OT - Fear of Flying?
- Thread starter Gun Smith
- Start date
farmerjohn
Gold $$ Contributor
Correct! I know the feeling well... John
Gun Smith
Gold $$ Contributor
Yikes!
The Brits call the propeller the "Airscrew".
IF a prop comes off, its pretty much game over. My prop weighs around 75 pounds, with it removed the CG moves so much that a safe landing is unlikely.
But, I practice engine out landings regularly. I have had to dead stick (stuck throttle) one time, it makes you pay attention!
But, I practice engine out landings regularly. I have had to dead stick (stuck throttle) one time, it makes you pay attention!
skeeljc
Gold $$ Contributor
I was with my brother-in-law in a small Cessna. We were landing at a small airport. He made his approach and when he pushed the throttle in the engine did not respond and stayed at high rpm. He made a pass over the runway and pulled up. When I asked him what was wrong he said the throttle was stuck. He went around and set up for another landing. When he was close to the runway he reached up and killed both mags and made a perfect landing.
It pays to remain calm and think.
It pays to remain calm and think.
Thinking will keep you alive!!
A very effective way to reduce power with a stuck open throttle is to lean the mixture. If that's not enough, then kill it with mixture.
I was low on fuel coming into Grand Junction a couple months ago. My fuel gauges are mechanical gauges, when they stop moving, its empty. I ran the right tank until the needle stopped bouncing, then switched to the left tank. I was only about 10 minutes out from the airport. Landing is supposed to be tanks on both, but since my right tank was essentially empty I landed with left tank only. I landed, and as I turned on the taxiway the engine coughed, I switched to both and it relit. I still had 10 gallons in the left tank, but the sloshing caused it to suck air. I don't like run it that low, but sometimes there is no fuel nearby. 10 Gallons is theoretically about 50 minutes of flying at cruise power. Legal is 1/2 hour of fuel, I'm pretty spooked when the gauges are that low!!
A beer run. Landed in the pasture 
Keith Glasscock
Gold $$ Contributor
If you have those, your feet don’t fall asleep.
muleman69
USMC -1st marine Div. RVN
Have had to do this a time or to
Flying is hours and hours of sheer boredom, punctuated by seconds of sheer terror....
Flying with someone that went to A&P school with me.
We were in his Cesna 180 with floats. The gear is run electrically on the floats. Wouldn't come down.
We cycled the breaker a few times, but no dice.
Had to land in the grass beside the runway.
Scary as all get out when the fuselage of the plane is about 6ft above the floats....
Kept waiting for us to nose forward and roll it into a ball.
Working as a mechanic for the airline gave me a whole, scarier, prospective on flying!
Still love going up any chance i get!
Pink Floyd got it right.
"Tonque tied & twisted, just an earth bound misfit. Fly."
We were in his Cesna 180 with floats. The gear is run electrically on the floats. Wouldn't come down.
We cycled the breaker a few times, but no dice.
Had to land in the grass beside the runway.
Scary as all get out when the fuselage of the plane is about 6ft above the floats....
Kept waiting for us to nose forward and roll it into a ball.
Working as a mechanic for the airline gave me a whole, scarier, prospective on flying!
Still love going up any chance i get!
Pink Floyd got it right.
"Tonque tied & twisted, just an earth bound misfit. Fly."
You guys are just EP amateurs......... 
I started my emergency procedure (EP) career a couple months into pilot training with smoke in the cockpit in a T-37. A few months later in the T-38 we lost hydraulic fluid and the gear wouldn't come up. Those were just warms up for what was to come.
My second flight in C-130 copilot school we had an engine fire. I shut it down as directed and then the instructor flew an engine out ILS in the weather down to minimums. As a C-130 copilot I shut down engines 12 times, was hit by lightning, and had so much stuff to go wrong I can't remember it all.
As a C-130 aircraft commander I shut down engines 5 times and was hit by lightning again. However, as an AC I was in charge, and I got my azz chewed for the lightning strike.
On one engine shutdown I was #2 in a three-ship formation at night on the run-in to the DZ for an airdrop--on a guys lead checkride.
