Shipping Your Guns to or from a Gunsmith..

[Rustystud]

You have several options when shipping your guns to and from a Gunsmith. I have tried them all and had problems with them all.

Here are some pointers:

1. Always Package your unloaded firearm so that it is not loose and/or can not get loose inside the packaging during shipping.
I recomend at minimum you use a hardcase inside a cardboard box. You can order a hard case from any of the 6BR website catalog advertisers. It will come in a nice cardboard box. Just open the end and slide it out. Put your gun in it and slide it back into the box. Then tape and relabel the box. Make sure no where on the box it identifies the contents as a gun.

2. Always put the senders and receivers telephone on the outside of the box with the address. I have neighbors call me all the time saying I have a box that was delivered to them by mistake.

3. Always send them insured for replacement value. Take time dated pictures before they are shipped.

4. Always send them adult signature required if by FedEx, UPS, or DHL. If they are sent U.S. Postal send them restricted delivery. This insures a tracking number and verification they got to their destination.

5. Keep all your shipping documentation for a year after the package has been received. There could be a unseen damage that turns up several months down the road.

6. Handguns are by law required to be sent opvernight or next day. Long guns can be sent by ground. The companies may try to stick you with a higher cost shipping bill by saying it must go next day or air,great trick used by both UPS and FedEx).

7. Keep an eye on your gun by watching the shipping tracking. If it does not get where it is supposed to be, when it is designated to be there, then initiate a trace. Don't wait.

In my experience it takes from 7 days to 10 months to get a settlement on a claim. Don't hesitate to take them to small claims court The best $40.00 you can spend. Usually a subpoena or two service will result in a rapid settlement. I always send a certified registered return receipt restricted delivery letter to the corporate CEO or President,putting him in the notice loop). Then I put him on the lis of those being subpoenaed. The CEO usually lives hundreds of miles away and gets paid the big bucks. He dooes not have time for this kind of crap. It is cheaper for them to settle than have their corporate bigwig stuck in some small claims action. It also looks real bad if they loose and his picture is posted in the local news paper walking out of the courthouse,with a heading "XXXX Looses another one". If he tries to dodge the subpoena his lawyer racks him up with a couple hundred dollars of legal fees. It onl;y cost $40.00 to start a small claims action and the subpoena is another $5. bucks. Realiize the carrier usually is not the insurer. They will try many ways not to pay.

I have had two claims within the last 10 weeks and neither has been settled yet. In both cases the barelled action was double boxed and in one case case it was also inside a piece of schedule 80 PVC pipe and was broken. The other was in a double walled card board box. The action was bend at the action barrel juncture, it now looks like a boomerang. The muzzle was pushed through 6 layers od double wall cooregated box.

I quit using UPS over a year ago. Depending on how FedEX settles these last two claims, whether I use their services again. One thing for sure if you use the postal service you have the Postal Inspectors and the BATF looking for your gun if it is lost.

I will be making some shipping cases from plywood and foam line them. I will have to charge my customer a deposit and when they return the shipping crate I will return their deposit. It is sad as this is going to add to the cost of doing business.

Rustystud

 

[Forum Boss]

Nat,

That's great advice that can benefit us all. Hope your FEDEX claim is resolved well. I've had only one claim with them,for a "lost" Wideners return item) and they paid full value about three weeks after the shipping date. What is interesting is that FEDEX actually did deliver the unit, but there was no record in FEDEX's shipping database so it was officially lost. I didn't realize the item had been delivered until I got a refund about 2 1/2 months later from Wideners.

 

[M700]

Interesting. I'm fortunate in having several excellent gunsmiths within driving distance. Vastly prefer to hand-deliver my rifle and have a face-to-face with the builder. It's worked out very well for me so far.

Another buddy here in the same general area always packs his rifles up and ships them clear across the country for his favorite smith to work over. So far he hasn't had any major shipping malfunctions as far as I know.

Simply don't like handing my rifles over to someone else for transport.

Regards, Guy

 

[rstreich]

Nat,

One additional bit that I've learned is that you need to make sure that your firearm is well padded even inside the case. I've had damage on barreled actions that have been packed in a tight-fitting gun case and wrapped in towels and taped up. With all the force generated when they get tossed around, they will slide around. I think I'm going to start cutting pockets in the foam for shipping barreled action.

