher I have pulled for (and I have pulled for the rifle/shooter who held the previous 22X record using a 6 Dasher). Just puttin' that out there
.
.Ben_g,
I shout regularly at Wodonga...just not this year!
Every match I had planned for this year has been cancelled.
Can’t travel outside Victoria at all at the moment, can only shoot in SF or private property, so I’ve been concentrating on hunting this year.
For F-class open, I run 264WM (short course), 6.5x47 (short course) & 300WM.
Have also used 6.5x55 & 260AI.
For 300yrd matches I run my 22-250AI if not windy or the 6.5x47.
Hoping to have the 6.5GAP up & running soon, and the new 264WM/7STW switch barrel finished, still waiting on parts to finish it. Need the pinned .250” recoil lugs to set up the barrel shoulder dimension on both rifles.
At this stage it will be a couple months away still.
Don’t know when I can leave the state for a Como shoot, but would be good to catch ya at one soon.
Cheers.
I shout regularly at Wodonga...just not this year!
Every match I had planned for this year has been cancelled.
Can’t travel outside Victoria at all at the moment, can only shoot in SF or private property, so I’ve been concentrating on hunting this year.
For F-class open, I run 264WM (short course), 6.5x47 (short course) & 300WM.
Have also used 6.5x55 & 260AI.
For 300yrd matches I run my 22-250AI if not windy or the 6.5x47.
Hoping to have the 6.5GAP up & running soon, and the new 264WM/7STW switch barrel finished, still waiting on parts to finish it. Need the pinned .250” recoil lugs to set up the barrel shoulder dimension on both rifles.
At this stage it will be a couple months away still.
Don’t know when I can leave the state for a Como shoot, but would be good to catch ya at one soon.
Cheers.
This is why I shoot a 30 in the wind, the faster larger bullet bucks the wind better.
I am dabbling with 7mm’s for the first time this year, will see how the 2 cals stack up in the real world side by side.
I know the 7 has a slightly better BC in similar weights over the 30, but it is a small difference and I run the heavier higher BC bullets in the 30 cal anyway.
I have a velocity limit, whatever I run has to be doing 3000fps or better, anything less and I don’t care for it.
Cheers.
6.5x47 necked up to 7mm makes a lot of sense to me when you run the numbers and realize that even a 2500fps a 180 Hybrid will shoot inside a 147 ELD at 2800 or so.
But you get better barrel life and the advantage of a heavier bullet even at comparable recoil.
So maybe this needs to be a different thread, but how does the 7x47 stack up against a 7-08 in palma brass for sheer accuracy? I feel like the 7-08 in palma brass is going to give you the possibility of hitting more accurate nodes at sustainable pressures if you were going for the 180 class of bullets.
EDIT: Clarifying that what I mean by more accurate nodes is more numerous, not more better. A 7-08 could be loaded down to where the 7x47 is or up a bit further, probably reaching the ~2650fps "low node" that 284 guys settle for from time to time when their high node isn't working.
EDIT: Clarifying that what I mean by more accurate nodes is more numerous, not more better. A 7-08 could be loaded down to where the 7x47 is or up a bit further, probably reaching the ~2650fps "low node" that 284 guys settle for from time to time when their high node isn't working.
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