• This Forum is for adults 18 years of age or over. By continuing to use this Forum you are confirming that you are 18 or older. No content shall be viewed by any person under 18 in California.

Sierra 308 win 168 gr Tipped MatchKing: opinions?

Hi my fellow shooters,

I need your input on the Sierra 308 win 168 gr TMK (Tipped MatchKing) bullet as I am very impressed by its advertized BC of .535 @ 2050 fps and above as listed on Sierra's website. Sierra claims that this bullet will remain stable out to 1000 yards because of this high BC when compared to its BTHP sister. Sierra does not have a reputation to boost its claims.

Has anyone put these claims to the test? If so, what are your findings.

PS: as noted, I am interested in this specific bullet and its ballistics ! please do not discuss your findings on other bullets. Thank you

Screen Shot 2016-02-21 at 1.16.54 PM.png
 
I am also very interested, since it has the BC of the 178bthp and others in the same class.

Also does anyone have info if the boat tail design was re designed as to remain stabilized thru trans-sonic zone
 
Last edited:
I don't have any experience with this bullet, but Litz tested a variety of other TMK bullets and actually found Sierra's BC numbers were slightly conservative. The thread is currently parked directly under this one.

I always thought the issue with the 168 was more related to the BT design and not so much BC. Try them and see?
 
I don't have any experience with this bullet, but Litz tested a variety of other TMK bullets and actually found Sierra's BC numbers were slightly conservative. The thread is currently parked directly under this one.

I always thought the issue with the 168 was more related to the BT design and not so much BC. Try them and see?

I read Litz's review. Hopefully he adds the 168 soon. I still went ahead and bought the 168 and will start load testing soon. I'll post results here.
 
I'm not an expert, however, my limited time with these were very jump sensitive and I didn't get proper groups until < 0.005 from the lands in my rifle. Granted its a factory barrel, but the old 2200's were a lot more tolerant.
 
I bought a box of 500 Sierra 168 TMKs. Spent 350 rounds trying to develop a good load for my Savage model 10. Used Winchester brass, IMR 4064, CCI 200 primers. An accuracy node seemed to be around 43.3 gr of 4064. But, recorded 0.7 moa one day, 3.0" moa the next day. Could not get consistent results. Gave up on the TMKs. Your mileage may vary.
 
Did you preform a berger vld seating depth test?

These new bullet are a secant ogive. Not the tangent from the past. Treat them like VLDs.

If not ill take the rest off your hands, cheap of course.
 
Bryan Litz lists the average G1 and G7 BCs in his book, "Ballistic Performance of Rifle Bullets" as 0.503 and 0.257, respectively. His value for the banded G1 BC between 2500 and 3000 fps of 0.534 is very close to Sierra's value of 0.535 at 2050 fps and higher. The 168 TMK has a 9 degree boattail, which should be a marked improvement for the dynamic instability issues associated with the original 168 SMK's 13 degree boattail. These are pretty good BC numbers for a 168 gr bullet. As others have noted, it's a secant ogive bullet and may be picky with regard to optimal seating depth. If you have issues getting them tuned in, one alternative would be the Berger 168 Hybrid. With the Hybrid ogive, it's not too difficult to tune (seating depth), and it has just a slightly higher BC value than the 168 TMKs (G1 avg = 0.513, G7 avg = 0.263). I have shot them out of a couple different .308s over H4895 and they tuned in very well around .015" off the lands.
 
I bought a box of 500 Sierra 168 TMKs. Spent 350 rounds trying to develop a good load for my Savage model 10. Used Winchester brass, IMR 4064, CCI 200 primers. An accuracy node seemed to be around 43.3 gr of 4064. But, recorded 0.7 moa one day, 3.0" moa the next day. Could not get consistent results. Gave up on the TMKs. Your mileage may vary.
Just saw this post - I used Federal brass, 41.5 gr IMR 4064 Federal 210M primers. I was shooting sub-MOA at 600 yards at .003' Seating Depth. Repeated it again with more attention to seating depth, at .010" it was better grouping and still sub-MAO at 600 yards. Due a broken shoulder, I have not had to the opportunity to finish optimizing the seating depth. I am really starting to like them!
 
I tried them in my Tac-Ops Tango 51 and could not get them to shoot anywhere near the standard 168 SMK. Loaded to magazine length and had a lot of jump. Was not interested in single loading for this rifle as factory FGMM 168 shoot so well and consistent.
 
What is the max box length for the TAC OPS? And did you only try one of the seating depths?
 
