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Soft jam and neck tension, how do they relate, and how much neck tension before your starting to go further in

I found a seating depth on these light 68 grainers Iv been shooting out my 6bra. I use light neck tension with a .266 bushing and no expander. Iv been anealling now after every firing. This seams to help with consistency. In the past Iv used light jam. Or what Iv read on here people talking about soft jam. I didn't anealling back then so I didn't really pursue it. So. Really what Im saying. My groups don't change from 20 jam all the way to zero jam. So, I'm assuming my bullets are seating them selves and I just need to stay on top of my neck tension, trimming and maybe now start fine tuning powder charges. I( I know these things, I think.,) I'm trying to get. My .2. , and . 09s to 0.
Tell me how you define soft jam , or soft seating and how much neck tension do you think you need before the bullet will not move in the case when chambered. I have a .272 neck using a .266 bushing. And my bullets are seating them selves. Does this sound right?
thanks
 
I found a seating depth on these light 68 grainers Iv been shooting out my 6bra. I use light neck tension with a .266 bushing and no expander. Iv been anealling now after every firing. This seams to help with consistency. In the past Iv used light jam. Or what Iv read on here people talking about soft jam. I didn't anealling back then so I didn't really pursue it. So. Really what Im saying. My groups don't change from 20 jam all the way to zero jam. So, I'm assuming my bullets are seating them selves and I just need to stay on top of my neck tension, trimming and maybe now start fine tuning powder charges. I( I know these things, I think.,) I'm trying to get. My .2. , and . 09s to 0.
Tell me how you define soft jam , or soft seating and how much neck tension do you think you need before the bullet will not move in the case when chambered. I have a .272 neck using a .266 bushing. And my bullets are seating them selves. Does this sound right?
thanks
Pretty simple. Load a round in your rifle. Without firing it, remove it. Measure it. I think jam is a confusing and overall worthless term. Why. For the exact reason your asking the question. The fact you asked the question tells me you have a lot more common sense and are smarter than a lot of people who have more ego than real knowledge.I use the term touch. What I can see and measure. Now go load a round, remove it, compare measurements and you have real knowledge.
 
Iv used the split case measurement. And it works great. And is highly repeatable. But, when I use a non split case, it's always different. As it's different compared to split case method and I use a non split case to shoot. What I'm getting at, is
What neck tension will not allow the bullet to slide in the case?
 
Iv used the split case measurement. And it works great. And is highly repeatable. But, when I use a non split case, it's always different. As it's different compared to split case method and I use a non split case to shoot. What I'm getting at, is
What neck tension will not allow the bullet to slide in the case?
That value will vary due to the different diameter of the bullets.
 
Neck wall thickness, hard or soft brass, carbon or shiny clean inside the neck will affect the amount of bullet grip. I'm guessing the bullets that seat themselves are pretty easy to seat.
You've touched on something I probably need be doing now, and that's cleaning out the necks. Iv been having success anealling now. It sure does help. Like for instance, today I was on shot 11, and was my first flyer. Then I had another run, of 12 shots that where all under .2 in 4 3 shot groups.
I came back, and started anealling brass, That same brass I'll make sure I'll clean the necks out.
Then trimem again.
 
The relation between neck tension (difference in diameter) and how far your can seat into the rifling (past touch) is easy to determine using dummy rounds.

Use cases that are in the exact condition that they would be if you are loading them, sized with different bushings or mandrels. Measure them as loaded with the bullets seated long, and measure them after chambering. If they are shorter after chambering, that length the bullets were pushed back to is old school jam.

I don't anneal, but what I see is the more neck tension the deeper I can seat without the bullet being moved as a round is chambered.

A lot of the confusion is caused because fellows use words without knowing their original meanings.

Back in the day, short range group shooters, who load at the range. Used jam as a reference for where they were seating bullets. ( some probably still do) They would load a round (Remember they were at the range and could chamber it at the line during a firing period.) Measure its length, chamber it, remove it and if it was shorter, that length was jam. Notice, the word was used as a noun. It was a loaded length (a measurement) that a specific bullet would be pushed back to when loaded long, with the case in the same condition that it would be when loaded for a match, same powder fouling, same neck tension. No one was annealing. When asked where they were seating, they would say something like, six off jam, meaning six thousandths shorter than the length that the bullet had been pushed back to in the test. That length was referred to as jam.

If you use a dummy round you eliminate the risk of powder being dumped in the action if the bullet sticks in the barrel as you attempt to extract the round.

I have never heard soft jam, but decades back a prominent high powder shooter explained what that long range shooters in that sport, who were shooting prone with bolt rifles called soft seating. Basically it involved loading long, with light neck tension so that the bullet would be pushed back a little as the round was chambered.

One thing that you did not tell us was if you are satisfied with the accuracy that you are getting, but your question might indicate that you are looking for improvement.

One thing that does not get mentioned much in internet discussions is that different powders "like" different amounts of neck tension. In the 6BRA world, Varget does well with moderate neck tension, while H4895 likes more. In short range group, 133 would prefer .004 while LT32 would be happy with .0015 or so. The obvious way to determine optimal neck tension is to shoot your best load with different tensions.

My suggestion is that you do your own testing, and believe your targets.
 
If you have a 272 neck and a 266 bushing you really aren’t looking at the right questions. You need to know the loaded round diameter and the sized neck diameter after sizing. Typically 2-3 thousands of interference will be plenty.
So measure a sized round with the 266 bushing and then measure a seated round. The neck diameter of the chamber has nothing to do with how much grip u have on a bullet.
 
The difference between the ID of my necks and the bullets I shoot is .0005". Half a thousands. My necks are inside/inline reamed to .2425" and my bullets measure .243". The press handle is all the pressure that is required to seat the bullets. Once seated, the bullets are checked to make sure they do not rotate with finger pressure. The bolt will seat these bullets (if you are loading long) the same everytime.
Inside of the necks are clean (wet tumbled) and a .2425" mandrel is run into each case to ensure the necks are uniform. They are also dusted with moly powder as I shoot moly'ed bullets. I check the loaded rounds for base to ogive dimensions.
The above is what works for me in 6mm as well as 30 cal rounds.
 
I have read that anything over .004 neck tension doesn't give more ''grip''. Sizing down more just works the brass.?
There is one thing that this overlooks. At the base of a flat base bullet, and to a lesser extent at the transition from the full diameter on a BT bullet, there is a step in the neck ID (from bullet shank diameter to sized diameter) that imparts some additional resistance to a bullet being seated deeper, this being in addition to the grip of the neck on the bullet. I believe that this additional resistance increases the amount that a bullet may be seated into the rifling without being moved back as the round is chambered.
 

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