The C-130 lead pilot checkride (and lead nav checkride) was a BIG deal. We always stacked the rest of the formation with strong aviators to give the lead pilot the best chance of passing. In order to pass you had to have your formation lined up across the DZ properly, hit the POI with the first item dropped, and be within ONE minute of the TOT, which was established well before you flew the one-hour low level route. Time planning was a challenge and the workload was very high on the run-in.
Now you need permission to join or leave the formation and it takes a bit of doing to get that clearance from ATC. Normally, lead coordinates all that. The LAST thing a lead pilot wants to do during his lead checkride at night is to have more stuff to do on the run-in.
After I directed the engine to be shutdown and we ran the checklist, I chuckled and commented "The lead pilot (don't remember his name) is going to love this!"
The radio call was "Lead, two". An annoyed vice came back: "two, go". I replied: "we just shut down #3 engine." There was dead silence. I then said: "why don't I break out to the north and get my own clearance back to base." His response: "Yeah, do that".
Later on the ground he thanked me for not messing up his checkride.....
Losing one of your four engines usually isn't a big deal. The only time I was nervous about it was on short final to Guam when a throttle stuck. A throttle sticking in an E model C-130 was a big deal. There were lots of cables and pulleys that controlled the propellor and a manipulating a stuck throttle could cause a prop to go into reverse in the air--which at low altitude was certain death.
My second tour was as a T-38 Instructor and I got to fly upside down, pull Gs, and go supersonic--which is why I joined the Air Force in the first place. My biggest EP in that plane was a compressor stall. It was a student formation sortie. We had finished the formation part, my student just completed his landing, and it was my turn for a landing.
As I was turning 90 to Initial in the pattern the right engine compressor stalled. This meant it was still running but had quit producing thrust. I pulled the throttle to idle and the stall cleared, but now the engine was unavailable.
Unlike the C-130 with it's four very powerful engines, the T-38 only has two engines and when you lose one it goes from being a hot rod sports car to an underpowered Yugo. So you have to be especially careful to keep your speed up.
The T-38 has a tiny wing and it needs a lot speed to fly. We'd fly around the pattern at 300 indicated just to somewhat fit in with everyone else, but it wasn't really happy below 350 KIAS. It liked 400-500 KIAS best. Configured with gear and flaps, the minimum speed on final was 155 KIAS and it wasn't so responsive at that speed. Having only half of your normal thrust meant if you got behind the power curve (this is the real meaning of that phrase), you might not recover.
Oh yeah. It was at the end of the sortie so I didn't have a lot of fuel left. I told the controller I was going to carry through initial and enter the straight-in ground track from that position--not really a standard thing to do but it made the most sense in this situation. He approved that and made sure the pattern was clear for me.
I landed uneventfully using single engine procedures. The scheduler was happy because the student sortie was completed and the controller was happy because I got my EP resolved quickly and got out of his pattern. The SQ/CC found out about and told me good job. A year later they started making a big deal when someone handled an EP well, but that was the overriding theme of my USAF career........never getting as much credit as others for doing the same thing.
The last airplane I flew, the T-1, was a business jet (Beech 400) that the USAF converted to a trainer. I had the scariest EP of all in that plane--dual runaway trim. It doesn't sound like much but trust me, when you cannot control the airplane it is a big deal indeed. We figured it out and what caused it was a broken spring in the trim switch on the left seat yoke. Whenever the trim was moved it would go full in that direction, and the control forces were extremely heavy.
After my last flight in the USAF Inquir flying for 15 years. In the summer of 2019 I decided to start flying again. A friend from work took me up in his old M20C Mooney.
I was very pleased to find that I still had my SA and airmanship. I distracted him with all my questions and he missed changing fuel tanks. The engine quit in the pattern. It was a quick fix and he was embarrassed, but he wasn't an instructor and I asked him questions like he was. It was my fault. However, something HAD to happen on my return to aviation.
I have since learned that general aviaton piston engines are extremely reliable as long as they are reasonably maintained and you don't run them out of gas or oil.
Last year I took the military competency test the FAA has for former military pilots, and I got my CFII Multi. I added a single engine rating to that and also passed a 135 Checkride.
