New to metallic reloading and in need of experienced opinions on die selection for reloading .17 Remington. I only shoot AR rifles that I am building for varminting with an average of 75-100 rounds fired per week in my rat busting persuit. I only punch paper to sight in a new upper/scope combination. My current set up is a Redding T-7 press with Redding FL and seating dies, and Redding competition seating die for 204 Ruger. I also have a Hornady FL and standard seating die for 204 Ruger that will FL size once fired cases with better concentricity than the Redding FL die. I use a 21st Century concentricity gauge and also have a Sinclair gauge. The Redding FL die will consistantly produce cases with .0025-.003 runout and the Hornady FL die produces case with almost zero run out?? The Hornady die will even straighten out the cases that have been run through the Redding die. I have not figured this out yet and would welcome any suggestions. I am building a new upper in .17 Rem and would like to assemble the straightest most concentric cartridges possible. I know it has more to do with the Indian than the arrow, but I strive to eliminate as many variables as possible. My apologies for the long winded post, and thanks in advance for your replies and input. This forum is a wealth of knowledge and experiance!! That is why I am a daily reader.
Opinions needed on die selection
- Thread starter squirrelsplitter
- Start date
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
Cant go wrong with redding dies for what youre doing. I dont know if rcbs makes the small base ar dies in your caliber but thats what id get if possible. They come in a black box
Thanks for your replies.
Anyone else care to chime in on reloading 17 Rem?
Anyone else care to chime in on reloading 17 Rem?
Switched from a regular Redding FL to a Redding comp FL bushing die starting with fresh Lapua 308 brass and the concentricity is outstanding. The 21st Century gauge hardly ever moves. A move of .001" would stand out like a sore thumb.
Get the right size bushing, follow the setup instructions closely and use a good neck lubricant.
Get the right size bushing, follow the setup instructions closely and use a good neck lubricant.
Lets clarify what you are calling runout with the Redding FL size die...you run a fired case thru the die to resize it and put it on your concentricity gauge, you are checking the neck area??? and you see .0025"-.003" TIR {total indicated runout} Is this correct??? Also, this is not a bushing type die, correct???
If it is not the bushing type take the expander ball assembly out of the die and run another case thru it. At this point you could not use this sized case to reload as is, of course the neck is too tight. Now check it for concentricity at the neck...should be zero. If it is not dead zero then put the die back together and send it back to Redding with a note telling them what you did. This die is defective.
If it is dead zero try running the previous case it just made .003" out and see if it straightens it out. It should. Now put the expander ball assembly back in place but leave it loose. Resize another fired case only this time stop when you are withdrawing it from the full "up" stroke right when you can feel it pass over the expander ball. Try to catch it so that the expander ball is in the middle of the case neck as best you can while coming back down. Now stop there and tighten the expander ball assembly. Retest the case neck and see if you have zero runout. If not, you probably have a bad or bent expander ball assembly. Usually this will correct the problem if the expander ball is good and it will not if there is a problem with it. You should do this and center all of your expander assemblies in all your resize dies before you start to use them.
Edit: You might be able to set up your expander assemblies on your concentricity gauge and check them for runout...I usually just put them in Vee-blocks. You might even be able to straighten them if you are able to identify any runout and get it back to zero.
I have never had a lock ring cause case inconcentricity. Not that one cant. Test for this the same way...loosen the lock ring and spin it up out of contact with the top of the press...set the die where it belongs and run a case and check it. Put the lock ring back and see if the TIR returns.
If it is not the bushing type take the expander ball assembly out of the die and run another case thru it. At this point you could not use this sized case to reload as is, of course the neck is too tight. Now check it for concentricity at the neck...should be zero. If it is not dead zero then put the die back together and send it back to Redding with a note telling them what you did. This die is defective.
If it is dead zero try running the previous case it just made .003" out and see if it straightens it out. It should. Now put the expander ball assembly back in place but leave it loose. Resize another fired case only this time stop when you are withdrawing it from the full "up" stroke right when you can feel it pass over the expander ball. Try to catch it so that the expander ball is in the middle of the case neck as best you can while coming back down. Now stop there and tighten the expander ball assembly. Retest the case neck and see if you have zero runout. If not, you probably have a bad or bent expander ball assembly. Usually this will correct the problem if the expander ball is good and it will not if there is a problem with it. You should do this and center all of your expander assemblies in all your resize dies before you start to use them.
