Shooting the 44-40 at 200 Yards

[Bryan Austin]

By now most of you know I use Reloder 7 in my Uberti Winchester 73'. I get about 1,350fps and maintain less than 12,000psi as measured on the Pressuretrace II system.

I have not been able to shoot much over the past year and a half, but managed to shoot a few times. So far this year, today was my third trip to the range.

Not only am I still shooting these loads but I am trying to learn how to make better videos.

I cast my own bullets using Accurate Mold's 43-214A which drops between 220gr and 217gr depending on the mix. While the 43-215C (black powder groove) works awesome for black powder, I have found that the 43-214A (smokeless powder groove) works just as well with smokeless.

Aside from the first shot, shots 2 thru 15 grouped 5.827"

Here is the video link.

 

[Dub]

44-40 is a really fun cartridge to shoot. Id say you are doing very well

 

[Rockchuck]

Good shooting I have been shooting some reduced cast bullet loads in 45/70 and 30/30. I have 2 henry single shots that I put peep and globe sights. I just have a ball shooting them.

 

[Bryan Austin]

Ya just gotta love having fun!!!!! I look like an idiot but that's what happens when ya can't see the hits!!!!

 

[dellet]

Was I the only one talking to the screen?

"That's not your hit, you're too high"

It's fun to watch your progress and all the work that actually goes into making it happen. Shooting basically pistol cartridges at 200 takes some effort.

 

[Bryan Austin]

Was I the only one talking to the screen?

"That's not your hit, you're too high"

It's fun to watch your progress and all the work that actually goes into making it happen. Shooting basically pistol cartridges at 200 takes some effort.

I know right...LOL!!!!! I was/am clueless most of the time.

This may be a "pistol caliber" but it isn't a "pistol cartridge" ;-) The reason being exactly what you said. In order for this cartridge to perform at greater distance, it must be loaded as a rifle cartridge. These groups will not work at these distances with this amount of velocity, accuracy and low chamber pressures with pistol powders.

The opposite is true when used in a revolver.

 

[dellet]

I think it held it's own as a pistol cartridge. Velocity was about the same as any other black powder cartridge. 1300 in a rifle, 950 in a pistol.
I wouldn't be surprised if more pistols were made than rifles in 44-40 back in the day.
The 32-20 also did a lot of double duty, with both rifles and pistols being available within a few years of introduction.

Many of the black powder cartridges do quite well with smokeless pistol powder and tend have less fouling due to less unburned powder left behind. Low pressures are not a problem.

I would not limit myself to rifle powder because it's a rifle, pistol powder because it's a pistol for any cartridge originally designed for black powder. I'd probably try a couple shotgun powders as well.

 

[Bryan Austin]

I think it held it's own as a pistol cartridge. Velocity was about the same as any other black powder cartridge. 1300 in a rifle, 950 in a pistol.
I wouldn't be surprised if more pistols were made than rifles in 44-40 back in the day.
The 32-20 also did a lot of double duty, with both rifles and pistols being available within a few years of introduction.

Many of the black powder cartridges do quite well with smokeless pistol powder and tend have less fouling due to less unburned powder left behind. Low pressures are not a problem.

I would not limit myself to rifle powder because it's a rifle, pistol powder because it's a pistol for any cartridge originally designed for black powder. I'd probably try a couple shotgun powders as well.

Just like the 30 Carbine, the 44-40 certainly does hold it's own when load properly for use in pistols, but not as good as it did with black powder, and maintain a lower chamber pressure. Works much better in a rifle which is what it was designed for.

Interesting that SAAMI and Winchester still refer it as a rifle cartridge and list it as such in their data.

Limiting one's self to just rifle powders when used in revolvers is foolish....but it's a long story and there is tons of information on the 44-40 website if anyone is interested.

44-40 Website

My 44-40 Test Data

I use Reloder 7 for Weak Action rifles, good out to 300 yards...1,325fps (1,350fps my load) velocities just like the good ole black powder loads. Winchester's factory hunting loads only produce 1,025fps in 20" barrel carbines. My loads are still pushing 1,000fps at 300 yards, while 1950 advertised 1,320fps and pushing 995fps at 300 yards.!!!

I use IMR-4227 in Strong Action rifles to kick up the High Velocity upwards to 1,733fps...but keep it down to a preferred 1,590fps. Not as accurate out to 300 yards but packs a mean punch in close.

