Powder Storage ( IMR 4166)

[Steve Donlon]

Now I'm thinking about 223 ammo I have loaded with 4166 that has been sitting in my safe for years. What could happen if it was bad?

 

[bobm]

......this.

Pull a couple apart for inspection. If OK go shoot them all soon.

 

[mic2377]

My theory about powder going bad like this is that there is a chain reaction starting with one container of powder that "goes off" for one reason or another. It may be too old, or there was too much moisture or temp exposure.

I have had this happen once with one of the old square tins of IMR 3031. It was also in an enclosed box. Once the powder breaks down it, it starts to develop a red dust. My assumption is that when this is exposed to moisture, it forms an acid that destroys metal containers and caps in short order. Then further off-gassing occurs, and this chain reactions ruins anything else in close proximity.

In my case I caught it with only a small amount of corrosion in 2 other bottle tops, but the powder and the rest of the bottles were fine.

As a result I don't store large quantities in powders in enclosed spaces. I leave it open to ventilation, no boxes. I also label each container of powder with its age, and if it was ever opened. I try and cycle through stock by age and use oldest first.

 

[bobm]

There is no official recall of IMR 4166 , but it was part of the IMR Enduron line discontinued by Hodgdon around 2022 due to various factors, including production challenges and potentially lower demand, with some users reporting issues with powder degradation, smelling of ammonia, and corroding components, suggesting potential stability concerns for older or poorly stored batches.
Key Points:

• Discontinued, Not Recalled: IMR 4166, along with other Enduron powders (4451, 4955, 7977, 8133), was discontinued by Hodgdon, not recalled for safety issues by the manufacturer.
• User Reports of Degradation: Some reloaders reported that their IMR 4166 developed an ammonia smell, turned rust-colored, and corroded bullets, cases, and primers, even when stored indoors.
• Potential for Exotherming: In extreme cases, a container of bad powder reportedly overheated and exploded, highlighting the risk of improperly stored or degraded smokeless powder.
• Reasons for Discontinuation: Besides production difficulties and regulatory issues, some speculate the line wasn't popular enough for military or civilian markets.

What to Do if You Have IMR 4166:

• Inspect Your Stash: Check for unusual odors (ammonia), discoloration, or clumping.
• Use with Caution: If it looks or smells off, do not use it; dispose of it safely.
• Use Promptly: If your powder seems fine, consider using it up sooner rather than later, or store it with extra care.

 

[M-61]

Im not sure that I’ll ever use anything that is in the box.

I’m sure. I would not. But to each his own.

 

[M-61]

How was his health the rest of his days?
What little I know about rocket fuel is that for the most part it is toxic…
Thinking of all those that came back from VN after being dosed with copious amounts of Agent Orange… {:~/

Agent Orange, purple and white.
Copious is a relative term. Everything can be fine for decades. Then….nothing compared to CAD or PAD.
My arms a mixture of 4?different types of skin cancer. They are looking good here. The arteries not so much.

 

[Steve Donlon]

How was his health the rest of his days?
What little I know about rocket fuel is that for the most part it is toxic…
Thinking of all those that came back from VN after being dosed with copious amounts of Agent Orange…

Agent Orange, purple and white.
Copious is a relative term. Everything can be fine for decades. Then….nothing compared to CAD or PAD.
My arms a mixture of 4?different types of skin cancer. They are looking good here. The arteries not so much.

I'm glad you are still around and hope the VA is stepping up to the few of you that are left.

 

[JMayo]

Just like batteries. The seal in the lid went bad and the gasses came out eating up any metal it came in contact with.
If I wanted to keep it I'd pour it in an old plastic bottle from some powder I used up and relabel it.

 

[Steve Donlon]

......this.

Pull a couple apart for inspection. If OK go shoot them all soon.

That's a good idea. I would not think that could happen to a loaded round in dry environment. edit: I just pulled a bullet from the oldest box I have reloaded and it looked perfect, with no order or any smell. Thanks for the idea to just check them. I'll start shooting them up for peace of mind.

 

[ben-o]

The can I had that went bad was stored inside, same conditions as a lot of other powder that is still just fine.

My first clue was loaded rounds that gave me several hang fires. Powder seemed fine when I loaded it, and the rounds didn’t sit more than a month or two. When I checked the can, it was letting off thick, acrid fumes, but it didn’t spontaneously combust