Edit: You might be able to set up your expander assemblies on your concentricity gauge and check them for runout...I usually just put them in Vee-blocks. You might even be able to straighten them if you are able to identify any runout and get it back to zero.
I have never had a lock ring cause case inconcentricity. Not that one cant. Test for this the same way...loosen the lock ring and spin it up out of contact with the top of the press...set the die where it belongs and run a case and check it. Put the lock ring back and see if the TIR returns.
Last edited:
msinc
Well just like you said, "bad or bent expander ball assembly". The die was not the problem it is the expander ball on the decapping rod. Switched it out with a carbide free floating ball and the
TIR is .0005-.001 now. Thanks for your input!! Now I just need to decide on the 17 Rem dies??
Redding, Hornady, Forester...any more opinions on which ones to buy??
Well just like you said, "bad or bent expander ball assembly". The die was not the problem it is the expander ball on the decapping rod. Switched it out with a carbide free floating ball and the
TIR is .0005-.001 now. Thanks for your input!! Now I just need to decide on the 17 Rem dies??
Redding, Hornady, Forester...any more opinions on which ones to buy??
Glad I was of some help. As far as sizers go there really are no bad ones...I have personally had good luck with the Hornady's, "New Dimension", "Custom" or whatever they are calliing them these days. The reason being that they seem to be the only ones with a seating die that might work. It's hit or miss, but I have gotten ones that will seat a bullet concentric. Otherwise, I buy whoever's sizer and get a Bonanza Benchrest Seater. If the caliber I want is not available in the Benchrest Seater die {such as the 280AI} then I get a L.E. Wilson Straightline Seater die. With the exception of getting lucky with a Hornady seater die you pretty much can take every other brand or type of standard factory bullet seater die and see if you can skip it across a pond...you will get more out of it doing that than trying to seat bullets straight!!!! I don't know why anyone bothers to even make them...they obviously do not load their ammo with them, or they don't own a concentricity gauge.
One other thing I will say, years ago RCBS did a pretty in depth test process regarding bullet runout. They reported that anything under .003" was good and that there wasn't a discernible difference from .000" to .003". I haven't done anywhere near the testing level that they did, but I have spend considerable time testing it and have to agree. The case should be zero, and if the bullet is .003" or less you are good to go.
As to the 17's...primer pocket uniformity and proper seating of the primer coupled with very careful powder measuring is paramount with this caliber as a very slight change can equate to a big difference on the target. Best of luck!!!!
One other thing I will say, years ago RCBS did a pretty in depth test process regarding bullet runout. They reported that anything under .003" was good and that there wasn't a discernible difference from .000" to .003". I haven't done anywhere near the testing level that they did, but I have spend considerable time testing it and have to agree. The case should be zero, and if the bullet is .003" or less you are good to go.
As to the 17's...primer pocket uniformity and proper seating of the primer coupled with very careful powder measuring is paramount with this caliber as a very slight change can equate to a big difference on the target. Best of luck!!!!
Thanks for your feedback!! I do appreciate the help. Have a great weekend.
Yeah, guess I should have mentioned the smaller carbide free floater as a key part of it shouldn't I have?
You might still find the standard expander ball to come in handy for brand new brass. That's the only time I use it.
CH
I will keep that in mind for the new brass. I have some new brass that I have not opened yet.
So a question...do you guys find the need to FL size brand new brass? Since I started reloading for the 204 Ruger I have bought brand new Hornady, Nosler, Norma, and Winchester brass and all of it seems to need to be FL sized. Is this the norm?
I will keep that in mind for the new brass. I have some new brass that I have not opened yet.
So a question...do you guys find the need to FL size brand new brass? Since I started reloading for the 204 Ruger I have bought brand new Hornady, Nosler, Norma, and Winchester brass and all of it seems to need to be FL sized. Is this the norm?
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
Every mfr recommends brass to be fl sized prior to loading.
Thanks Dusty. I learn something new every time I get on this forum.
Reloading adds a whole new layer of fun to the shooting sport.
You guys are great! Thanks for your help.
Reloading adds a whole new layer of fun to the shooting sport.
You guys are great! Thanks for your help.
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
It helps incase necks are out of round, bulges in the brass, and lubing them for sizing is a good way to inspect em
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