First off,I have never had these holders work for me as advertised. I am trying to set the shoulder on 6BR Lapua brass. The base to shoulder is 1.139", I need to kick it back .0015". I started out with a standard Redding shell holder and got the 1.139 measurement. I then tried the comp holders, .010" all the way to the .002" holder and could not get any change from the 1.139 measurement. What am I doing wrong? I get cam over, I am not new to hand loading, and normally set the shoulder buy raising or lowering the die with a standard shell holder, sometimes I need to size and not get cam over with no problems adjusting the shoulder to what I need.
Redding Comp. Shell Holders
- Thread starter blvedere
- Start date
I use the Shellholders , set up on the .010 #10 shellholder with full contact. I'm using the RCBS Single stage RockChucker Supreme , when using the standard shellholder with full contact and changed to the comp Shellholders the contact was barely touching . Standard deck height is too high , will oversize the case . Set up with #10 holder lowest deck height and work up , I found using a #17 o ring on my dies between press and lockring screwed down to a hard stop enables me to make fine adjustments with the die . I also work with headspace settings between .001 - .002 no more or less , are you using different brass brands . Different brands may size with different comp.shellholders because of thickness differences . Hope I Helped .
Chris
Chris
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MikeMcCasland
Team Texas F-T/R
It sounds like you're doing it backwards. As others have said, you need to setup your die using slight contact with the .010 shell holder. From there, you'll work the bump back using .008, .006, all the way until you hit the 'standard' shell holder (this should way over-bump the shoulder).
If you set your die up using the standard shell holder, and then migrated to using the comp shell holders, the shoulder will never touch the die.
From my use, I think the shell holders are pretty consistent in their measurement, but it can be tricky to setup the die so that it's dead nuts .002 every time you drop a shell holder in size.
If you set your die up using the standard shell holder, and then migrated to using the comp shell holders, the shoulder will never touch the die.
From my use, I think the shell holders are pretty consistent in their measurement, but it can be tricky to setup the die so that it's dead nuts .002 every time you drop a shell holder in size.
Mike is right. You are using them backwards. 
Paul
Paul
hogpatrol
Gold $$ Contributor
The shellholders are for decreasing setback, not increasing it. There was a request made to Redding to make a set that worked the opposite way but the market was such that they didn't have any interest. You didn't say what brand die you are using but trying another may solve your problem. Either that or try another brand of shell holder. I have had the deck height on them vary .001 to .002.
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dellet
Gold $$ Contributor
There is generally enough room between the case head and shell holder to slide a .002-.003” feeler gauge. That should get you the .0015” you need. Even a piece of paper will work a time or two to check. If you need more than that to get the set back you want it’s probably time to customize.
As others have said the standard shell holder is the shortest setting. You can try other brands and maybe find one, or polish the bottom of the die or top of a shell holder for a custom length.
As others have said the standard shell holder is the shortest setting. You can try other brands and maybe find one, or polish the bottom of the die or top of a shell holder for a custom length.
The standard Shellholders shoulder ( the contact point on the shellholder between die and shoulder ) are different from the Comp Shellholders , just switch Shellholders to test , the comps are the same . As a example the 308 standard shellholder deck height is .125 the #10 comp deck height is .135 and goes up .002 with each shellholder ,. .135 to .127 the set of 5
joshb
Gold $$ Contributor
I “was” going to accurately file one down, then polish it! I went to the shop with my mics and shell holder . How to do it with what I have? Hmmm. Put it in the drill press, then lower it onto a new sharpening stone! Brilliant!.........it won’t fit in my press.
Put a bolt thru the hole, lock it down with a nut and put that in my drill press! Brilliant.........couldn’t find the proper bolt.
Think.....and think.....for a half hour......nothing!
I grabbed the damn thing, turned on the grinder and pushed the shell holder into the flat side of coarse wheel until it got too hot to hold.
That oughta do it!
Redneck machining at it’s best.
It worked! Now I have plenty of extra clearance!
Put a bolt thru the hole, lock it down with a nut and put that in my drill press! Brilliant.........couldn’t find the proper bolt.
Think.....and think.....for a half hour......nothing!
I grabbed the damn thing, turned on the grinder and pushed the shell holder into the flat side of coarse wheel until it got too hot to hold.
That oughta do it!
Redneck machining at it’s best.
It worked! Now I have plenty of extra clearance!
hogpatrol
Gold $$ Contributor
I “was” going to accurately file one down, then polish it! I went to the shop with my mics and shell holder . How to do it with what I have? Hmmm. Put it in the drill press, then lower it onto a new sharpening stone! Brilliant!.........it won’t fit in my press.
Put a bolt thru the hole, lock it down with a nut and put that in my drill press! Brilliant.........couldn’t find the proper bolt.
Think.....and think.....for a half hour......nothing!
I grabbed the damn thing, turned on the grinder and pushed the shell holder into the flat side of coarse wheel until it got too hot to hold.
That oughta do it!
Redneck machining at it’s best.
It worked! Now I have plenty of extra clearance!
Next time call me, five minute job on the lathe, a little longer on the surface grinder.
