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New Varget Tub

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Al Lu

Gold $$ Contributor
I am shooting .308 WIN, 165 Gr Sierra Game King. If my previous shooting load was 42.7 Gr of Varget, what kind of powder increment should I test for the new lot of Varget? Increments of 0.3 Grains on either side?

Or use a Magneto Speed and test to match the velocity of the old load to the new load? Which one was would be the best approach?
 
I always use 0.2 gr increments....admitedly a bit of over kill for a 30 - 40 gr load.

Then I check velocity / ES / SD with my Magneto Speed.

I don't do any of this for differnt lots. Varget is Varget is Varget.

Its works. For me, anyway.
 
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Hunting rifle? If your previous load had a fairly decent window and you weren't at max pressure, I'd just match velocity.
 
When I started longer range shooting I chronographed my loads a lot and found a change in velocity when I started a new 1lb cannister of Varget with the same charge. "Experts" on another forum said this was not unusual and the changes I noted were real. Suggested either just buy 8lbers or, dump my 1lb cannisters into an empty 8lb container and the variances would even out. I read around the subject and found similar opinions from other sources.
 
Not a problem sir, I meant no disrespect. Just giving my experience also.
I have had jugs of Varget which provided enough velocity differences that would worry a person.
Don't take anything for granted with Varget, great powder but be cautious from jug to jug.
Can U quantify ?
 
Can U quantify ?

Can U quantify ?
This is rather tame compared to what I have experienced in the past.
6 Dasher
31.9 grains of Varget (new & old)
105 Bergers
CCI 450 primers
Lapua brass
CBTO 1.7370"

OLD JUG ----- NEW JUG
2943 fps ----- 2915 fps
2948 fps ----- 2917 fps
2940 fps ----- 2916 fps
2946 fps ----- 2910 fps
2941 fps ----- 2903 fps

I have had much wider swings between jugs of Varget which has created large increases in velocity and pressure.
Just suggesting the use of caution.
 
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This is rather tame compared to what I have experienced in the past.
6 Dasher
31.9 grains of Varget (new & old)
105 Bergers
CCI 450 primers
Lapua brass
CBTO 1.7370"

OLD JUG ----- NEW JUG
2943 fps ----- 2915 fps
2948 fps ----- 2917 fps
2940 fps ----- 2916 fps
2946 fps ----- 2910 fps
2941 fps ----- 2903 fps

I have had much wider swings between jugs of Varget which has created large increases in velocity and pressure.
Just suggesting the use of caution.
My recent experience with my 6BRX is similar. Average difference with same charge just changing Lots of Varget was 25-30FPS difference.
 
I've had a few Lot#s of Varget that differed in velocity from others by as much as 50-75 fps for a given charge weight with all the Lot#s for the other components (brass, primers, bullets) being identical. However, it's much more common to see Lot-to-Lot powder differences in the 5-10 fps range, or well within the velocity ES/SD values for the different Lot#s, meaning the burn rate of the new Lot# is statistically pretty close to the previous Lot#. The problem is, there is no way to know for sure with a new Lot# until you determine an average velocity for a known charge weight.

Because I use QuickLoad to expedite/facilitate the reloading process, this is generally not a problem. I initially use a reduced charge weight to "calibrate" the program, adjusting the burn rate factor (Ba) until the velocity predicted by the program exactly matches the average [measured] velocity from the reduced charge weight of the new Lot# of powder.

Fortunately, it is not necessary to use QuickLoad to do the same comparison, and it is quite easy, especially if you have the charge weight of a tuned load with previous Lot#s of the same powder. Simply choose a reduced charge weight as compared to the previous tuned load that will generate safe operating pressure even if the new Lot# of powder is markedly faster than the previous Lot#. I generally reduce the charge weight from a tuned load with a different Lot# of the same powder by 2-3%. However, you could increase that a little more for safety purposes if desired. Load a sufficient number of rounds for a few foulers and 5 additional shots for a velocity determination, then determine the average velocity with a known charge weight and record the velocity data in a data book for that rifle where you will always have it. If you use the same reduced charge weight for a given rifle/cartridge (i.e. a standardized value) to carry out this test every time you open a new Lot# of powder, you will eventually have a nice little database of Lot-specific velocity-per-charge weight values for future comparison. Yes, this approach requires an "extra" range trip, but it's only a few loaded rounds and the velocity data will allow setting up a charge weight test in a more informed and safe manner.