Only one quibble: I don't believe,at least I can't find it in the regs) that handguns are required by law to be sent overnight. They have to be sent by contract carrier, but I think it's just the carriers that require that they be sent overnight.

robert

 

[Rustystud]

Paul:

I buy barrels from one of your advertisers. He told me why he does not use FedEx any more. He told me he shipped a barrel and the box was delivered but the barrel was not in the box. FedEx told him he must have shipped an empty box. He confronted FedEX and said that box lost eight pounds of shipping weight according to the label and invoice. He should have told them would you rather pay a legitiment loss claim or face a possible federal criminal fraud charge for over charging for shipping that empty box.

UPS lost a special order Krieger barrel being sent to me last April. I asked them not to send the replacement by UPS and they sent it FedEX. The box was almost torn off the barrel.

Neither UPS or FedEx care. You the customer are paying with the insurance premium a gambled risk of shipping your merchandise. The still are making a profit. It is no skin off their nose. The adjusted that came out to inspect the last rifle said this was the fourth rifle damaged in 3 weeks he had looked at.

Rustystud

 

[memilanuk]

I know one vendor of scope stands had some problems w/ UPS... apparently someone inside the UPS system had it in for them. 1" thick-wall steel tubing,scope stand tubes) were getting *bent* in shipping between Florida and Quantico VA. After fighting the claims system on several of those, they got the local office to put *internal* tracking on their packages for a period of time, i.e. who handled it, when and where. Magically, no damage to their packages. As soon as the local agent said, well, nothing to see, and cancelled the internal tracking... packages started getting mangled again.

They switched to FedEx and the problem went away.

UPS is much more convenient around here,easier to get to), but I'm getting tired of the driver bowling packages onto my deck or sitting them on top of my mailbox,on a busy street). Nothing lost or damaged... yet.

 

[Forum Boss]

Rusty et al,

Seems we all have horror stories to tell. I'll say over the last 15 years, my best results have been with Fedex Air. I did a book for Nat'l Geo some years ago,back before digital pix), and we were shipping thousands of precious original 35mm slides. My loss,uninsurable) would have been $1500.00 per image for the more famous photographers,none of the carriers will insure "art value" on photographic stuff). Over a 1-year period, thank god, nothing was lost or damaged.

UPS--After they delivered a new $5000 computer to the wrong address and left it outside in a rain storm I don't trust them with anything valuable anymore. I have also received two specific reports from Forum members about the empty barrel box phenomenon also. Apparently some of the handlers are figuring out barrels are valuable commodities.

DHL--I've had both airplane tickets and a passport delivered to a completely wrong address 10 miles away. Thank goodness the recipient was honest and able to track me down.

 

[keithcatfish]

Yesterday I received a prefit barrel for my Savage 12 that has damage to the outer edge of the muzzle. I inspected the tube before I opened it and noticed only one end was sealed with a plastic cap. The other end was sealed with packing tape. I figure the cap fell out, the barrel hit the ground and someone at UPS put the barrel back in the tube and taped it up.

I contacted the vendor and they said they would cover the cost to have the ding machined out of the barrel or I could wait for a new shipment of barrels. The barrel manufacturer currently is nearly 5 months behind. I need some input, what would you do in my situation? Wait for a new barrel or accept the vendor's deal?

 

[tenring]

One element leaves me baffled - if you buy insurance on the item, why should the carrier contest the loss? That is why they are collecting a premium - it is a money maker for them if cargo losses are not excessive. Prior to retirement I was in the insurance claims field. When you turn your property over to a business, it is what is called a "bailment" by law. This means that the receiver of the goods is legally liable to return the item in same condition in which it was received. If you take your car to the garage for repairs and their mechanic has an accident while testing it, they cannot return it to you and simply apologize for the damage. The bailor is in fact legally responsible for that repair cost. Which raises a question - why buy the carrier's insurance coverage? I buy it to avoid the legal costs involved in taking them to court. But if they choose to deny claims on a wholesale basis, compelling the shipper to hire counsel anyhow, it makes no sense to purchase coverage. Government regulation is needed to bring them to their knees.