I've shot the 168TMK in my AR10 at 1000yd and they shot ok. The shot holes were nice and round and supersonic at the target. The winds were wild and SD bad so small groups were not expected.
 
Hi my fellow shooters,

I need your input on the Sierra 308 win 168 gr TMK (Tipped MatchKing) bullet as I am very impressed by its advertized BC of .535 @ 2050 fps and above as listed on Sierra's website. Sierra claims that this bullet will remain stable out to 1000 yards because of this high BC when compared to its BTHP sister. Sierra does not have a reputation to boost its claims.

Has anyone put these claims to the test? If so, what are your findings.

PS: as noted, I am interested in this specific bullet and its ballistics ! please do not discuss your findings on other bullets. Thank you

View attachment 975971
I loaded a bunch for my .308 win bolt gun. BC seems spot on. Surprisingly. At least out to 600 yards. I loaded them for hunting and pushing them 2880 from a 26" barrel. Great accuracy just can't comment on performance on deer...Yet! I'd recommend them as far as accuracy and Sierra's printed data on the bullet. Hope that helps
 
To add to what @eric32 and @Ned Ludd say, Litz gives a value of 0.54 to the Rt/R metric that puts a numeric value of how 'gentle' or 'sharp' the shank to neck sections' junction is. To put that into context 1.0 = pure tangent ogive (jump tolerant / easy to tune), whilst the original Jimmy Knox / Walt Berger VLDs are rated 0.50. So this TMK is very close to classic VLD and has a marked secant form ogive. As @eric32 says, if at first you don't succeed, then go through the VLD tuning process as set out in various places. The reason for its difference from its same weight MK stablemate in this regard is that the 1960s (short-range) design has an Rt/R measured at 0.90, close to tangent form. The later 175gn SMK is even better at an even 1.00, a true tangent ogive shape.

Note that every TMK seems to be different in this regard, so what applies to one is unlikely to be true for others. (For instance, I use the 160gn 0.284 TMK with a measured Rt/R value of 0.84 and found it to be exceptionally jump tolerant.)

The reason the 168gn TMK has such an apparently high BC compared to the 178gn Hornady HPBT Match is that the latter produces a lot of drag for a modern bullet design. This is shown in the value given to the 'form factor', 'form' being balliistician speak for 'shape'. Normal G type ballistics derive their results from a combination of sectional density, a mass to diameter ratio that is fixed for every bullet weight to calibre combination and the variable 'form factor' that compares the subject design's drag profile to that produced by the 'reference' G-whatever projectile. G7 model in this case. The 'reference projectile' always has a form factor value of 1.000 and as it is drag based, a lower value is better, higher is worse. The 168gn Sierra TMK's form factor is rated at an average 0.984 over the 3,000-1,500 fps in-flight velocity band. ie it produces 1.6% less drag than the G7 Reference model. The 178gn Hornady HPBT gets 1.043, ie it generates 4.3% more drag than the reference model. That's poor for a modern allegedly long-range design. (All values from Ballistic Performance of Rifle Bullets 3rd edition by Bryan Litz.)

The more recent Hornady 178gn ELD-M is a different animal though with 0.970 which puts it close to the very low drag 168gn Berger Hybrid (0.966) - a very respectable value for a 308 bullet in this weight band. I'm a fan of the 168gn Hybrid. However, unlike @Ned Ludd 's experience with the Hybrid, it wouldn't perform at all well for me in my former 308 F/TR rifle's chamber at normal length jumps (10-20 thou') but performed brilliantly when treated like a VLD and put into the lands. No doubt it'll therefore do well at long jump values too. Others I know who tried this bullet in British F/TR rifles came up with the same result.

I have a couple of hundred 168gn TMKs to try, but no 308 Win rifle anymore, so they'll eventually get a try-out in 300 RSAUM F-Open rig at somewhat higher MVs. They've seen a fair bit of use by factory rifle 308 Win shooters at long ranges at Bisley and there are encouraging reports on some of our forums, so if this is a pointer they work just fine for at least some shooters and rifles without over much tuning it seems.
 

Upgrades & Donations

This Forum's expenses are primarily paid by member contributions. You can upgrade your Forum membership in seconds. Gold and Silver members get unlimited FREE classifieds for one year. Gold members can upload custom avatars.


Click Upgrade Membership Button ABOVE to get Gold or Silver Status.

You can also donate any amount, large or small, with the button below. Include your Forum Name in the PayPal Notes field.


To DONATE by CHECK, or make a recurring donation, CLICK HERE to learn how.

Forum statistics

Threads
165,018
Messages
2,188,260
Members
78,646
Latest member
Kenney Elliott
Back
Top