Nowadays I get to fly a nice Navajo on occasion. Given my history I like that it has two engines. My biggest worries in that airplane are using the Garmin 650, keeping the EGT and CHTs in line, and getting the engines started when they are hot. Though aviation has taken a back seat this year since we moved, I will take a 135 Check in that plane and start flying it a little more next year.
I would be very happy if I didn't have any more EPs. I think I have checked that box enough times........
I started my emergency procedure (EP) career a couple months into pilot training with smoke in the cockpit in a T-37. A few months later in the T-38 we lost hydraulic fluid and the gear wouldn't come up. Those were just warms up for what was to come.
My second flight in C-130 copilot school we had an engine fire. I shut it down as directed and then the instructor flew an engine out ILS in the weather down to minimums. As a C-130 copilot I shut down engines 12 times, was hit by lightning, and had so much stuff to go wrong I can't remember it all.
As a C-130 aircraft commander I shut down engines 5 times and was hit by lightning again. However, as an AC I was in charge, and I got my azz chewed for the lightning strike.
On one engine shutdown I was #2 in a three-ship formation at night on the run-in to the DZ for an airdrop--on a guys lead checkride.
The C-130 lead pilot checkride (and lead nav checkride) was a BIG deal. We always stacked the rest of the formation with strong aviators to give the lead pilot the best chance of passing. In order to pass you had to have your formation lined up across the DZ properly, hit the POI with the first item dropped, and be within ONE minute of the TOT, which was established well before you flew the one-hour low level route. Time planning was a challenge and the workload was very high on the run-in.
Now you need permission to join or leave the formation and it takes a bit of doing to get that clearance from ATC. Normally, lead coordinates all that. The LAST thing a lead pilot wants to do during his lead checkride at night is to have more stuff to do on the run-in.
After I directed the engine to be shutdown and we ran the checklist, I chuckled and commented "The lead pilot (don't remember his name) is going to love this!"
The radio call was "Lead, two". An annoyed vice came back: "two, go". I replied: "we just shut down #3 engine." There was dead silence. I then said: "why don't I break out to the north and get my own clearance back to base." His response: "Yeah, do that".
Later on the ground he thanked me for not messing up his checkride.....
Losing one of your four engines usually isn't a big deal. The only time I was nervous about it was on short final to Guam when a throttle stuck. A throttle sticking in an E model C-130 was a big deal. There were lots of cables and pulleys that controlled the propellor and a manipulating a stuck throttle could cause a prop to go into reverse in the air--which at low altitude was certain death.
My second tour was as a T-38 Instructor and I got to fly upside down, pull Gs, and go supersonic--which is why I joined the Air Force in the first place. My biggest EP in that plane was a compressor stall. It was a student formation sortie. We had finished the formation part, my student just completed his landing, and it was my turn for a landing.
As I was turning 90 to Initial in the pattern the right engine compressor stalled. This meant it was still running but had quit producing thrust. I pulled the throttle to idle and the stall cleared, but now the engine was unavailable.
Unlike the C-130 with it's four very powerful engines, the T-38 only has two engines and when you lose one it goes from being a hot rod sports car to an underpowered Yugo. So you have to be especially careful to keep your speed up.
The T-38 has a tiny wing and it needs a lot speed to fly. We'd fly around the pattern at 300 indicated just to somewhat fit in with everyone else, but it wasn't really happy below 350 KIAS. It liked 400-500 KIAS best. Configured with gear and flaps, the minimum speed on final was 155 KIAS and it wasn't so responsive at that speed. Having only half of your normal thrust meant if you got behind the power curve (this is the real meaning of that phrase), you might not recover.
Oh yeah. It was at the end of the sortie so I didn't have a lot of fuel left. I told the controller I was going to carry through initial and enter the straight-in ground track from that position--not really a standard thing to do but it made the most sense in this situation. He approved that and made sure the pattern was clear for me.
I landed uneventfully using single engine procedures. The scheduler was happy because the student sortie was completed and the controller was happy because I got my EP resolved quickly and got out of his pattern. The SQ/CC found out about and told me good job. A year later they started making a big deal when someone handled an EP well, but that was the overriding theme of my USAF career........never getting as much credit as others for doing the same thing.
