New 728VT milling machine.....very unhappy

[55fairlane]

2 weeks ago we set a 728VT milling machine in my garage, spent this weekend installing the power feed, traming in the vise, ect.....
Got around to firing the machine up and making chips....went thru the square up the blocks routine, will not square up (in Y ) I tried everything (including getting my text book out from when I served my apprenticeship) finally bolt a 2-4-6 to the table & in the vise....using Z run an indicator up & down the blocks......0055 in 3 inches, the head in nodding at me, crap, call PM.....got thru the details with them, new Kurt vise, new Lyndex collets, used interapid indicator, and started my apprenticeship in 1986....been running machines since then.....3 hours on the phone, try this, they that, thy this.....short answer I get to pull the column loose & shim it....$5722.16 for new machine & I get the privilege of fixing it.....feeling very cheated!
Please cheer me up or offer to fix my machine for me

 

[LVLAaron]

Funny you mention Lyndex. It's a brand I'd never heard of until earlier today. I needed an odd collet and paid for the mystery part you get from McMaster... Ended up with a Lyndex... It's very nice!

Anyway... The PM benchtop/pillar mills seem to fall short of what we expect from PM (Even the "high precision" Taiwanese models.)

I have an 833TV and it's a solid/heavy machine, but the gibs are trash, and that's a common thing. They aren't really tapered correctly. I don't have the know-how to scrape them.


Anyway, spend some time over on https://www.hobby-machinist.com/ - Lots of good threads there on the PM mills and correcting their issues. It seems like most people end up bedding the base of the pillar.

 

[Toolbreaker]

I'm not familiar with your particular machine, but I read the thread below just a couple days ago regarding a knee mill with a similar problem. Post #5 has some good info. There may be something in there that would apply to yours?

How to true Nod on this mill?

How to nod this mill? No adjustment screws on the other side and nothing on top. Looks like small screws for the jib but I don't see anything else . Any info? Because it's out a good .006

www.practicalmachinist.com

 

[55fairlane]

Funny you mention Lyndex. It's a brand I'd never heard of until earlier today. I needed an odd collet and paid for the mystery part you get from McMaster... Ended up with a Lyndex... It's very nice!

Anyway... The PM benchtop/pillar mills seem to fall short of what we expect from PM (Even the "high precision" Taiwanese models.)

I have an 833TV and it's a solid/heavy machine, but the gibs are trash, and that's a common thing. They aren't really tapered correctly. I don't have the know-how to scrape them.


Anyway, spend some time over on https://www.hobby-machinist.com/ - Lots of good threads there on the PM mills and correcting their issues. It seems like most people end up bedding the base of the pillar.

@LVLAaron I'm on hobby-machine , in fact I have commented in threads you also have commented in.
I started a thread there.
"Falls short" is putting it mildly, I feel completely lied to & ripped off. Mike in service is offering to make it right with me, but I am still stuck fixing the machine myself. This is why I bought a new machine and not try to fix an older machine I had.
Scraping in a surface isn't hard, just time consuming, grab your gibs, make the 6 hour drive up to see me and I will scrape your gibs in.

How does one bed to pillar? Got a link ?

Aaron

 

[55fairlane]

Funny you mention Lyndex. It's a brand I'd never heard of until earlier today. I needed an odd collet and paid for the mystery part you get from McMaster... Ended up with a Lyndex... It's very nice!

Anyway... The PM benchtop/pillar mills seem to fall short of what we expect from PM (Even the "high precision" Taiwanese models.)

I have an 833TV and it's a solid/heavy machine, but the gibs are trash, and that's a common thing. They aren't really tapered correctly. I don't have the know-how to scrape them.


Anyway, spend some time over on https://www.hobby-machinist.com/ - Lots of good threads there on the PM mills and correcting their issues. It seems like most people end up bedding the base of the pillar.

Lyndex collets are as good as Hardinge or South Bend.......these collets are way better then any advertised "percision" Chinese set.....

 

[LVLAaron]

Stefan Gotteswinter has the process detailed.... but it's buried in one of his videos. I'll see if I can find it...

The basic steps are: Loosen the pillar and shim it. Fill the gap you just created with epoxy... let it cure, torque it down.

 

[LVLAaron]

 

[hogpatrol]

I recommended a PM lathe to a newbie, a supposedly better Taiwan unit. Shipped with wrong bases, wrong tool posts, wrong collets, and a few other mistakes I'm trying to forget. A year and a half later, he's still cursing me. Next machine was a Grizzly Bridgeport knock off. Not as bad but still had some issues. Never again with PM. Grizzly? I bet it won't be 100% either. YMMV.

