I hear of folks weight sorting brass...What exactly is the advantage of this? Also how big a variation should get put in one pile? How much difference does it really make?
Sorting Brass ?
- Thread starter blacknwhite
- Start date
In theory, brass that weighs the same, should have identical internal dimensions, so that the pressure will be similar. I sort 100-200 to the tenth of a grain. I then take those weighing lightest and heaviest, and put them together for sighters, etc. Lapua brass is so close that this is probably an exercise in futility.
http://home.comcast.net/~jesse99/weighcases.html
+1 the goal is to remove the heaviest and lightest cases from teh mix, leaving the cases most alike in case capacity or internal volume. The assumption is that weight translates into internal volume. I suspect that testing for case capacity with water or another substance is a better way to ascertain internal volume, but weighing is easier and faster.
Even if it does give you cases of similar capacity or internal volume, you need to fully prep the cases before you weight them, as trimming and uniforming primer pockets will remove metal and change the weight.
JeffVN
Even if it does give you cases of similar capacity or internal volume, you need to fully prep the cases before you weight them, as trimming and uniforming primer pockets will remove metal and change the weight.
JeffVN
That's really why I asked. It seems to me that a difference in a tenth of a grain would not necessarily mean a difference in internal capacity. Maybe I will try it and see if I can notice a difference.
To sort brass by weight is a “feel good†sort of thing---from a mental aspect if it makes you feel better the do it. There is no proven correlation between brass weight and internal volume. Time would be better spend measuring neck thickness for example.
In reality, one of the big problems in sorting brass is the number of brass cases to be sorted, i.e., the fewer the number of cases the broader the sorting criteria must be.
I have 2500 of a certain lot of Lapua brass which allows me to sort into groups of .1 grains.
I have another lot of 200 which I just sorted to remove the "heavy and light" cases. I have set records and won championships with 194 of the of he original 200. I used the "rejected" six to set neck turning tools and seating depths.
The bottom line is that you just do the best you can and march on with that fact in mind.
Good luck,
Jim Hardy
I have 2500 of a certain lot of Lapua brass which allows me to sort into groups of .1 grains.
I have another lot of 200 which I just sorted to remove the "heavy and light" cases. I have set records and won championships with 194 of the of he original 200. I used the "rejected" six to set neck turning tools and seating depths.
The bottom line is that you just do the best you can and march on with that fact in mind.
Good luck,
Jim Hardy
ronemus
Gold $$ Contributor
I did an experiment several years ago to determine just how much effect brass weight has on .223 loads. I used WW brass,sized, trimmed and deburred, primer pockets uniformed, flash holes deburred, and neck turned), WSR primers, charges of RL-15 or N-550 powder weighed to 0.1 gr, and 75 gr A-Max bullets. Using the lightest and heaviest cases,sorted from 1000 once-fired I had on hand), I had two lots of 10 cases with a 3 gr difference in weight. The average muzzle velocity difference was 16 fps, just a bit more than the 12 fps due to 0.1 gr of powder. I choose to sort 0.5 gr lots of brass for my long range loads, but the effect will only matter at 800-1000 yards - the vertical displacement on the target from such a small velocity change is negligible at shorter distances. Unless you control all other sources of variation, the effect of brass weight is negligible.
Mudcat
Gold $$ Contributor
Depends on what type of shooting you are doing. If youre shooting high power, you are flat wasting your time. For Palma, I weigh my 1000 yard stuff only.
Simply put, not weighing cases hasnt cost me a point that I am aware of. For XTC, I dont even single stage my short line stuff!
More time practicing, less time farting around at the loading bench!
Simply put, not weighing cases hasnt cost me a point that I am aware of. For XTC, I dont even single stage my short line stuff!
More time practicing, less time farting around at the loading bench!
So that my previous response is not misunderstood: In some of the long range games like a 1000 yd prone regional,F-Class or prone), you will shoot 100 to 120 rounds for record,5 or 6 match strings) with a possible team match thrown in.
On the other extreme, when I shot 1000 yd BR at Hawks Ridge, you had a total of 15 record rounds in LG and HG COMBINED unless you made the shoot off. You can do an EXCEPTIONAL prep job for such a small number of shots. Counting sighters, I shot more rounds in my first Long Range Prone Regional,6 match strings) than I shot in an ENTIRE season at Hawks Ridge -- including the IBS Nationals.
If you can only afford to "run" 200 to 300 mid-size Lapua cases on a given barrel, it is darn hard to sort to .1 or even .5 and have enough 1000 yd competition cases unless you get an exceptional lot. You end up sorting them all to .1 and determine which ones will "brother up" in your numbered 100 count match cartridge boxes and eliminate the very high or very low wts.
On the lot of 2500 6.5X284 Lapua I have for necking up to fire form to my 284 Shehane chambering, I expect to have multiple 100 count match boxes full of preped brass that are within .1 for the box because the "numbers" will allow me to do so.
BTW, I have found that on lots of brass where the variation is as much as 3.0 to 5.0 grains, good match prep with very precisely turned and "tricked" necks gives me the low single digit ES and water line vertical I want at the 1000 yard target. I believe the neck prep is far more important than the case wt. factor -- which you really can't control in a small lot sample.
Like I said, you do the best you can in the game you shoot. I expect that opinions will always vary on this topic. I KNOW that I shoot higher scores and X counts because of the work I do at my loading bench in the evenings.
Favor Center,
Jim Hardy
On the other extreme, when I shot 1000 yd BR at Hawks Ridge, you had a total of 15 record rounds in LG and HG COMBINED unless you made the shoot off. You can do an EXCEPTIONAL prep job for such a small number of shots. Counting sighters, I shot more rounds in my first Long Range Prone Regional,6 match strings) than I shot in an ENTIRE season at Hawks Ridge -- including the IBS Nationals.
If you can only afford to "run" 200 to 300 mid-size Lapua cases on a given barrel, it is darn hard to sort to .1 or even .5 and have enough 1000 yd competition cases unless you get an exceptional lot. You end up sorting them all to .1 and determine which ones will "brother up" in your numbered 100 count match cartridge boxes and eliminate the very high or very low wts.
On the lot of 2500 6.5X284 Lapua I have for necking up to fire form to my 284 Shehane chambering, I expect to have multiple 100 count match boxes full of preped brass that are within .1 for the box because the "numbers" will allow me to do so.
BTW, I have found that on lots of brass where the variation is as much as 3.0 to 5.0 grains, good match prep with very precisely turned and "tricked" necks gives me the low single digit ES and water line vertical I want at the 1000 yard target. I believe the neck prep is far more important than the case wt. factor -- which you really can't control in a small lot sample.
Like I said, you do the best you can in the game you shoot. I expect that opinions will always vary on this topic. I KNOW that I shoot higher scores and X counts because of the work I do at my loading bench in the evenings.
Favor Center,
Jim Hardy
ALL:
Check out the new thread on large variations in 6.5x284 Lapua brass. This is a classic example of the problems we all have to face unless we get a "lucky" lot of good stuff.
Jim Hardy
P.S. The new thread was started by "walkertexasranger" and can be found under the forum index of "big stuff 6.5 and up". Look for the work "inconsistent".
Check out the new thread on large variations in 6.5x284 Lapua brass. This is a classic example of the problems we all have to face unless we get a "lucky" lot of good stuff.
Jim Hardy
P.S. The new thread was started by "walkertexasranger" and can be found under the forum index of "big stuff 6.5 and up". Look for the work "inconsistent".
http://home.comcast.net/~jesse99/weighcases.html
Here's a better reason !
Regards,
Steve
Here's a better reason !
Regards,
Steve
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