The last airplane I flew, the T-1, was a business jet (Beech 400) that the USAF converted to a trainer. I had the scariest EP of all in that plane--dual runaway trim. It doesn't sound like much but trust me, when you cannot control the airplane it is a big deal indeed. We figured it out and what caused it was a broken spring in the trim switch on the left seat yoke. Whenever the trim was moved it would go full in that direction, and the control forces were extremely heavy.
After my last flight in the USAF Inquir flying for 15 years. In the summer of 2019 I decided to start flying again. A friend from work took me up in his old M20C Mooney.
I was very pleased to find that I still had my SA and airmanship. I distracted him with all my questions and he missed changing fuel tanks. The engine quit in the pattern. It was a quick fix and he was embarrassed, but he wasn't an instructor and I asked him questions like he was. It was my fault. However, something HAD to happen on my return to aviation.
I have since learned that general aviaton piston engines are extremely reliable as long as they are reasonably maintained and you don't run them out of gas or oil.
Last year I took the military competency test the FAA has for former military pilots, and I got my CFII Multi. I added a single engine rating to that and also passed a 135 Checkride.
Nowadays I get to fly a nice Navajo on occasion. Given my history I like that it has two engines. My biggest worries in that airplane are using the Garmin 650, keeping the EGT and CHTs in line, and getting the engines started when they are hot. Though aviation has taken a back seat this year since we moved, I will take a 135 Check in that plane and start flying it a little more next year.
I would be very happy if I didn't have any more EPs. I think I have checked that box enough times........
I started taking flying lessons in January of 1977, flying a Beech C-23 Sundowner. The instructor I was flying with was the only one available, and in addition to him carrying a pretty good load of students, he also flew charter flights for the FBO, so I was having a tough time getting scheduled to fly with him on a regular basis. I moved on to another FBO at a larger operation where they had four new Cessna 152s and three full-time instructors, and was able to take the checkride for my private license in Dec. of '78. Not long afterwards, wanting to get a little high performance/complex time in my logbook, the instructor who'd seen me through most of the training for my private checked me out in the FBO's C-210, which was quite a step up from the 152s & 172s I'd been flying. Everything was cool until we came in to land, and couldn't get three greens on the gear indicator lights. So Mike had me take it back up & out to the practice area, where we tried pumping the gear down with the emergency hand pump. The mains were down - we could see them out the door windows - but we couldn't be sure about the nose wheel. So we switched places to put Mike (the instructor) in the left seat, flew back to the airport, and did a low & slow pass down the runway so the guys in the FAA FSS could get binoculars out and take a look at the nose gear as we flew by. It was down, but of course they couldn't tell us whether it was locked down or not. So Mike went around, and did his best to make the smoothest landing he could manage, and we were down nice & easy. We taxied over to the first taxiway off 17-35 and shut it down as we cleared the runway, then got out and inspected the gear. Everything appeared to be ok, so we fired it back up and taxied on over to the FBO's ramp. Those older 210s still had gear doors on the mains, which sequenced up to close as the gear extended or retracted. It wasn't that uncommon for the system to function normally, but fail to indicate that the main gear doors had come up after the mains had locked in the down position. Not really an emergency as it turned out, but something that got my attention...
Dad had gotten his private license a year before I was born in '51, so some of my earliest memories are of flying with him in a rented Cub, which cost him a whopping $5/hr, wet. Until he rented someone's Ercoupe, Cubs were all I'd ever flown in - I remember thinking "This thing doesn't smell like a real airplane." since it was all metal, and didn't smell like a tube & fabric Cub. With five of us kids to feed & clothe, he didn't have the time or money to do any flying for several years.