I use Unique for revolver loads.

One day I will run some Bullseye through the revolvers, but that is on the back burner with all the expense now days.

 

[Bryan Austin]

Loaded with rifle powder, for use in rifles. One can not obtain these results with pistol powders in a Winchester 73'.

Winchester claimed their 1950's 1,325fps factory loads maintained 990fps at 300 yards. Winchester claims their current 1,190fps hunting ammo maintains 822fps @ 300 yards. So why all the fuss over 168fps? Because it means a lot for this barn door!! At 1,350fps, there is a chance these loads could be maintaining between 950-1,000fps @ 300 yards. The 44-40 only needs to maintain accuracy and 700fps to be "effective".

During my "pressure testing" I could only get 1,025fps @ 8,965psi from Winchester's current hunting ammo from a 20" barrel. Meanwhile, using Reloder 7 with a Lyman 427098 @ 11,373psi I was able to achieve 1,432fps. Using the 43-214A, I settled on a 1,350fps load.

The Reloder 7 load resulted in 1,350fps in the 26" barrel and a slightly lower load produced 1,300fps, within reason of the 44-40's original ballistics.....not the 44 Henry's 1,125fps (just slightly faster than current Winchester factory 44-40 hunting loads. (your mileage may very)

Buffalo Bore 200gr factory loads resulted in 1,350fps from the 20" barrel @ a reported less than SAAMI Max pressures of 11,000psi....consistent with my tests.

Winchester High Velocity loads used in strong action rifles can produce up to 1,700fps velocities using IMR-4227 but are NOT pleasant to shoot. A slightly less charge of IMR-4227 using a 200gr Magma hard cast bullet produces 1,600fps and a flatter trajectory. Accuracy is about the same as below but slightly tighter. I much prefer the 1,350fps loads from the 73'

The 44-40 was once referred to by Winchester as a "Mid-Range Rifle Cartridge", and is far far from a so called "pistol caliber" or even more correctly termed... Pistol Cartridge!

I am just a caveman, just think what this could do in the hands of a true marksman!!!

 

[Bryan Austin]

I decided to chronograph my loads at 265 yards.

First, just to test the chronograph, revolver at 6 feet = 1,003fps with a Unique load.

Then the rifle Reloder 7 load at 265 yards = 951fps

I guess what this means is that if 951fps is not enough to be "lethal" at 265 yards, then neither is a revolver at 6 feet.....

 

[DirtySteve]

Ballistics are a funny thing when shooting subsonic ammunition. My 45-70 goes slower than my neighbors 45-110 with the same bullet. But mine has less wind drift. Seems backwards.

 

[Pawnee Bill]

My 44-40 at 200 yds is kinda like a mortar round. I just lob them at the target. Sometimes I actually hit it. Not much though.

 

[Bryan Austin]

The 44-40 doesn't really get "lobbed" when loaded to the correct velocity.

951fps impact velocity, 12 degree impact angle. Not exactly being "lobbed"

VIDEO
Impact Angle 12 degrees

Now when I load them slow with Trail Boss, then they get lobbed...lol

 

[jlmurphy]

I have shot Black Powder Rifle Cartridge competitions for years and it took years to understand the wind deflection problems about bullets moving at and around the speed of sound. I won't bore you with numbers, but yes a bullet traveling at 1400 fps will drift much more in the wind than the same bullet at 1000 fps. That is why all .22 match ammo is listed at 1080 fps, much less drift, but more drop. It all revolves around bullet drag.

 

[Bryan Austin]

I have shot Black Powder Rifle Cartridge competitions for years and it took years to understand the wind deflection problems about bullets moving at and around the speed of sound. I won't bore you with numbers, but yes a bullet traveling at 1400 fps will drift much more in the wind than the same bullet at 1000 fps. That is why all .22 match ammo is listed at 1080 fps, much less drift, but more drop. It all revolves around bullet drag.

Good to know. This is why I shoot early in the morning....and it's nice to have a deep narrow range, with trees, where the wind is not a problem during the early morning hours...in general. The only "deflection" I had with my last target was the bullet hitting the wood frame and maybe interfering with the impact angle. I really have no desire to shoot this cartridge on a windy day, it's just not fun to me.