 

[xr650rRider]

Luckily it's nodding toward you. Simply loosen and add shims, won't take much. Even if they had it perfect, most buyers are stripping them down and doing body work, cnc retrofits and they lose the shims. We're buying Asian machines to save money, that means you usually have work to do. If not, your 1 in a million or don't know any better and use it as is.

**** edit ******
Your schematic shows the bolts for the column coming up from below so it's got to be up off the base to get to them. Mine are easily accessible from the top, so you do have more to complain about.

 

[Judd]

I’ve been looking for over a year for a good clean manual mill. There is a ton of old junk out there, I’ll call projects. I don’t want a project and I almost have talked myself into just ordering a new one. Y’all aren’t giving me a warm fuzzy.

Truth is, a mill/drill would likely do 95% of what I need one for and I lately have been thinking that might be the way to go. Very much in that paralysis via analysis stage or place right now.

Thanks for posting 55 and I hope you get it fixed.

 

[ChristianSilver]

I stripped my PM728VT to the barebones when I converted to CNC, I ran it a few weeks manually. Never really did anything with to know the state of the machine. It absolutely cuts true and has been a pleasure after the conversion.
Hope you get it dialed in, should be a rather simple shim check shim task.
PM has always been my go to…

 

[LVLAaron]

I’ve been looking for over a year for a good clean manual mill. There is a ton of old junk out there, I’ll call projects. I don’t want a project and I almost have talked myself into just ordering a new one. Y’all aren’t giving me a warm fuzzy.

Truth is, a mill/drill would likely do 95% of what I need one for and I lately have been thinking that might be the way to go. Very much in that paralysis via analysis stage or place right now.

Thanks for posting 55 and I hope you get it fixed.

FWIW: Gordy quit using mills and uses a grizzly mill/drill. For stock work it's more than enough.

 

[Dimner]

Pardon for the noob question, but isn't the 728VT a mill/drill?

 

[WSnyder]

Pardon for the noob question, but isn't the 728VT a mill/drill?

They bill it as a “milling machine”. Not sure what exactly designates a mill/drill vs just a mill. I’ve only owned full sized mills. Looking at what they say about it I’d be disappointed too.

THIS MACHINE IS A STEP ABOVE ANYTHING CURRENTLY ON THE MARKET!

• Ultra High Quality Milling Machine, Made to Exacting Standards. Nothing Else Compares To The Quality Level Of This Mill. If You Want The Best, This Is It. This machine is 100% Made in Taiwan. It Costs More, But You Get More. Much More. The Highest Level of Quality and Precision in a Bench Top Mill Available Anywhere.

 

[Judd]

Pardon for the noob question, but isn't the 728VT a mill/drill?

It is…I didn’t look at the exact model until now to know that though. Funny after looking, they bill it as “Ultra Precision”…I guess after you shim it

Mill/drill doesn’t have a knee is what I thought designates the difference.

 

[55fairlane]

Thank you !!

 

[55fairlane]

Pardon for the noob question, but isn't the 728VT a mill/drill?

It is a small light duty milling machine.

 

[hoz53]

It is a small light duty milling machine.

geezo Fairlane— with H&W machine almost next door to you, why didnt you go over there and get a rebuilt Bridgeport for just a little more $. You know a knee mill beats one of the chicom column mills anyday. ive got a jet rebadged rongfu i purchased in my younger dumber days. Like aaron says its good for wood stock work — I have a PM and a grizz lathe. One reason i bought them was parts availability. Thats not true anymore- ya got me thinking— mabie i should get that 56 model SB 13 running instead of selling it off. Dont know what ill do if i need lathe parts but with H&W this close with all the bridgeport parts i could ever need there is no question what my next mill will be.

 

[shortgrass]

geezo Fairlane— with H&W machine almost next door to you, why didnt you go over there and get a rebuilt Bridgeport for just a little more $. You know a knee mill beats one of the chicom column mills anyday. ive got a jet rebadged rongfu i purchased in my younger dumber days. Like aaron says its good for wood stock work — I have a PM and a grizz lathe. One reason i bought them was parts availability. Thats not true anymore- ya got me thinking— mabie i should get that 56 model SB 13 running instead of selling it off. Dont know what ill do if i need lathe parts but with H&W this close with all the bridgeport parts i could ever need there is no question what my next mill will be.

hoz53, when I need a part to repair my ancient John Steptoe shaper, I MADE IT!

 

[LVLAaron]

H&W machine

Oh man... They have a 10EE lathe for 5k