After I'd started taking lessons, Dad found a '61 Cessna 150 for sale during a drive up to NE Kansas to visit one of my sisters & her husband, and made a deal for it, so we both had an economical plane to fly. I flew the little 150 every chance I got - day & night - trying to build hours so I could get my commercial license. I moved down to Wichita the winter of '79-'80 to train for the commercial/instrument, and the day after I passed the instrument checkride, I got a job with an aircraft ferrying outfit owned by a former RCAF pilot who flew Spitfires during WWII. We flew mostly single engine Cessnas (I didn't have a multi rating at the time) from Strother & Pawnee to other smaller airports for storage, or over to Mid Continent (now Eisenhower) to spot them at Yingling Cessna so pilots flying commercial into ICT could pick them up. The boss didn't pay us for the local 'spotting' flights, but who cared - I was flying new airplanes every day, usually several different types on a typical day. He paid us 7 cents/nautical mile when we delivered a plane to a distributor - most common trips were to Kenosha, Wi. or El Paso, Tx., which were the same distance from ICT, and which paid me a whopping $39. More often than not, he'd wait until he had four or five planes going to either of those destinations, then send a borrowed 206 to pick us all up and bring us back to Wichita, thus saving him the cost of airfare for his pilots. On rare occasions, he'd have the use of a nicer twin to haul us back, like several new C-421s purchased by the Royal New Zealand AF, with proper military paint job including a little maroon Kiwi bird in a roundel on the sides of the fuselage, and RNZAF in a strip at the base of the vertical tail. It was a learning experience, for sure. If the weather was questionable, and I didn't want to take a trip he offered, there was always a more experienced pilot (civilian or military) who was willing to get some instrument time. So I wound up taking some trips in weather that I probably shouldn't have been flying in - and in the process, managed to scare the crap out of myself while getting valuable IFR experience.
After a particularly good wheat harvest in June of '82, Dad & I bought a very nice '64 Beech 35S Bonanza from local pilot (the first owner of this wonderful plane) who was suffering from dry macular degeneration. I've loved practically every minute of flying this plane, with a few exceptions - like losing a vacuum pump at 4:30am on a moonless night while flying near the SW Kansas/Colorado state line, which is sparsely populated, with very few lights on the ground to give any sense of a horizon. I always carry a couple of little round soap plates covered with miniature suction cups for such an event - when you lose a vacuum pump, which sucks filtered air through your gyro instruments, the gyros spin down slowly, causing the artificial horizon & directional gyro to precess, giving a false indication. Rather than lose control of the aircraft due to following the incorrect indication, once you've identified the failed pump by looking at the vacuum pressure gauge, you take these soap plates, lick 'em & stick 'em over the offending gyro instruments, then work at flying 'partial panel' to keep the wings level, and maintain altitude. I found the first soap plate in the pocket under the front of the pilot's seat, licked & stuck it over the AH, but had a hard time locating the 2nd plate, while doing my best to keep the plane level. Finally I found it, and quickly licked it - yuck! - what an awful taste! Got it stuck over the DG, and grabbed my travel mug full of hot tea in an attempt to wash that awful taste out of my mouth. A quick check with the flashlight revealed the source of the bad taste - the plate had mouse urine over it... Lesson learned - never, ever lick the emergency soap plates without first inspecting them with a flashlight!!! This was the 3rd vacuum pump I'd lost in the Bonanza, and the only time when the loss didn't occur in good daylight VFR conditions. We've never installed an auto pilot in this plane, so flying at night or in IFR conditions requires your full attention to keep it level. The trip that night was to take a good friend's father out to St. George, Utah for his brother-in-law's funeral, and involved flying across La Veta Pass in the mountains SW of Colorado Springs (in daylight VFR conditions) and on across Colorado into Utah, through Monument Valley and over Lake Powell. Out & back made it a long day, and I was surprised at how fatiguing it was to fly without the gyro instruments, even in good VFR conditions. Guess we don't realize how much we depend on them until they're not available. We've since equipped our Bonanza with an Aspen glass panel, which replaces the gyro instruments, and which is powered by solid state electronic AHRS to keep the AH & DG operating, so loss of a vacuum pump isn't an issue in that regard.
Dad had gotten his private license a year before I was born in '51, so some of my earliest memories are of flying with him in a rented Cub, which cost him a whopping $5/hr, wet. Until he rented someone's Ercoupe, Cubs were all I'd ever flown in - I remember thinking "This thing doesn't smell like a real airplane." since it was all metal, and didn't smell like a tube & fabric Cub. With five of us kids to feed & clothe, he didn't have the time or money to do any flying for several years.
