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Sartorius Entris w/Autotrickler help

Bought the Entris 64-1S from a member here and the V3 kit with Area 419 accessories.

I have the Autothrow set to throw around 83.4 grains alone. I thought I had the trickler set up properly, got them both to throw 84.508 grains (Target is 84.5). Dump the pan, place it back on and it throws 85ish. Then 84.9. Then 84.5.

I'm using H1000.

Is there something I'm missing or a trick to get the consistent throws?

Thanks
 
This is normal, no system is perfect to the kernel. My process is to get close, and then add or subtract kernels with tweezers depending on how anal you want to be. In my case, I blame my Mother on being perfect ....may she Rest In Peace.
Ben
 
I've not used H1000, but there are very few powders that nearly the same weight per kernel. Wait till you try RL-16, kernels float between .015 -- .055. So, your system is trying to get as close as it can..

Robert
 
Bought the Entris 64-1S from a member here and the V3 kit with Area 419 accessories.

I have the Autothrow set to throw around 83.4 grains alone. I thought I had the trickler set up properly, got them both to throw 84.508 grains (Target is 84.5). Dump the pan, place it back on and it throws 85ish. Then 84.9. Then 84.5.

I'm using H1000.

Is there something I'm missing or a trick to get the consistent throws?

Thanks
As noted before, kernel size / weight is never perfect no matter the powder. And just another thought, in a case the size you are using (85+grs.) a tenth here or there is nothing, forget a kernel here or there..I think your set up is doing just fine..
 
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Bought the Entris 64-1S from a member here and the V3 kit with Area 419 accessories.

I have the Autothrow set to throw around 83.4 grains alone. I thought I had the trickler set up properly, got them both to throw 84.508 grains (Target is 84.5). Dump the pan, place it back on and it throws 85ish. Then 84.9. Then 84.5.

I'm using H1000.

Is there something I'm missing or a trick to get the consistent throws?

Thanks
@CBlack, I too use the Sartorius and the auto throw and auto trickler. Here are a few tips that I have learned along the way:

1. Set the throw amount to be roughly 1 grain less than your target weight. This will allow for fluctuations in the dump volume while also allowing the trickler to do its thing without letting kernels back up in the trickler tube.
2. Adjust the trickler tube to be at a slight incline to the powder tray such that each kernel needs to fight gravity a bit before falling out of the tube. This will let you obtain much more kernel control as you get close to your target weight.
3. Adjust the speed lever to slow down the fine trickle.
4. You should have 3 decimals with the 64-1s. If the finished charge ends up being within 1/2 kernel weight low or high, it is good to load. If a whole kernel light, use @BenPerfected technique of adding a kernel manually. If a full kernel heavy, manually remove a single kernel. Else, recycle the dumped powder and throw another one.
5. Sometimes you need to unplug the unit for 30 seconds and then recalibrate the unit to reset its memory.

I have found that if I follow rules 1-3, 75% of the charges finish within the 1 kernel spread.
 
@CBlack
5. Sometimes you need to unplug the unit for 30 seconds and then recalibrate the unit to reset its memory.

I have this setup also.

How do you know when you need to reset / recalibrate the scale?

Also are you guys with Entris' setting the trickler tube angle to drop 1 grain / sec at full speed?
 
Realise it's weighing it after the drop. It doesn't know what's coming. Slow down.
I constantly pick one or two out or add one or two.
 
I have this setup also.

How do you know when you need to reset / recalibrate the scale?

Also are you guys with Entris' setting the trickler tube angle to drop 1 grain / sec at full speed?

My setup typically finishes a load 1-2 kernels light. I manually use a moist toothpick to pickup the additional kernels and add them by hand. If I'm over target, I pull out some kernels with the moist toothpick and add back as necessary. My final load is always within 1/2-kernel of the desired charge weight.

My slide lever is mid-range and I don't have any angle on the drop tube.

With regards to zeroing and/or recalibrating, I know what my powder cup weighs. So when I remove the cup now filled with powder, if the scale doesn't display the negative of that number within +/- 1 kernel, I will clear the Aurotrickler, zero/recalibrate the scale, and reset the Autotrickler.

As an example, let's say I want to measure 29.00 grains of N133. An individual kernel weighs 0.010 to 0.012 grains. So to start, I tare the scale and calibrate. Then I set my empty powder cup on the scale. Let's say it reads 116.010 grains. I make a mental note of "0.010". I then tare the scale and remove the pan. The scale should read -116.010 grs. I just ignore the 116 and focus on ".010". If I'm not +/- 0.006 grs of that number, I remove the pan, hit the tare button, and then place my calibration weight back on the scale. If the scale doesn't display the correct calibration weight value to +/- 0.002 grs, I recalibrate.

I know this sounds tedious but it's now second nature to me. The zero on my scale does drift; some days more so than others. But during a typical 1 hour loading session, I may recalibrate 1 or 2 times. And keep in mind, the 3rd decimal place value shown is bogus. It's beyond the true sensitivity of the scale. That's the main reason why it's impossible to achieve true 1-kernel accuracy. HTH.
 
Take a match book cover put it under front of trickler and tilt it backwards, i know, sounds like it’s to easy of a solution, but it works most of the time. FYI you may have to fold match book in half and double thickness for tilt.
 
Also forgot to mention. Be careful if you have the Area 419 self centering tray. Went back and forth with it several times before removing it and reinstalling the factory Sartorious tray. The weight just wouldn’t be consistent.
 
When it keeps bouncing around and won’t settle on a weight.
Mine always goes back to zero, at least the zero I tared at the beginning.

However I did notice more recently that it is taking longer to settle as weight is being added: it overshoots and takes a couple of seconds to recover to the new weight. This messes with the trickler logic.

I did reconfigure my trickler rate per Adams recommended 1gr/ sec and that helped some.

David
 
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Thanks for the pointers everyone. Went with the below and now it's pretty consistent. With 2 hundreths for the most part.

@CBlack, I too use the Sartorius and the auto throw and auto trickler. Here are a few tips that I have learned along the way:

1. Set the throw amount to be roughly 1 grain less than your target weight. This will allow for fluctuations in the dump volume while also allowing the trickler to do its thing without letting kernels back up in the trickler tube.
2. Adjust the trickler tube to be at a slight incline to the powder tray such that each kernel needs to fight gravity a bit before falling out of the tube. This will let you obtain much more kernel control as you get close to your target weight.
3. Adjust the speed lever to slow down the fine trickle.
4. You should have 3 decimals with the 64-1s. If the finished charge ends up being within 1/2 kernel weight low or high, it is good to load. If a whole kernel light, use @BenPerfected technique of adding a kernel manually. If a full kernel heavy, manually remove a single kernel. Else, recycle the dumped powder and throw another one.
5. Sometimes you need to unplug the unit for 30 seconds and then recalibrate the unit to reset its memory.

I have found that if I follow rules 1-3, 75% of the charges finish within the 1 kernel spread.
 
Figured that out! Mine kept saying "HIGH" when I put their cup on. Called Sartorius tech support and determined that their tray was too heavy when used with their cup. With their cup I have approximately 125gr capacity left.

Also forgot to mention. Be careful if you have the Area 419 self centering tray. Went back and forth with it several times before removing it and reinstalling the factory Sartorious tray. The weight just wouldn’t be consistent.
 

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