The Redding “COMPETITION” shell-holders, do not always work properly - especially when used in conjunction with a press of another make: the overall height dimension varies wildly (industry tolerances, and indeed, Redding tolerances, for this attribute, vary substantially)! When the Redding shell-holders are inserted into the ram of a non-Redding press, it is not uncommon for the bottom surface to contact the top surface of the ram-groove, thus, incorrectly positioning the shell-holder to die relationship.The shell-holder
ress-ram should contact should be only between the top face of the ram, and the bottom face of the shell-holder rim (my possibly incorrect terminologies - pics should clear that up). If the very bottom surface contacts the top surface of the shell-holder slot, there will be gap between the top face for the ram, and the bottom face of the shell-holder - very undesirable, but not uncommon!In the pictured Redding COMP shell-holder set , the over-all height varies something over 0.007”! So, the difference between those tow shell-holders would cause an extra load (or, unload) on the press, and result in, at least, 0.007” difference, or, three times the stated difference in head-space dimension!
The height, from the ram contact face, to the top of the shell-holders varies within the tolerance range of the caliper - less than 0.001”. On this facet, all six measre 0.250 - .251".
Thus, presuming proper shell-holder:ram fit, and the ram at top of stroke, screwing the die into solid die:shell-holder contact, thus removing all ‘play/stretch’, any of the five shell-holders would interchange quite well.That get us to the thickness of the case-head contact faces (caliper displaying 0.1200"), which, in this set, varies 0.010”, or, exactly the specified range: via [this] caliper, the “spacing” is not always the stated 0.002”, but, within the expected reliability of the caliper: 0.001” or, less.
I have observed this many times - sometimes, when I point this out, people have gotten mad at me, I suppose thinking I had just called them stupid . . . I’d be embarrassed to tell you how long I fought with my first set before figuring it out!
The solution: grind a bunch off of the BOTTOM of the shell-holders, clearance there is desirable, and need not be anywhere, “close” - that’s where you want the gap!
As a last resort, usually only needed for custom chambers, cut to minimum head-space, one may need to take a few thou of the top face of the shell-holder - yep, I’m made a few of those too - but only do this when you are certain of proper shell-holder:ram fit. RG
P.S. this same attribute can exist between all makes of shell-holders - the OAL/total height tolerances and the shell-holder groove tolerance must be, “all over the map”.
joshb
Gold $$ Contributor
Thanks!....but I try not to bother you. Your activity with those bushings was above and beyond. I owe you for that! I would like to see your shop sometime, tho. I hear you can eat off the floor!Next time call me, five minute job on the lathe, a little longer on the surface grinder.
If the standard shellholder does not set the shoulder back enough . The best thing you can do is send the comp shellholders back for a refund . They are not designed to set the shoulder back more then a standard shellholder . Therefore if that’s what you need they are of no use to you unless you can use them for a different fiream or cartridge .
Grinding on them IMHO is a waste of time and money . You should be able to do the same thing with any brand shellholder with a deck height of .125 at a much lower cost .
As stated earlier you can place the appropriate sized feeler gauge under the case to get it to go a little deeper into the die
The die contacts the "TOP" of the shell holder and the bottom of the shell holder has no effect on the amount of bump. It can effect the amount of cam over force but it will not push the case further into the die.
The purpose of the Redding competition shell holders is to change and reduce the amount of shoulder bump without touching the die.
If a standard shell holder will not give you enough shoulder bump then just lap the top of the shell holder on some fine wet and dry sandpaper a little at a time until you have the desired shoulder bump.
You can also try pausing at the top of the ram stroke for a few seconds, this will reduce the amount of brass spring back after sizing.
The purpose of the Redding competition shell holders is to change and reduce the amount of shoulder bump without touching the die.
If a standard shell holder will not give you enough shoulder bump then just lap the top of the shell holder on some fine wet and dry sandpaper a little at a time until you have the desired shoulder bump.
You can also try pausing at the top of the ram stroke for a few seconds, this will reduce the amount of brass spring back after sizing.
joshb
Gold $$ Contributor
I was maybe being a little too humorous with my plight but I was in a silly mood. I only have one gun that I have this problem with. It’s a Bat SV with a 6.5-47 barrel. It’s tight. Brand new brass fits fine. Using a standard shell holder in contact with “my” die, the resized brass barely allows the bolt to close. I just needed a couple more thousandths of clearance. I just wanted to Git’R Done!
Joshb
I knew you were joking around but in reading your last post , I realized I was wrong , using the standard shellholder you still having resistance on your cases . Did you try what Metal God suggested using the feeler gauge may give you that added push needed . As long as you trimmed the base of the die fluch that would get you there too . Is this the original barrel or a rebarrel . You can check with a pair of Go and No Go gages and test for chamber length.
I knew you were joking around but in reading your last post , I realized I was wrong , using the standard shellholder you still having resistance on your cases . Did you try what Metal God suggested using the feeler gauge may give you that added push needed . As long as you trimmed the base of the die fluch that would get you there too . Is this the original barrel or a rebarrel . You can check with a pair of Go and No Go gages and test for chamber length.
That’s a good looking feeler gauge that in my experience will be destroyed under the pressure of sizingIf the standard shellholder does not set the shoulder back enough . The best thing you can do is send the comp shellholders back for a refund . They are not designed to set the shoulder back more then a standard shellholder . Therefore if that’s what you need they are of no use to you unless you can use them for a different fiream or cartridge .
Grinding on them IMHO is a waste of time and money . You should be able to do the same thing with any brand shellholder with a deck height of .125 at a much lower cost .
As stated earlier you can place the appropriate sized feeler gauge under the case to get it to go a little deeper into the die
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