After I'd started taking lessons, Dad found a '61 Cessna 150 for sale during a drive up to NE Kansas to visit one of my sisters & her husband, and made a deal for it, so we both had an economical plane to fly. I flew the little 150 every chance I got - day & night - trying to build hours so I could get my commercial license. I moved down to Wichita the winter of '79-'80 to train for the commercial/instrument, and the day after I passed the instrument checkride, I got a job with an aircraft ferrying outfit owned by a former RCAF pilot who flew Spitfires during WWII. We flew mostly single engine Cessnas (I didn't have a multi rating at the time) from Strother & Pawnee to other smaller airports for storage, or over to Mid Continent (now Eisenhower) to spot them at Yingling Cessna so pilots flying commercial into ICT could pick them up. The boss didn't pay us for the local 'spotting' flights, but who cared - I was flying new airplanes every day, usually several different types on a typical day. He paid us 7 cents/nautical mile when we delivered a plane to a distributor - most common trips were to Kenosha, Wi. or El Paso, Tx., which were the same distance from ICT, and which paid me a whopping $39. More often than not, he'd wait until he had four or five planes going to either of those destinations, then send a borrowed 206 to pick us all up and bring us back to Wichita, thus saving him the cost of airfare for his pilots. On rare occasions, he'd have the use of a nicer twin to haul us back, like several new C-421s purchased by the Royal New Zealand AF, with proper military paint job including a little maroon Kiwi bird in a roundel on the sides of the fuselage, and RNZAF in a strip at the base of the vertical tail. It was a learning experience, for sure. If the weather was questionable, and I didn't want to take a trip he offered, there was always a more experienced pilot (civilian or military) who was willing to get some instrument time. So I wound up taking some trips in weather that I probably shouldn't have been flying in - and in the process, managed to scare the crap out of myself while getting valuable IFR experience.
After a particularly good wheat harvest in June of '82, Dad & I bought a very nice '64 Beech 35S Bonanza from local pilot (the first owner of this wonderful plane) who was suffering from dry macular degeneration. I've loved practically every minute of flying this plane, with a few exceptions - like losing a vacuum pump at 4:30am on a moonless night while flying near the SW Kansas/Colorado state line, which is sparsely populated, with very few lights on the ground to give any sense of a horizon. I always carry a couple of little round soap plates covered with miniature suction cups for such an event - when you lose a vacuum pump, which sucks filtered air through your gyro instruments, the gyros spin down slowly, causing the artificial horizon & directional gyro to precess, giving a false indication. Rather than lose control of the aircraft due to following the incorrect indication, once you've identified the failed pump by looking at the vacuum pressure gauge, you take these soap plates, lick 'em & stick 'em over the offending gyro instruments, then work at flying 'partial panel' to keep the wings level, and maintain altitude. I found the first soap plate in the pocket under the front of the pilot's seat, licked & stuck it over the AH, but had a hard time locating the 2nd plate, while doing my best to keep the plane level. Finally I found it, and quickly licked it - yuck! - what an awful taste! Got it stuck over the DG, and grabbed my travel mug full of hot tea in an attempt to wash that awful taste out of my mouth. A quick check with the flashlight revealed the source of the bad taste - the plate had mouse urine over it... Lesson learned - never, ever lick the emergency soap plates without first inspecting them with a flashlight!!! This was the 3rd vacuum pump I'd lost in the Bonanza, and the only time when the loss didn't occur in good daylight VFR conditions. We've never installed an auto pilot in this plane, so flying at night or in IFR conditions requires your full attention to keep it level. The trip that night was to take a good friend's father out to St. George, Utah for his brother-in-law's funeral, and involved flying across La Veta Pass in the mountains SW of Colorado Springs (in daylight VFR conditions) and on across Colorado into Utah, through Monument Valley and over Lake Powell. Out & back made it a long day, and I was surprised at how fatiguing it was to fly without the gyro instruments, even in good VFR conditions. Guess we don't realize how much we depend on them until they're not available. We've since equipped our Bonanza with an Aspen glass panel, which replaces the gyro instruments, and which is powered by solid state electronic AHRS to keep the AH & DG operating, so loss of a vacuum pump isn't an issue in that regard.
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