 

[Rustystud]

tenring:

You are absolutely correct. Insurance is a crap shoot. The insurance companies set their actuaries to make a profit. The conflict is the shipping company has no obligation to take corrective action without some kind of oversite by the insurer. The shipping company if receiving a peice of the pie from the insurer has an incentive to damage the shippers merchandice. It is a vicious circle with the shipper as the end victum both with damaged goods and paying the premium.

Rustystud

 

[Spotcheck_Billy]

I'm not so sure about this, but doesn't a huge company like UPS actually underwrite its own shipping damage insurance? If that's the case, all the more reason for UPS to automatically deny its insurance claims.

Years ago, I worked in a warehouse that shipped commercial refrigeration repair parts. I remember that every shipping damage claim that we submitted to UPS was first rejected out of hand for alleged "improper packaging". We were a large UPS shipper and receiver, and only after direct phone calls to our UPS representative were these claims paid. UPS really ran us over the hurdles, demanding multiple sets of photos and repeat claim forms to be filed. Over and over! It eventually got so bad that we refused to accept any and all incoming packages that showed even the slightest indication of rough handling. That way, the responsibility of filing a freight claim went to the original shipper and not to us, the receiving party. A sad way to have to conduct business.

I no longer have to worry about that, but as a firearms hobbyist I've found that I get the best shipping service from my local Post Office, with whom I have a very good working relationship. UPS and FedEx have been variable, and dealing with either always makes me nervous. But that's just my personal experience and I'm sure that others on this board will have different experiences with both shipping and receiving of firearms and parts.

 

[rstreich]

To me, it's just the same scam that the medical insurance companies run. The more hoops you make the claimant jump through, the more likely they are to abandon the claim. It costs them very little on their end as all they have to do is send back a letter saying "no."

 

[CopperHead]

Other than UPS, FedEx, DHL and USPS what other common carriers have people used either successfully or unsuccessfully? Can you use any shipping or freight company to ship firearms or only selected ones?

 

[rayjay]

I just today found out that USPS was supposed to have delivered a 40x bolt to my address Wednesday. Their delivery confirmation says so. Right. Unfortunately the guy that sold the item is just saying "Screw you, it's been delivered" and offering no assistance. Delivered where is the question. Delivery confirmation just means the driver dropped it off somewhere.

Thursday I got something from the post office that required the driver to drive up my driveway. It wasn't our normal driver and he asks "Is this 721 ???" Right then I had this bad feeling that maybe earlier in the week he had taken something to the house across the street. My mailbox is on the other side of the road from my yard and the idiots that own the house across the street don't have a mailbox or any numbers on their house so it is common for my stuff to be delivered over there since my mailbox is in their yard although not anywhere near their driveway.

Tomorrow I am hoping I can get the local postal people to help find the package AND allow me to move my mailbox to my side of the street.

 

[tenring]

Spotcheck Billy, I believe UPS is self insured. That means they set XX dollars in reserve annually to pay claims. Unlike auto and homeowners carriers, there is no federal or state oversight for the reserves, and no appeal process in claim payment decisions. UPS,and FEDEX are their own self serving judge and jury. It is really irritating that they keep raising their delivery fees,now UPS has instituted fuel and rural delivery surcharges) and then deny claims on a wholesale basis. With no pressure to change, they will continue to stick it to the customer. I agree the USPS may be the best carrier. Here, a failed delivery claim will be investigated by the postal inspectors. And I have found their fees to be much less than the private carriers.

 

[Rustystud]

The dealings I have had with both would indicate that the carriers may be self insured for the first $100.00. Then if you pay for insurance it is for a private insurance carrier covrage. I have had insurance investigators from GAB come and photograph damaged goods,for FedEx) .

A couple of years ago I had a UPS package left at the end of my driveway. I called them and reported the mis-delivered package. They said they would send a driver to pick it up. It sat there for two weeks. I called every day. At the end of two weeks I brought it home. I opened it up and it contained a computerized telephone switch gear terinal. A friend of mine was in the electronics business he told me the item was a $3000.00 item. About a week later another one was left at the end of my driveway. I called UPS up and they said don't worry about it it was insured and the insurance carrier would pay for it that it was cheaper than sending another driver after it. I looked the recipient up in the tellephone book and called him. He was madder than hell he had been waiting for 4 weeks to get the switchgear. I told him the story and took the second box to his business.

UPS works in their own little world. Just try to get hold of them on the telephone. Then try to contact the same person twice.

Rustystud