A common alternative to the focused approached outlined above is simply to always start at a sufficiently low charge weight in the initial charge weight testing, whether using a value from a reloading manual, QuickLoad estimates, or similar. If different manuals provide noticeably different starting charge weight values, my feeling is that going with the more conservative choice of which set of values to use is never a "wrong" way to go. If the more conservative starting charge weight ends up being far below the intended charge weight, so what? It's a few extra loaded rounds, which in my opinion is well worth it for the information gained when before doing the testing all you really had was a black box due to the unknown burn rate of the new powder Lot#.

As long as you start with a sufficiently low/conservative charge weight, the more important consideration using the second approach becomes the upper end of the charge weight range. In other words, how wide does the charge weight test window need to be? How high do you actually need to go? If the new Lot# of powder is faster than the previous Lot# and you go too high, you will be limited to using fairly gross observational data to decide whether some of the charge weights at the top end of the window are too hot and should not be fired. For example, many use hard bolt lifts or pressure signs on the brass as indicators. Unfortunately, they can work, but neither of those are really reliable indicators until pressures are already well above MAX. If you know the velocity of a previous tuned load using the same powder, it should not be too difficult to make an estimate of when it's time to stop going any higher. However, the first time out with a given powder making that decision may be a little more difficult. As always, erring on the side of caution at the upper end is the best approach.
 
Can U quantify ?
In 308 Win I have had to adjust the load of Varget by up to 1.2gr difference to maintain the same velocity. For example, old lot Varget was 45.5gr, new lot of Varget is 46.7gr.

that is such a large shift that it can almost be considered a different type of powder between lots (such as difference between VV N140 and N150.
 
I read everyone using velocity as the common denominator. So if I can match the similar velocity of the new Varget to the old Varget load, the accuracy should be similar for that rifle?
 
I read everyone using velocity as the common denominator. So if I can match the similar velocity of the new Varget to the old Varget load, the accuracy should be similar for that rifle?
That worked for me, didn't even have to change elevation on my scope for 600 yards.. Went from 31.9 grains (2956 fps) to 32.5 grains (2950 fps).
 
I read everyone using velocity as the common denominator. So if I can match the similar velocity of the new Varget to the old Varget load, the accuracy should be similar for that rifle?
As Pat suggested, matching velocity usually works very well. It is certainly a good place to start. The caveat is that if the velocity for a given charge weight (i.e. burn rate) of one Lot# of Varget is markedly different than the next, matching the velocity by adjusting charge weight may only get you close. That is because acceleration (rather than muzzle velocity) is the more important determinant for barrel occupancy time and at what point during the barrel harmonic cycle the bullet exits the bore. However, most of us do not have the capability to actually measure bullet acceleration. The best we can usually do is to make predictions using reloading software such as QuickLoad. On the other hand, velocity is easy to measure, so that's the readout most of us use. Generally, if you match the velocity of the previous Lot# of powder, the load ought to be close, if not spot on what it was with the previous Lot#. If the charge weight of the new Lot# of powder required to reproduce the velocity with the previous Lot# of powder is markedly different, you might need to do a little more charge weight optimization to either side of the charge weight that reproduced the previous velocity for you. But matching the velocity will usually get you very close.
 
I just checked and the max load according to Sierra is 43.0 I would err on the side of caution and do a load workup from 42.0 up in .1 gn increments over the chrono looking for pressure signs and try match the velocity pf the other lot
 
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